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Post by gervaise21 on Nov 8, 2024 14:19:45 GMT
Also they don’t steal. Because stealing is bad. And they are a merry group of people, who just like adventures. Remember how Isabella stole the tome of Koslun and inadvertently brought the Arishok to Kirkwall, because both groups were shipwrecked there? Then she could run off with it and not come back, leaving us to carry the can. How many Bharv's does that one deserve eh? Or the fact that in DG's comic series it is revealed that when she "liberated" those slaves on her ship she didn't actually free them but chucked them overboard so she wouldn't be caught with them (because transporting slaves is a capital offence down south). I would imagine you would need several dozen Bharv's to recompense for that one (sarcasm because doing a few push ups would never excuse that). What was even more stupid than doing a Bharv for misgendering was Bellara doing it for eating the last snack on the plate because it was someone else's favourite. I wish they had given that to Rook and allowed the option to say: "It's my favourite too, so I'm a selfish bitch. What of it?" No doubt, though, had they done so, Rook would be doing a Bharv too. Luckily it probably took too much effort to do the animation for all those different Rooks, so they went with Bellara instead.
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Post by Syv on Nov 8, 2024 14:21:53 GMT
Guys I need help from some lore experts. What would you say are the biggest lore crimes in this game and why? The Veil Jumpers - Apart from it being a really stupid idea to give them a name so similar to Rook's faction (probably wasn't the case before they changed the name of the game) I'm still not clear how or why this group came into being, how long they had been knocking around in the Arlathan area, etc. I thought they might turn out to be really on Solas' team which would have been a nice twist and would explain where they disappeared to. However, the Missing had already knocked that one on the head (unless they were feigning ignorance of him back then), so they just became a random group with no real back story to explain their existence other than they were researching anomalies in Arlathan Forest. Back in DA2 we were told the Dalish didn't go anywhere near Tevinter and that included Arlathan Forest but the writers obviously forgot that. May be I've missed something. Here is one example of why this game feels sometime like it was written by some activists. It is purposely specified that this group is mostly elven but absolutely welcome everyone willing to help. Mages from Tevinter, Qunari, former crows, humans, dwarfs if there are, no matter who you are. It doesn't matter where you come from, your background, if you are just willing to help. That's all their require apparently. It's beautiful, this message of tolerance, the power of friendship that can overcome anything, beyond the fact that the Dalishs are everywhere mistreated and source of distrust, threatened if not enslaved as elves, their former country destroyed by humans centuries ago, their people scattered everywhere. It's apparently over, Dalishs and humans love each other. Now let's get real, let's think about it one minute. Why would the Dalishs researching for anomalies in Arlathan be willing to share their knowledge, would be willing to share elven artifacts they find and study, part of their history, part of their heritage, source of power with other races, with strangers you don't know anything about, especially humans ? Artifacts likely containing dangerous secrets, sensitive information that could allow them to regain greatness, that you could only be careful to reveal. The same artifacts that could be very dangerous to fall into the hands of Tevinter or other interested people for example. This threat of the veil coming from nowhere isn't enough to explain. this massive recruitment. Seeing so many humans among them is quite pitiful. Why do they suddenly feel the need to rely on outsiders from everywhere in Thedas, while in previous games they always only relied on themself, always taking care of their own matter themself, no matter the cost. What changed ? Because before there were real writers, a real world building ? Why anyone that doesn't belong to the elven people would be just willing to help by the way ? More than that, how humans, Qunari, and dwarfs could help them in any relevant way ? Do they have any knowledge of ancient elven history, Arlathan history, ancient elven language ? What interest could these random outsiders have in common with Dalishs in reseaching for anomalies in Arlathan ? Why would they care about Arlathan above all ? Beyond stealing artifacts, plundering their elven knowledge, spying on their secrets and passing them on to the antagonist and powerful mages of Tevinter, or the spies of the Ben-Asrath as well. What good would it brings to the dalishs who created the veil jumpers to have strangers in their group ? Don't you have the slightest sense of self-preservation for your people ? Nope, no need. Once again the power of friendship and tolerance solve all problems, it won't happen, ask no questions, stop thinking, just consume and shut up. The Dalishs have all the reasons to have outsiders among the veiljumpers. Because we don't want bigots in our game, we don't want any group that can feel having a strong identity without any diversity, except the bad guys.
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Post by grallon on Nov 8, 2024 15:14:57 GMT
Nope, no need. Once again the power of friendship and tolerance solve all problems, it won't happen, ask no questions, stop thinking, just consume and shut up. I'd rather have a fractious crew of thinking, opiniated misfits by my side instead of a legion of braindead drones all parroting the same lines. Oh wait...
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Post by Liepsnele on Nov 8, 2024 15:34:00 GMT
Did they ever say what happened to Arishok Sten because I cannot believe he turned into one of those caricatures encountered in DAV. There is a codex very early in Treviso that explains the Antaam broke away from the Qun and almost killed Arishok, who is still loyal to the Qun. It's also mentioned the Arishok fought the Fifth Blight in Ferelden, making him Sten from DAO no matter his actual possible fate in the game. Haven't seen Sten referenced since but I doubt he will appear in the game because politics don't seem to matter.
