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Post by grallon on Oct 10, 2024 21:07:10 GMT
... Like.... from 1 game to the next, they cant even keep their own lore in check... How do you do this? Its baffling.. At this point Veilguard is not DA4 to me anymore, its just some bad fan fiction. We will never get a real Dragon Age 4. 'Rangs of Powah' also had a recognizable name slapped on it - yet it had nothing to do with Tolkien. Same thought process I suppose.
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Post by Iakus on Oct 10, 2024 21:11:39 GMT
Just realized Solas contradicts his own words in Inquisition, 30 minutes into Veilguard. Thanks to Nuhre's latest video. So in Inquisition Solas talks about blood magic and explains that the Chantry and Tevinter look at it with superstition, but in the end blood magic is not evil, its just magic and its not about the type of magic, its about how you use it. In the beggining of Veilguard Solas says with a passion: I abhor the use of blood magic. Like.... from 1 game to the next, they cant even keep their own lore in check... How do you do this? Its baffling.. At this point Veilguard is not DA4 to me anymore, its just some bad fan fiction. We will never get a real Dragon Age 4. Yup: How many men have you killed while fighting for the Inquisition? How many more will you kill out of necessity? And if blood magic could help you? Well, it matters little to me. I do not use it, but I do not think it evil.
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Post by Reznore on Oct 10, 2024 21:13:18 GMT
Solas contradicts himself almost every time he talks. Not sure if bug or feature.
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Post by Envisionary on Oct 10, 2024 22:02:40 GMT
... Like.... from 1 game to the next, they cant even keep their own lore in check... How do you do this? Its baffling.. At this point Veilguard is not DA4 to me anymore, its just some bad fan fiction. We will never get a real Dragon Age 4. 'Rangs of Powah' gee I wonder what the intentions are here
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Post by Envisionary on Oct 10, 2024 22:06:52 GMT
Just realized Solas contradicts his own words in Inquisition, 30 minutes into Veilguard. Thanks to Nuhre's latest video. So in Inquisition Solas talks about blood magic and explains that the Chantry and Tevinter look at it with superstition, but in the end blood magic is not evil, its just magic and its not about the type of magic, its about how you use it. In the beggining of Veilguard Solas says with a passion: I abhor the use of blood magic. Like.... from 1 game to the next, they cant even keep their own lore in check... How do you do this? Its baffling.. At this point Veilguard is not DA4 to me anymore, its just some bad fan fiction. We will never get a real Dragon Age 4. I said the same thing when that was revealed and someone promptly replied that I don't know Solas better than Weekes.
Sure, probably not, but I can notice a discrepancy.
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Post by Guardian on Oct 10, 2024 22:13:04 GMT
Just realized Solas contradicts his own words in Inquisition, 30 minutes into Veilguard. Thanks to Nuhre's latest video. So in Inquisition Solas talks about blood magic and explains that the Chantry and Tevinter look at it with superstition, but in the end blood magic is not evil, its just magic and its not about the type of magic, its about how you use it. In the beggining of Veilguard Solas says with a passion: I abhor the use of blood magic. Like.... from 1 game to the next, they cant even keep their own lore in check... How do you do this? Its baffling.. At this point Veilguard is not DA4 to me anymore, its just some bad fan fiction. We will never get a real Dragon Age 4. Yup: How many men have you killed while fighting for the Inquisition? How many more will you kill out of necessity? And if blood magic could help you? Well, it matters little to me. I do not use it, but I do not think it evil. This just makes me feel like they're trying to paint Solas as a "hero" in Veilguard. Like....getting the chance to kill him will not even be there for those that want to. Or, if it is, this is how the Inquisitor will die - they'll take the hit for Solas. Or, if your Inquisitor was looking to kill him, perhaps they've got it set up that Rook will see Solas at least as someone to not kill outright. Remember - "Blood Magic" is for villains and evil casters. Solas apparently abhors Blood Magic, meaning he "walks the path of a hero". I could be reading too much into this, but...the fact that the Inquisitor is being pulled in, and is already default female (and please someone correct me if they're an elf or not), but this is really starting to look like the whole reason for these "defaults" is because this is all about Solas, (if romanced) the Inquisitor, and saving Thedas from the corrupt Elven Gods. Either way, I really feel like they want Solas to be seen as a hero, sort of like what they were trying to do with Cerberus in ME 2.
Again, I could be reading too much into this. But Hawke and the Hero of Ferelden seem like afterthoughts now. I really feel like the Inquisitor is someone's really bad self-insert, which is why I felt they were so dull and boring.
