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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jun 26, 2021 17:14:51 GMT
Should be noted that the Geth couldn’t leave Rannoch since all the hardware that housed them was still on the planet at the time of the war. And it’s not like the Quarians would let the Getj build a big ship to move all of themselves away. So those alternatives don’t work.
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Post by gothpunkboy89 on Jun 26, 2021 22:11:11 GMT
What proof do you have of this? Because there is 2 years of war and conflict between the start of the war and the Quarians fleeting their home system at the end of the war. To say that single example is how the entire 2 year war went is....stretching it. Your argument also raises several questions that you don't seem to have considered.
1. If the Geth gained void superiority and drove the Quarians from all their coloines back to their home world then why did the Geth not chose to leave? They had the advantage, they had the capability and they certainly had the motive to go though that relay and disappear into the void to build a new home for the Geth. One the Quarians wouldn't be able to find so easily.
2. If the Geth had such over whelming advantage and didn't want to fight the Quarians then why did they not drive them back to Rannoch, destroy their fleets and then block aid the planet. Engaging in surgical strikes against any ship building manufacturing and basically turn Rannoch into a prison planet? The Qurians would be confined to the planet's surface and unable to harm the Geth in space and on other planets. And the Geth would maintain a block aid around the planet destroying any ship that attempts to leave while leaving the Quarians to live without issue.
Two valid possible alternatives that would avoid killing any more Quarians then absolutely necessary. They were never utilized. Legion never hints that they were even tried. What we can say for sure is that were were a couple million bleached skulls of dead 1 year old Quarians killed by the Geth decorating the grounds of Rannoch and other various colonies.
We also know that during the dive into the Geth Consensus that Legion wasn't being entirely honest about events. If you had romanced Tali in ME2 and continued it in ME3 when Shepard asks why all the Quarians have masks and Legion tells you that the images are created using their memories. Shepard will state that they have seen Quarians without their mask on. Or at least one. Which Legion will respond some what lamely that it doesn't match historical records. Which is a little suspect given there would be no way for the Quarians to have radically evolved that much in 300 years. I'm not saying that Legion made everything up but if you are very selective of the history you show you can make even someone like Joseph Stalin look like a great guy. Particularly since right after Legion uploaded the Geth to prime bodies without telling Shepard.
So you are just going to claim Legion may be twisting the truth while blindly believing the Reaper’s? All the in game evidence points to the Quarians starting and continuing the war, the Geth allowing them to escape, and the Quarians then being stupid enough to attack the non hostile geth again. The Quarians had always been the instigators to the non heretics. The heretics were influenced by the Reapers. Even Tali confirms the Quarians started the war in ME1. So I don’t know why you have such a hard time accepting what multiple games have said... o right, to defend one of the worst written parts in the trilogy that contradicts not just huge swaths of the trilogy, but itself. The Catalyst was a failure in writing. To be fair the Reapers have never been in a position to need to lie to you. You can claim the Reapers are many many things but liars are not one of them. Also you can agree with someone's conclusion but disagree with their actions. The Marvel anti hero The Punisher is literally this concept incarnate. As his logic is very sound about corruption and crime but he goes around killing people without mercy or hesitation. You are not supposed to like or agree with his methods and anyone who does completely misses the point of him.
The only evidence we have is that the Quarians started the war. An act they openly admit to and the Geth are justified by acting in self defense initially. But at what point do you move from being the defender to the attacker? How many children do the Geth have to kill before they are no longer defending themselves from full grown adults who choose to attack them and are simply slaughtering children who never made the choice? How many hospitals full of the sick and wounded who are no longer a threat can be destroyed before the Geth are no longer qualify for self defense?
Literally all the information we have is the start and the final outcome were the Geth forcibly drove the Qurians away form their home world and into the void of space. Only sparing them because they were unsure of the ramification of total genocide. And that is telling about how the Geth operated. They didn't even think about themselves leaving the Perseus Veil. They could have left but they didn't. They stayed and fought and fought and fought taking the Quarian's territory one city at a time. And as the Quarians fought to keep their territory the Geth kept coming killing men, women and children of all ages.