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Post by gervaise21 on Nov 8, 2024 15:47:17 GMT
Did they ever say what happened to Arishok Sten because I cannot believe he turned into one of those caricatures encountered in DAV. There is a codex very early in Treviso that explains the Antaam broke away from the Qun and almost killed Arishok, who is still loyal to the Qun. It's also mentioned the Arishok fought the Fifth Blight in Ferelden, making him Sten from DAO no matter his actual possible fate in the game. Haven't seen Sten referenced since but I doubt he will appear in the game because politics don't seem to matter. Oh that is reassuring. At least they didn't totally destroy Sten's character. The mutineers must have injured him really badly. It still doesn't explain why they didn't immediately send out the Ben'Hassrath to take out the leaders and bring the others back under control, or why Par Vollen never seem to get involved. However, once the gods returned, perhaps they had problems of their own to deal with on Par Vollen. Really disappointed that we'll never find out what the pyramids there were for. I was hoping there might be some insight from Bellara with her fixation on triangles. Still, if at some point in the future a team of decent writers resurrects the franchise, perhaps they'll deal with it.
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Post by gervaise21 on Nov 8, 2024 15:50:10 GMT
Because we don't want bigots in our game, we don't want any group that can feel having a strong identity without any diversity, except the bad guys. Have you seen the pop up yet where it says you have reassured Taash that multi-culturism is a good thing? LMAO at that one, particularly if Rook is a Dalish.
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Post by ellanathehamster on Nov 8, 2024 15:53:29 GMT
The more I reflect on the DAV, the more sad and frustrated I become. While I really enjoy almost all of main storyline, it's upsetting to see how weak of a cast companions are. All highlights of the game for me come from characters of previous games (except Isabella). Weekes mentioned that this cast is the most diverse yet. At the same time I only see superficial diversity, that doesn't go beyond race or appearance. Every one of them is a good guy. You can only be friend with one another. Every confrontation is resolved almost right away. Compare them to Vivienne, Bull, Cole, Solas. Blackwall, who I found the most boring character in DAI, is above half of companions in DAV.
I watched a number of reviews, almost all of them say they loved talking to Solas and third act. So we see that the mastery of writing is still there. So why does almost every companion sucks ass? Your party is the core of each game.
It's especially jarring when you see side to side comparison with BG3.
But also look how Solas vs Elganan exchange is written:
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Post by Liepsnele on Nov 8, 2024 15:54:32 GMT
Mark Darrah, former executive producer for Bioware posts interesting videos on his channel about game development. He recently made one about leading from fear:
He doesn't mention any names but it sounds like Bioware is still mismanaged and managers only want yes-men around. I think we'll keep getting treasures like Andromeda and the Veilguard in the future, unless EA tells them to make live service game again. I could see it happening, they wanted Inquisition to be an MMO and it almost happened for Veilguard too, and Darrah often mentions the money making potential executives are focused on.
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Post by fenalaslavellan on Nov 8, 2024 16:08:17 GMT
I don't think I posted this here, but right on the first day of playing Veilguard I couldn't stop laughing at the gift Varric gave to Rook. A mirror that "will always show the face of a hero that will win/make it". Sorry but this is like some self-help kind of line you'd find in those books.
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Post by Envisionary on Nov 8, 2024 16:12:14 GMT
I was told that they didn't want to invalidate past choices. Why, then, does Harding mention Sera, Blackwall, and Cole as members of the Inquisition despite being able to reject them?
(3:15)
She also mentions that the Inquisition hired "Ben-Hassrath" alongside the Left Hand of the Divine, which seems to imply Bull was also recruited.
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Post by necrowaif on Nov 8, 2024 16:21:04 GMT
I was thinking about this when watching that now slightly infamous "Isabela misgenders Taash" scene. During the conversation, Isabela mentions that Kirkwall "taught her about family - if it matters to you, it matters to me."
The thing is, it's entirely possible to not recruit Isabela in Dragon Age 2, to have her abandon you at the end of Act 2 or for Hawke to turn her over to the qunari. How exactly would any of these outcomes be conducive to a lesson about learning the importance of "family"?
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Post by wright1978 on Nov 8, 2024 17:10:41 GMT
I was told that they didn't want to invalidate past choices. Why, then, does Harding mention Sera, Blackwall, and Cole as members of the Inquisition despite being able to reject them?