If (and this is a big IF, mind you) I'm right in this, then it's another example of modern day BioWare not trusting the player to make choices on how to RP the way the player wants, as opposed to being forced and railroaded to stay on the track BioWare wants them to go down. God, I really hope I'm just reading too much into it.
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Post by grallon on Oct 10, 2024 22:24:09 GMT
gee I wonder what the intentions are here Pure contempt.
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Post by Envisionary on Oct 10, 2024 22:30:41 GMT
gee I wonder what the intentions are here Pure contempt. Yeah, it's called racism.
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Post by grallon on Oct 10, 2024 23:31:18 GMT
Yeah, it's called racism. A TV show is a race now?
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Post by blah23 on Oct 10, 2024 23:43:21 GMT
Yeah, it's called racism. A TV show is a race now? A TV show based on a book written by a white man that is based on Medieval European folklore. The showrunners themselves are racists by disrespecting the lore and setting it based on. Middle Earth is a white European setting, adding POC characters breaks both the lore and immersion. The show feels like modern day Europe rather than Medieval one. The Witcher TV show has this problem as well.
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Post by Envisionary on Oct 10, 2024 23:43:52 GMT
Yeah, it's called racism. A TV show is a race now? Feigning ignorance.
Rings of Power hired black actors.
"Woke" might have some mild plausible deniability, but "Rangs of Powah" flies way too close to the sun to not be obvious.
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Post by grallon on Oct 10, 2024 23:52:05 GMT
A TV show based on a book written by a white man that is based on Medieval European folklore. The showrunners themselves are racists by disrespecting the lore and setting it based on. Middle Earth is a white European setting, adding POC characters breaks both the lore and immersion. The show feels like modern day Europe rather than Medieval one. The Witcher TV show has this problem as well. As I was saying, the multikulti stuff is only one aspect of the debacle; that show is a god awful mess in every respect save perhaps the cgi in season 2.
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Post by blah23 on Oct 10, 2024 23:54:13 GMT
The multikulti stuff is one thing but that show is a god awful mess in every respect, except perhaps the cgi. Why does everything needs to be inclusive even if it doesn't make sense? Well the show is written by narcissisticly ncompetent hacks that were hired because of DEI and ideology instead of merit.
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Post by grallon on Oct 11, 2024 0:06:57 GMT
Why does everything needs to be inclusive even if it doesn't make sense? Well the show is written by narcissisticly ncompetent hacks that were hired because of DEI and ideology instead of merit. Yep, part of the Cult's religion; along with girl bosses, weak men, evil white people (and that isn't racismus of course ), equality of results rather than opportunities, etc. Wokism is marxism in drags - tailor made for a generation of brainless lemmings who were indoctrinated by militant activists from K to College. They're so vapid they're ready to jump on whatever 'current thing' bandwagon that's jingled in front of their phone glazed eyes. Bah!
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Post by Envisionary on Oct 11, 2024 6:08:50 GMT
The plague of modern culture surrounding video games. We have valid complaints, then we have people who are triggered by the sight of a minority and will frantically scour Nexus mods to remove them. indeed.
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Post by helios969 on Oct 11, 2024 7:26:05 GMT
A TV show is a race now? Feigning ignorance.
Rings of Power hired black actors.
"Woke" might have some mild plausible deniability, but "Rangs of Powah" flies way too close to the sun to not be obvious.
To be honest I don't think any of that stuff matters to most people. If the storytelling had actually been good most would forgive it...maybe with a bit of eyerolling at the obviousness. I watched S1 and thought it was one of the worst shows I've ever seen (I simply couldn't muster the desire to continue watching)...and I know nothing of the pre-LOTR history. At it's best it's boring and contrived...and the big budget special effects does nothing to make it interesting. It doesn't sound like S2 improved anything. I might suggest to those people who want to place an emphasis on "inclusion" they might want to hire writers and directors with actual talent. The lack of talent in these big projects seem to be the bigger issue. I mean you could have a faithful adaptation with regards to color and gender and the like and still end up with garbage storytelling with boring characters...since apparently nowadays they feel the need to "deconstruct" original works and rewrite them completely...as if the built in audience gives a crap about some hack writer's "reimagining." At the end of the day all I care about is if you tell me a good story with interesting characters...and if it's based on an IP stay relatively faithful to it.