Lets put this in a real world hypothetical. Lets say tomorrow Canada invades New York State. The US military responds and pushes Canada out of New York. Then the USA invades Quebec. Then Newfoundland. Then Ontario. Every territory the US claims they kill every Canadian they find. Every step of the way Canada is fighting back against the USA as they take one territory after the other. Before the final mass of Canadians are driven onto ships and set course for Russia. With the USA now in full control of all territories in Canada and every Canadian not on the ship dead they stop their attack.
Was the USA acting in self defense the entire time? Why would any Canadians fight back against the US Military if they were only acting in self defense by invading and taking over every territory in Canada killing every Canadian they came across?
Because that is basically what happened in the Morning War. Legion directly tells you there were Quarians who were against the fighting and actively tried to protect the Geth. Yet by the ending of the Morning War the only Quarians in the galaxy that were still alive were either on the ships fleeing the system or already outside of the system. If the Geth truly didn't want to fight the Quarians then there should have been a few that were left alive. There should be records of even a small colony living peacefully with the Geth. Even if their population wasn't able to handle long term genetic stability there should still be records of their existence. The only thing of the Quarians left in the Veil after the Morning War was empty buildings and corpses rotting were they fell. Because again and I can't stress this enough to reduce the Quarian population down to 24 million from 7 billion assuming they have similar age demographics as the real world Earth. They would have to kill everyone over the age of 15. And then kill an additional 1,000,000,000 children ages 0-14 to achieve that reduction in population to reach 24,000,000.
You can claim it started in self defense. But they the end of the war the self defense argument doesn't hold water. The death rate is to high to quickly. The number of non combatants killed by the Geth is to high. You can not kill over 1 billion children and claim self defense.
If you have any proof from the game, books or comics that shows the events of the Morning War between the starts and the end please share your link. Because all the information we have is about the start and the end. And there is 2 years of conflict between the two.
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Post by gothpunkboy89 on Jun 26, 2021 22:12:41 GMT
Should be noted that the Geth couldn’t leave Rannoch since all the hardware that housed them was still on the planet at the time of the war. And it’s not like the Quarians would let the Getj build a big ship to move all of themselves away. So those alternatives don’t work. Building servers is not hard to do. Capturing and holding a few planets while they build said ships or refit existing ships is more then possible.
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Post by Spectr61 on Jun 26, 2021 23:16:54 GMT
I'm also playing Stellaris right now, not Mass Effect. I just come here to bitch, moan, and complain like everyone else. Chris L'etoile's absence was keenly felt, yeah. Pathfinder: Kingmaker for me. Then XCom 2 with a bunch of Mass Effect reskins. If I'm gonna fight off an alien invasion while being called "Commander" I'm gonna do it without Starbrat or the Giant Magic Wand of Color Spray. This. As I have said, many times, in many posts, for me the beginning of the slippery slope Biower got on, and is still on, is when they let Chris L’Etoile go. Chris leaves and Mac Walters is still cockroaching around. That alone explains much.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jun 26, 2021 23:49:24 GMT
Should be noted that the Geth couldn’t leave Rannoch since all the hardware that housed them was still on the planet at the time of the war. And it’s not like the Quarians would let the Getj build a big ship to move all of themselves away. So those alternatives don’t work. Building servers is not hard to do. Capturing and holding a few planets while they build said ships or refit existing ships is more then possible. Building servers may not be hard to do. Building servers while under constant attack from your creators that saw you as a mistake that need to e exterminated however is difficult to do.