(3:15)
She also mentions that the Inquisition hired "Ben-Hassrath" alongside the Left Hand of the Divine, which seems to imply Bull was also recruited. That’s pretty despicable
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Post by cockyrustler on Nov 8, 2024 17:16:02 GMT
The more I reflect on the DAV, the more sad and frustrated I become. While I really enjoy almost all of main storyline, it's upsetting to see how weak of a cast companions are. All highlights of the game for me come from characters of previous games (except Isabella). Weekes mentioned that this cast is the most diverse yet. At the same time I only see superficial diversity, that doesn't go beyond race or appearance. Every one of them is a good guy. You can only be friend with one another. Every confrontation is resolved almost right away. Compare them to Vivienne, Bull, Cole, Solas. Blackwall, who I found the most boring character in DAI, is above half of companions in DAV. I watched a number of reviews, almost all of them say they loved talking to Solas and third act. So we see that the mastery of writing is still there. So why does almost every companion sucks ass? Your party is the core of each game. It's especially jarring when you see side to side comparison with BG3. But also look how Solas vs Elganan exchange is written: You don't even need to look at other games. I've recently replayed BG II and contrast is jarring. Can you imagine the reaction of their leads if one of the writers wanted toput character like Edwin in their game ( powerhungry asshole mysognist) Companions constantly bicker, threaten, mock, take jabs at one another. Even the paladin paragons like Keldorn have real flaws and darker side to them.
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Post by Ieldra on Nov 8, 2024 17:22:59 GMT
Because we don't want bigots in our game, we don't want any group that can feel having a strong identity without any diversity, except the bad guys. Have you seen the pop up yet where it says you have reassured Taash that multi-culturism is a good thing? LMAO at that one, particularly if Rook is a Dalish. That's....as a commenter has put it...a prime example of the tyranny of the author. They don't let us make choices based on our reasoning, no, they must prescribe an interpretation - which had me almost screaming "No that's not what I was saying. I just found it interesting".
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Post by witchcocktor on Nov 8, 2024 17:27:59 GMT
This might be more of a divisive, unpopular criticism even among people who are critical, but I couldn't help but feel like ALL companion quests having a big bad boss at the end was kind of unneeded. It became very game-y in the end, instead of actually exploring the companions and the issues and themes they were dealing with. It's fine for some characters to have companion quests more strictly tied to the combat and gameplay aspect instead of just storytelling, but did it really need to be ALL of the companion quests following the same pattern?
I think having the companion quests be more interactive and having more gameplay is definitely something that probably excites most players though, but I genuinely just kind of got tired by them in the end, because I'm less interested in fighting cartoon villains and much more excited in exploring those characters. Not that those two are mutually exclusive!!! But in terms of Veilguard's approach, it kind of got in the way of immersion for me. Though it just genuinely could be that I didn't vibe with most of the companions, and would've loved this approach if I just enjoyed them more. Can't say.
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Free me now, I'm not answering questions, blah blah blah. Don't you know who I am?
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Post by andorvex on Nov 8, 2024 17:34:30 GMT
I was thinking about this when watching that now slightly infamous "Isabela misgenders Taash" scene. During the conversation, Isabela mentions that Kirkwall "taught her about family - if it matters to you, it matters to me." The thing is, it's entirely possible to not recruit Isabela in Dragon Age 2, to have her abandon you at the end of Act 2 or for Hawke to turn her over to the qunari. How exactly would any of these outcomes be conducive to a lesson about learning the importance of "family"? It seems like we now went into nitpicking territory, but what can I say this game deserves it
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Post by sentinel87 on Nov 8, 2024 17:41:51 GMT
There is a codex very early in Treviso that explains the Antaam broke away from the Qun and almost killed Arishok, who is still loyal to the Qun. It's also mentioned the Arishok fought the Fifth Blight in Ferelden, making him Sten from DAO no matter his actual possible fate in the game. Haven't seen Sten referenced since but I doubt he will appear in the game because politics don't seem to matter.
This was another little annoyance of mine I came across. In my cannon worldstate I left Sten locked up.
I get the feeling someone at Bioware liked Sten or wanted to throw a bone to older fans but since there is no worldstate inport they rolled the dice with the, probably correct, fact that most will have recruited him.
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Post by journey95 on Nov 8, 2024 17:46:16 GMT
Its been over a week since release and EA hasn't said anything about it passing 1+ million sales. I think its looking more and more likely that this game flopped on consoles (on steam it was already doing badly, the player count per day has dropped to 40k)
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Post by necrowaif on Nov 8, 2024 17:53:07 GMT
I was thinking about this when watching that now slightly infamous "Isabela misgenders Taash" scene. During the conversation, Isabela mentions that Kirkwall "taught her about family - if it matters to you, it matters to me." The thing is, it's entirely possible to not recruit Isabela in Dragon Age 2, to have her abandon you at the end of Act 2 or for Hawke to turn her over to the qunari. How exactly would any of these outcomes be conducive to a lesson about learning the importance of "family"? It seems like we now went into nitpicking territory, but what can I say this game deserves it Am I nitpicking, or am I making a legitimate complaint about how the total lack of imported decisions (save three) leads to a cameo by Isabela that feels entirely generic?
There is a codex very early in Treviso that explains the Antaam broke away from the Qun and almost killed Arishok, who is still loyal to the Qun.
That brings me to another issue.
Sten in DAO: Qunari are most dangerous because we are thinking men and not an unthinking force.
Veilguard Codex on Warlords of the Antaam: First, these kithshoks feared that their army might turn upon them as they turned upon the Arishok, so they drive their soldiers through fear; and second, there are very few kind and thoughtful Antaam.
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