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Post by Kappa Neko on Oct 11, 2024 9:23:51 GMT
I might suggest to those people who want to place an emphasis on "inclusion" they might want to hire writers and directors with actual talent. The lack of talent in these big projects seem to be the bigger issue. Those two things are probably tightly related. If you are dead set on minority hires over white/straight people because of flipped racism and sexism, then you end up with people in positions they have no talent for. Obviously this was/is also the case when nobility/the rich/anybody in power let their incompetent offspring run the kingdom/company/country. If you get the job because of something other than talent, you get shit results. Getting hired for your skin color, gender or sexuality is always bad. It was bad when men were hired over women, when white people were hired over black people. And it's just as bad when it's the other way round. And so we end up with "adaptations" by people who are resentful of the source material and try to change it into their warped new utopia where everyone is pansexual or at the very least not straight. Probably because of some fucked up payback for all the horrible treatment of gay people in the past and sadly also present. But fighting bigotry with more bigotry doesn't help anybody. The DAV writers have shown plenty of contempt or at the very least dismissal of the older games and their fans too over the past few months. So I expect the game to be on The Witcher adaptation level at this point. And apparently this is also true for people who worked on those older games. That's the bizarre part. I guess the brainwashing is very effective. I remember reports about cliques and bullying at BioWare in the past. Dissenting opinions seem to have been driven away. This is no longer the BioWare I used to love. Even if you ignore all the identity politics, THE selling point of BioWare games were choices that carry over. It's what set them apart. What got people so emotionally invested. The continuity was also the reason I always loved Mass Effect more than DA. It was a continuous story with characters I grew to love like real friends. NOW we have a continuous story too with Solas, a direct sequel about an overarching major storyline and they decide that's the right moment to ditch all your past choices but 3 related to Solas. That's like Bethesda making Starfield, killing their main selling point, exploration of a handcrafted map, and then being surprised the game was badly received and lacking all the magic... I wouldn't be surprised if the lack of imported choices was time constraints development hell. I believe Starfield isn't the game they wanted to make either but couldn't pull off something better after all the time already spent on s bad concept, so they needed to release SOMETHING. But whatever the reason, the result is depressing and lacking what made their games so special in the past. I really hope it's not as bad as it looks. I'm sure some people will love DAV because it's still some sort of DA game. Just as MEA has its fans. But I personally don't think it will be a good game based on everything we've learned so far. I haven't even clicked on the more spoilery narrative stuff. The tone of their PR, the 3 choices thing and the Bellara introduction was enough to convince me this is yet another train wreck. Sorry for the rant.
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Post by Gileadan on Oct 11, 2024 9:45:02 GMT
Yeah, the writing... in every trailer I've seen so far it's pretty darn boring. Lots of the banter feels like AI generated filler. I mean, in the intro mission Rook says something like "What's the plan when we find Solas?"
Seriously? You agreed to go against one of the most powerful people in existence and you all rushed in without even a short discussion about what you are going to do when you actually get there?
"Hey Chuckles, I don't want to interrupt" (Varric of course). Ouch-cringe. Yes, this all feels very important because every character is taking it so seriously. Lol I'm just going to surprise-shouldertap the guy doing a potentially very dangerous ritual here. Anyone doing that to someone handling a hot pan in the kitchen would be rightfully considered an idiot.
Has anyone experienced any moment in any Veilguard trailer that made you think "Yes, this seems to be an exciting story / interesting character that I want to know more about"? I certainly haven't. "Hey guys some blighted elven gods are tearing the world apart, wanna come with?" - "Sure thing bro."
Who is this written for?
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Post by fistoffiori on Oct 11, 2024 10:04:02 GMT
The plague of modern culture surrounding video games. We have valid complaints, then we have people who are triggered by the sight of a minority and will frantically scour Nexus mods to remove them. indeed. Oh God, those mods. Wonder how long it'll take for some arsehole to turn Davrin white like they did with Wyll.
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Post by The Pluto Lounge on Oct 11, 2024 10:48:43 GMT
A TV show is a race now? A TV show based on a book written by a white man that is based on Medieval European folklore. The showrunners themselves are racists by disrespecting the lore and setting it based on. Middle Earth is a white European setting, adding POC characters breaks both the lore and immersion. The show feels like modern day Europe rather than Medieval one. The Witcher TV show has this problem as well. Hmmm, ok. You do know Tolkien took a lot of inspiration from Ethiopia, right? Probably not. I won't go too into detail of Rings of Power as I rather pretend the show doesn't exist. The Harfoots were described by Tolkien as brown. So any white Harfoots in the show means that "The showrunners themselves are racists by disrespecting the lore and setting it based on". Actually, all Hobbits were described as brown expect for the Fallowhides, especially Frodo who had brown hair and red cheeks. Samwise on the other hand, was specifically mentioned as brown by Tolkien. Did it bother you that Sam was cast as a white person in the Lord of Rings Trilogy? I highly doubt it. There is forced diversity in modern media, but there has also been a ton of whitewashing for decades. Frankly, I don't understand why this is a discussion for Veilguard as every single Dragon Age has had people with different skin colors.