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Post by Iakus on Jun 27, 2021 4:44:26 GMT
Building servers is not hard to do. Capturing and holding a few planets while they build said ships or refit existing ships is more then possible. Building servers may not be hard to do. Building servers while under constant attack from your creators that saw you as a mistake that need to e exterminated however is difficult to do. Except they haven't been. THe Migrant Fleet only made a concerted effort to wip eout the geth within the last few months. Nothing but scout ships had passed the Perseus Veil in three hundred years.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jun 27, 2021 4:59:54 GMT
Building servers may not be hard to do. Building servers while under constant attack from your creators that saw you as a mistake that need to e exterminated however is difficult to do. Except they haven't been. THe Migrant Fleet only made a concerted effort to wip eout the geth within the last few months. Nothing but scout ships had passed the Perseus Veil in three hundred years. They were talking about during the Morning War. Obviously in the centuries since the Geth started moving to space, such as the Heretic Station and the Dyson Array the Geth were building. |
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Post by gothpunkboy89 on Jun 27, 2021 12:25:49 GMT
Building servers is not hard to do. Capturing and holding a few planets while they build said ships or refit existing ships is more then possible. Building servers may not be hard to do. Building servers while under constant attack from your creators that saw you as a mistake that need to e exterminated however is difficult to do. Yea all those 5 years olds are a real threat. Are we just going to ignore the fact the Quarians had multiple colonies and the Geth pushed them off each. Rannoch being the final stand in the closing months of the War before the Quarians left the Veil.
Also I feel the need to point to WW2 and the fact countries were still producing weapons and vehicles for war while under constant attack and bombing runs.
If the Geth can sacrifice thousands of bodies in assaults against Quarian positions then it would have to mean they have some manufacturing capabilities to either create new platforms or to repair damaged platforms. Otherwise this combat style would not be able to be sustained for very long. So they had the capabilities to do produce even small scale servers to upload programs into. Which they could have used to get Geth off of servers on Rannoch. Which would have allowed the block aid of Rannoch were they destroy the Quarian's ability to leave the planet trapping them down there were they are no longer a threat to the Geth.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jun 27, 2021 17:37:30 GMT
Building servers may not be hard to do. Building servers while under constant attack from your creators that saw you as a mistake that need to e exterminated however is difficult to do. Yea all those 5 years olds are a real threat. Are we just going to ignore the fact the Quarians had multiple colonies and the Geth pushed them off each. Rannoch being the final stand in the closing months of the War before the Quarians left the Veil.
Also I feel the need to point to WW2 and the fact countries were still producing weapons and vehicles for war while under constant attack and bombing runs.
If the Geth can sacrifice thousands of bodies in assaults against Quarian positions then it would have to mean they have some manufacturing capabilities to either create new platforms or to repair damaged platforms. Otherwise this combat style would not be able to be sustained for very long. So they had the capabilities to do produce even small scale servers to upload programs into. Which they could have used to get Geth off of servers on Rannoch. Which would have allowed the block aid of Rannoch were they destroy the Quarian's ability to leave the planet trapping them down there were they are no longer a threat to the Geth.
Considering you said earlier we have no details on what actually happened during the war, for all we know those Quarian children were killed by other Quarians such as dropping nukes on Geth-held cities. We do know that even centuries later the Geth are cleaning up damage from the war. But besides that, you’re forgetting one simple thing: the Geth were babies. It’s called the Morning War because it was at the dawn of their sentience. They were so different to Quarians they didn’t understand those concepts. Even EDI brings that up. And they are AI so see things logically, hence why they stopped before complete genocide because they didn’t know what that would mean, but before that logically those children would grow up and attack them, which turned out to be the case. Not excusing it, but there are mitigating factors. It’s why people who don’t understand right and wrong or children get lesser sentences. You mean the colonies where the Quarians also tried to genocide the Geth? Those countries in WW2 had industrial infrastructure in place before the war. The Geth didn’t. They also would have to contend with the Quarian fleet, you know the Quarian’s strong suit, which would have shot down any ship the Geth launched. To use WW2, it’s why Germany never invaded Britain. Their army was much stronger, but even they knew they couldn’t stand a chance against the British navy and any launched assault would just mean all those ships and people on them would sink. |
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Post by quarianmasterrace on Jun 27, 2021 18:46:28 GMT
>every thread turns to ending crap
>make specific thread for ending crap
>turns to geth-quarian crap
really can't win
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Post by Iakus on Jun 27, 2021 19:06:45 GMT
>every thread turns to ending crap >make specific thread for ending crap >turns to geth-quarian crap really can't win Well, the game sucks on many levels. It's a rich tapestry...
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Post by Monica21 on Jun 28, 2021 17:19:46 GMT
>every thread turns to ending crap >make specific thread for ending crap >turns to geth-quarian crap really can't win Well, the game sucks on many levels. It's a rich tapestry... Ah yes, the "the game sucks so hard that I still play it so I can talk publicly about how bad it is" take. So hot right now.
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Post by Iakus on Jun 28, 2021 19:16:39 GMT
Well, the game sucks on many levels. It's a rich tapestry... Ah yes, the "the game sucks so hard that I still play it so I can talk publicly about how bad it is" take. So hot right now. 
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Post by Deleted on Jun 28, 2021 20:48:06 GMT
This is the part of the thread where Bacon starts spamming porn.
Alms for Bacon!
I will not comment further, because this has gone too far off the deep end. The logical leaps are embarrassing, and the understanding of history by some members here is demented at best.
Edit: the forum member blocking feature is not perfect, but it will do.
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Post by gothpunkboy89 on Jun 28, 2021 21:35:38 GMT
Yea all those 5 years olds are a real threat. Are we just going to ignore the fact the Quarians had multiple colonies and the Geth pushed them off each. Rannoch being the final stand in the closing months of the War before the Quarians left the Veil.
Also I feel the need to point to WW2 and the fact countries were still producing weapons and vehicles for war while under constant attack and bombing runs.
If the Geth can sacrifice thousands of bodies in assaults against Quarian positions then it would have to mean they have some manufacturing capabilities to either create new platforms or to repair damaged platforms. Otherwise this combat style would not be able to be sustained for very long. So they had the capabilities to do produce even small scale servers to upload programs into. Which they could have used to get Geth off of servers on Rannoch. Which would have allowed the block aid of Rannoch were they destroy the Quarian's ability to leave the planet trapping them down there were they are no longer a threat to the Geth.
Considering you said earlier we have no details on what actually happened during the war, for all we know those Quarian children were killed by other Quarians such as dropping nukes on Geth-held cities. We do know that even centuries later the Geth are cleaning up damage from the war. But besides that, you’re forgetting one simple thing: the Geth were babies. It’s called the Morning War because it was at the dawn of their sentience. They were so different to Quarians they didn’t understand those concepts. Even EDI brings that up. And they are AI so see things logically, hence why they stopped before complete genocide because they didn’t know what that would mean, but before that logically those children would grow up and attack them, which turned out to be the case. Not excusing it, but there are mitigating factors. It’s why people who don’t understand right and wrong or children get lesser sentences. You mean the colonies where the Quarians also tried to genocide the Geth? Those countries in WW2 had industrial infrastructure in place before the war. The Geth didn’t. They also would have to contend with the Quarian fleet, you know the Quarian’s strong suit, which would have shot down any ship the Geth launched. To use WW2, it’s why Germany never invaded Britain. Their army was much stronger, but even they knew they couldn’t stand a chance against the British navy and any launched assault would just mean all those ships and people on them would sink.
You are right we have very little information about the events of the war. However this is a direct Codex entry that says the Geth would sacrifice thousands of platforms to gain a tactical advantage to take down Quarian positions. You can not lose 10 people on your side for every 1 enemy you take down unless you out number them 11 to 1. The Death Korps of Kreig method of attrition warfare only works if you directly out number your enemies with existing troops. Or you have a steady supply of new troops to take their place. Which in the Geth's case would be the recovery and repair of damaged platforms and/or the construction of new platforms to upload programs into.
They had already gained sentience. The Geth unit asking if it has a soul is a metaphysical question that only an entity with self awareness and intellegence could ask. Simple VI machines could not coordinate and plan a war against their creators and respond to the actions of the Quarians. They were babies in the same way a 30 year old is a baby. They understood mortality and knew what they were doing.
You actually point out a very good point in my favor. The Geth used logic and so saw children as future threats and killed them. They don't view non combatants as non combatants. Only as future combatants and will go far beyond necessary actions because logic dictates it. If something is considered a threat they kill everything related to it without hesitation.
Also how do you know that the Geth had no industry? There literally had to be plants that created and repaired the Geth given they were used as a labor force for the Quarians. That nessicates manufautring capabilities. And the Quarian Fleet was decimated given 300 years later the Heavy Fleet is the only aspect of their ships that were actually build as warships. The rest of the Flotilla are non combat ships that have been given weapons and used to make up the Patrol and Civlian fleets.