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Post by bierkrug on Oct 11, 2024 10:57:20 GMT
There is forced diversity in modern media, but there has also been a ton of whitewashing for decades. Frankly, I don't understand why this is a discussion for Veilguard as every single Dragon Age has had people with different skin colors. Playing devil's advocate to some degree but the elves in Veilguard have been turned more human by giving them human ethnicities. I prefer the Elder Scrolls take, elves come in flavours of snow white, grey skinned & red eyed, golden & tall and cannibalistic with some occasional antlers. DA had something like this going on with Abelas and his colleagues looking somewhat more otherworldly.
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Post by emissaryoflies on Oct 11, 2024 11:13:05 GMT
Le Modern Audience, monsieur!
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Post by gervaise21 on Oct 11, 2024 11:22:02 GMT
Just realized Solas contradicts his own words in Inquisition, 30 minutes into Veilguard. Thanks to Nuhre's latest video. So in Inquisition Solas talks about blood magic and explains that the Chantry and Tevinter look at it with superstition, but in the end blood magic is not evil, its just magic and its not about the type of magic, its about how you use it. In the beggining of Veilguard Solas says with a passion: I abhor the use of blood magic. How many men have you killed while fighting for the Inquisition? How many more will you kill out of necessity? And if blood magic could help you? Well, it matters little to me. I do not use it, but I do not think it evil. Solas contradicts himself almost every time he talks. Not sure if bug or feature. In defense of the writers (I can't believe I am saying this), Solas is being entirely consistent. As Reznore says, he constantly contradicts himself because he is a master of equivocation, that is lying by omission. So he says he abhors blood magic this time round but ought to have added the qualifier "when it is used to control the mind of others", since that is actually the context in which these words are being spoken. He objects to the idea that Rook suggests that he is there through Solas' use of blood magic on his mind. Back in DAI, he said he didn't object to blood magic in principle but didn't use it himself because it interfered with his connection to the Fade. That didn't rule out him using it in the future if he didn't have to take that into consideration. So, don't be surprised if Solas should be shown to have used blood magic in the past or is willing to use it in the future. That said, since Weakes suggested they did not think it appropriate that the hero of the game should use it, perhaps they were trying to distance Solas from its use in DAV by the antagonists, particularly if they are trying to present Solas as some sort of tragic hero figure to new players.
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Post by gervaise21 on Oct 11, 2024 11:37:48 GMT
'Rangs of Powah' also had a recognizable name slapped on it - yet it had nothing to do with Tolkien. Same thought process I suppose. Not entirely the same. Since Bioware developed the world of Thedas they do have certain licence to to as they please with the lore even if it does upset the fans because it is their creation. What Amazon has done is unforgivable and not justified in any way, even if the late author's grandson did give his approval. There is nothing remotely connected with the Middle Earth that Tolkien created in the show. They have changed the entire history, plot and characters from what he wrote. There is no excuse since it is all laid out in the appendices what Tolkien intended and there are also numerous references to episodes from the 2nd Age in the Lord of the Rings itself, particularly the Fellowship of the Ring, to which Amazon do have the rights. However, I doubt the writers of the show have ever really read the books since so much seems to have been recycled from the movies when it comes to actual ideas. In fact I have pointed out on the thread connected with the show on these boards that in fact they also seem to have taken many of their ideas from Dragon Age instead of Tolkien, such as using "Knife ear" as an insult to elves, having a tree somehow connected with the longevity of the elves (see Where the Willows Wail) and the one in show actually looking like the blighted tree in DAV concept art; the arrival of the orcs seemingly causing some sort of blight in the Southlands (cow gives black milk?) having mithril suddenly be more like lyrium instead of just being especially strong, light metal; making Khazard-dum look like Valammar in DAI instead of matching the description that Gimli sings in his lament in the book, etc, etc. It doesn't even work as original generic fantasy let alone something that has the gall to attach itself to Tolkien's name and then expect us to just roll over and accept it. (At least they didn't get any money from me. If the show had been half decent I might have signed up to Amazon Prime to watch it but instead I'm now refusing to buy anything from Amazon at all) As for that "Tolkien scholar" who attempts to justify their action, he is not worthy of the title, although just because he is a "scholar" doesn't mean he loves the author's work, just knows a lot about it.
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Post by SofaJockey on Oct 11, 2024 11:48:37 GMT
Feigning ignorance.
Rings of Power hired black actors.
"Woke" might have some mild plausible deniability, but "Rangs of Powah" flies way too close to the sun to not be obvious. As this post correctly calls out the original comment, I'm leaving the thread as it is. (for now) The thread topic is skepticism over Veilguard. We're not doing 'culture wars' on the pages of BSN. Thank you.
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