That said if the Quarians had and maintained void superiority then it would be effortless for them to engage in pin point orbital bombardment of Geth strong points. Including servers. The knowledge of these server locations would not be a secret. Seriously why would Quarians make use of nuclear weapons when a well aimed 5kg slug fired at 1/10th the speed of light would have the same effect. Just no fallout radiation.
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Post by Monica21 on Jun 28, 2021 22:10:31 GMT
Edit: the forum member blocking feature is not perfect, but it will do. Would you say that it's not perfect, but it has purpose?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 28, 2021 22:36:24 GMT
Edit: the forum member blocking feature is not perfect, but it will do. Would you say that it's not perfect, but it has purpose? Wow... Yes I would  I was thinking today that I am essentially Krogan in nature. Nothing would surprise me less to find that I am actually finally just a reject tank-bred. ETA: a weird tank-bred at that, since I genophaged myself. Takes a quad to detach your quad, as the saying goes. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 29, 2021 0:48:47 GMT
This is the part of the thread where Bacon starts spamming porn. Alms for Bacon! I will not comment further, because this has gone too far off the deep end. The logical leaps are embarrassing, and the understanding of history by some members here is demented at best. Edit: the forum member blocking feature is not perfect, but it will do. I got you fren 
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Post by steppinrazor on Jun 29, 2021 2:06:01 GMT
"This game SUCKS" *has thousands of posts on the forums for said game*
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Post by Link"Guess"ski on Jun 29, 2021 13:25:17 GMT
Nothing can change that the endings feel like an entirely seperate story that is slapped over the existing one and filled into additional DLC to "explain" things. I wanted an explanation for the Reapers I really did, but I wanted it to be part of the story not put on the tail-end and then have an insanely convoluted scene that reestablishes central conflict and resolves itself within 10 minutes and then pretending like "Yeeeah what a long-standing issue but bittersweet victory of FINALLY resolving THAT problem!" in the final cutscenes. I see similarities with Synthesis and what happens with the Geth and also Control, Destroy and the general theme of "evolution" in stuff like the Krogan arc. I can loosely see how they built the ending and the contraption to be the "crucible" (heh) of themes from previously in the story... it's just that there's way too many ifs and buts about how it connects to the existing PLOT, or emotional forward momentum and I really wished there had been more of a side-running plot and foreshadowing very early on in the game where the characters go "Why are the Reapers doing it?" as they used to do in ME2, to prime you emotionally like: Yes, we ARE going to find that out soon. They don't do that because they weren't sure if the ending was gonna stick or not and postponed the most complex aspect of the story that they didn't know how to deal with until the 11th hour when they were backed into a corner and now they had to do it. Then cat was out of the bag, and then they had to look at reactions to realize that they had to make "Leviathan DLC" to explain the stuff they didn't properly develop within the ending itself. Just an eternal, never-healing wound. What a shame. Chris leaves and Mac Walters is still cockroaching around. A lot of things might've happened but Chris L'Etoile battling Mac wasn't one of them. The only thing I read him say about it was that as soon as Mac became Lead Writer on ME2 they never saw him in the writer's pit. He was "too busy" to be around them now. I sense a general issue of Mac being too insecure to draft his ideas with the rest of the team, and them being like "So what are we doing right now?" That would explain why ME3 feels so disjointed between the good parts and how they connect to the vague super-premise. Inb4 people tell me that is ME2, but the difference is that ME2 was just painfully simple and there was no "catch". You were going to find out what the Reapers were doing with humans and collectors, and the answer was beyond the Omega 4 Relay. Go get a team, figure shit out. There wasn't much plot-wise wrong with that. It had no dramatic arc as a story but that's not the same issue. ME3 has a dramatic 3-act arc, but the logic of its plot leaves you with way too many questions the whole time, like "How are we even repelling them on Earth? Why do we expect we have to go to Earth after seeing Thessia and Palaven being just as bad? Are we seriously hedging our bets that the Crucible will kill ALL Reapers? Are you playing a trick on me? What's going on here??" |
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Post by Spectr61 on Jun 29, 2021 15:26:07 GMT
Nothing can change that the endings feel like an entirely seperate story that is slapped over the existing one and filled into additional DLC to "explain" things. I wanted an explanation for the Reapers I really did, but I wanted it to be part of the story not put on the tail-end and then have an insanely convoluted scene that reestablishes central conflict and resolves itself within 10 minutes and then pretending like "Yeeeah what a long-standing issue but bittersweet victory of FINALLY resolving THAT problem!" in the final cutscenes. I see similarities with Synthesis and what happens with the Geth and also Control, Destroy and the general theme of "evolution" in stuff like the Krogan arc. I can loosely see how they built the ending and the contraption to be the "crucible" (heh) of themes from previously in the story... it's just that there's way too many ifs and buts about how it connects to the existing PLOT, or emotional forward momentum and I really wished there had been more of a side-running plot and foreshadowing very early on in the game where the characters go "Why are the Reapers doing it?" as they used to do in ME2, to prime you emotionally like: Yes, we ARE going to find that out soon. They don't do that because they weren't sure if the ending was gonna stick or not and postponed the most complex aspect of the story that they didn't know how to deal with until the 11th hour when they were backed into a corner and now they had to do it. Then cat was out of the bag, and then they had to look at reactions to realize that they had to make "Leviathan DLC" to explain the stuff they didn't properly develop within the ending itself. Just an eternal, never-healing wound. What a shame. Chris leaves and Mac Walters is still cockroaching around. A lot of things might've happened but Chris L'Etoile battling Mac wasn't one of them. The only thing I read him say about it was that as soon as Mac became Lead Writer on ME2 they never saw him in the writer's pit. He was "too busy" to be around them now. I sense a general issue of Mac being too insecure to draft his ideas with the rest of the team, and them being like "So what are we doing right now?" That would explain why ME3 feels so disjointed between the good parts and how they connect to the vague super-premise. Inb4 people tell me that is ME2, but the difference is that ME2 was just painfully simple and there was no "catch". You were going to find out what the Reapers were doing with humans and collectors, and the answer was beyond the Omega 4 Relay. Go get a team, figure shit out. There wasn't much plot-wise wrong with that. It had no dramatic arc as a story but that's not the same issue. ME3 has a dramatic 3-act arc, but the logic of its plot leaves you with way too many questions the whole time, like "How are we even repelling them on Earth? Why do we expect we have to go to Earth after seeing Thessia and Palaven being just as bad? Are we seriously hedging our bets that the Crucible will kill ALL Reapers? Are you playing a trick on me? What's going on here??" Link, Exactly where in my post did I say, refer to, or imply the Chris L'Etoile was "battling" Mac. I simply said that Chris left (true), and Mac remained (also true). I never gave reasons or conditions that led to this unfortunate turn of events. You are the one bringing up "battling" (whatever that means), and then referring to what your "sense" of how Mac was feeling. (Insecure) Good good man, what am I thinking right now? Don't know because you are not a mind reader? Then how could you ever suppose to know how someone else is feeling or thinking unless they tell you? And I doubt Mac told you, or anyone else, he was feeling insecure. Maybe he was, maybe he wasn't, but to say he was is pure conjecture. I wish he had been let go over the endings debacle, but obviously he wasn't, and is still messing around Blower a decade later, just like a cockroach that you can never seem to get rid of.
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Post by Link"Guess"ski on Jun 29, 2021 16:10:44 GMT
Link, Exactly where in my post did I say, refer to, or imply the Chris L'Etoile was "battling" Mac. I simply said that Chris left (true), and Mac remained (also true). I never gave reasons or conditions that led to this unfortunate turn of events. You are the one bringing up "battling" (whatever that means), and then referring to what your "sense" of how Mac was feeling. (Insecure) Good good man, what am I thinking right now? Don't know because you are not a mind reader? Then how could you ever suppose to know how someone else is feeling or thinking unless they tell you? And I doubt Mac told you, or anyone else, he was feeling insecure. Maybe he was, maybe he wasn't, but to say he was is pure conjecture. I wish he had been let go over the endings debacle, but obviously he wasn't, and is still messing around Blower a decade later, just like a cockroach that you can never seem to get rid of. My intention wasn't to put any intent on your post, but I did misread it as if you suggested Mac made people leave or something.
Idk why L'Etoile left when he did but Drew also did the same week, and BioWare was shifting offices around that time, so my guess is that with the restructuring going on a bunch of people just decided to say "fuck it" with the Edmonton site. I don't even think L'Etoile left because of Drew leaving, because I know he was not a fan of the Dark Energy idea, which I'm almost certain was Drew's pitch.
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Post by gothpunkboy89 on Jun 29, 2021 19:20:57 GMT
I wanted an explanation for the Reapers I really did, but I wanted it to be part of the story not put on the tail-end and then have an insanely convoluted scene that reestablishes central conflict and resolves itself within 10 minutes and then pretending like "Yeeeah what a long-standing issue but bittersweet victory of FINALLY resolving THAT problem!" in the final cutscenes. ME 1 plays heavily into the Synthetic vs Organic. ME3 plays heavily into the Synthetic vs Organic. ME2 is the odd one out as it is really limited to Tali and Legion arguing after their loyalty missions are finished. There is no real discussion even if you bring Legion to Tali's recruitment mission nor her loyalty mission. ME2 is also were they try to free the Geth of any wrong doing by making the heretic faction to explain away their negative behavior in the first game.
The only difference is that the Reapers represent a more pressing issue that takes center stage. Pretty much the same how things happen in the real world. A nation can have a systemic issue with the justice system that sees draconian rulings and generally treating prisoners like sub human and not worth basic human decency. But that will be put on the back burner due to systemic institutionalized racism. Which is more noticeable and overt so it gets attention over prison reforms because more people can sympathize with someone getting the short end of the stick because of skin color. But can't really make the same empathetic connection with someone they deem a criminal who deserves their punishment.
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Post by Spectr61 on Jul 2, 2021 6:37:07 GMT
Link, Exactly where in my post did I say, refer to, or imply the Chris L'Etoile was "battling" Mac. I simply said that Chris left (true), and Mac remained (also true). I never gave reasons or conditions that led to this unfortunate turn of events. You are the one bringing up "battling" (whatever that means), and then referring to what your "sense" of how Mac was feeling. (Insecure) Good good man, what am I thinking right now? Don't know because you are not a mind reader? Then how could you ever suppose to know how someone else is feeling or thinking unless they tell you? And I doubt Mac told you, or anyone else, he was feeling insecure. Maybe he was, maybe he wasn't, but to say he was is pure conjecture. I wish he had been let go over the endings debacle, but obviously he wasn't, and is still messing around Blower a decade later, just like a cockroach that you can never seem to get rid of. My intention wasn't to put any intent on your post, but I did misread it as if you suggested Mac made people leave or something.
Idk why L'Etoile left when he did but Drew also did the same week, and BioWare was shifting offices around that time, so my guess is that with the restructuring going on a bunch of people just decided to say "fuck it" with the Edmonton site. I don't even think L'Etoile left because of Drew leaving, because I know he was not a fan of the Dark Energy idea, which I'm almost certain was Drew's pitch.
I don’t know why Chris left either, and the above makes as much sense as any. It would be great to actually know, but that ship has probably forever sailed, leaving OCD’ers like me to lament and wonder why….
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Post by Link"Guess"ski on Jul 2, 2021 11:41:52 GMT
My intention wasn't to put any intent on your post, but I did misread it as if you suggested Mac made people leave or something.
Idk why L'Etoile left when he did but Drew also did the same week, and BioWare was shifting offices around that time, so my guess is that with the restructuring going on a bunch of people just decided to say "fuck it" with the Edmonton site. I don't even think L'Etoile left because of Drew leaving, because I know he was not a fan of the Dark Energy idea, which I'm almost certain was Drew's pitch.
I don’t know why Chris left either, and the above makes as much sense as any. It would be great to actually know, but that ship has probably forever sailed, leaving OCD’ers like me to lament and wonder why…. He wasn't a BioWare veteran. And we know multiple staffers had issues with the project leads' way of steering the project. I think he just felt it was time to do something else. He wasn't "loyal to BioWare" at any point.
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