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Post by themikefest on Jul 2, 2021 13:04:29 GMT
Bottom line. Green is crap. Shoot the tube. It's very easy. Point, then fire.
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Post by Son of Dorn on Jul 2, 2021 13:07:32 GMT
Bottom line. Green is crap. Shoot the tube. It's very easy. Point, then fire. I'd rather put those rounds into Starkid's mainframe. But sadly that's not a option. |
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mikaelnovasun
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition, Dragon Age The Veilguard
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Post by mikaelnovasun on Jul 2, 2021 13:22:15 GMT
I just gave you the best example of your supposed theory within the existing ME universe in my previous post. Why jump forward in time, you have the "magical" tech that causes the synthesis ending already present. You have argued that Shepard's revival was considered a miracle by modern technology. But what about technology 100 years in the future? 200 years? 500 years? The techniques used to revive Shepard being studied. New possible avenues or ideas being found and tested. Advancing of general technology but also medical technology making the work less and less a miracle.
The first recorded surgery on the heart was done in 1895 to stop a stab wound. The patient died 3 days later of meningitis. In 1925 Henry Souttar performed the first heart valve surgery and the patient survived for years. 1944 the first pediatric cardiac surgery was done to a 1 year old girl. In the 1950's doctors and scientists created the cardiopulmonary bypass and the first open heart surgery to utilize it was done in 1952. As they found a stationary heart was easier and quicker to perform surgery on so they found a way to bypass the heart allowing to to be stopped while keeping the patient alive. In 1990 another advancement was made with off-pump coronary artery bypass to avoid the time limit issues of cardiopulmonary bypass and it allows the heart to be stabilized so surgery can be performed on it as if it is not beating.
In 1945 Nikolai Sinitsyn successful transplanted a heart from one frog to another and one dog to another. The first adult and pediactric human heart transplant was done in 1967 by Christiaan Barnard and Adrian Kantrowitz respective.
There was only a 72 year gap between first recorded surgery on a human heart. To having a heart transplanted from one human to another and surviving for years. And as medical technology has advanced the mortality rate from these surgeries has dropped.
So I ask again is your argument that all science has stopped and will never advance any further then it is now in the Mass Effect universe no matter how much time has passed?
LMAO. Wow, just wow. Let me break this down for you. I already gave you a better example than what you came up with to support your idea that "with sufficiently advanced technology the body becomes as easy to sculpt as clay" and paraphrasing here "because it is easy it isn't forced alteration". I disagree with the second part vehemently. Why stick to your original example and keep moving the goal post so to speak, when I already gave you a superior example that currently exists within the ME universe and not some timeline you are concocting? There is no need for it. Evidence already exists to SUPPORT your statement. I had a guildmate back in my WOW raiding days who liked to argue with others just for the sake of arguing. The only reason the guild kept him around was due to being the best dps rogue on the roster. Funnily enough he seemed to lose interest in raiding once people started ignoring him. It has been more the 15 years, and I don't remember the exact spelling; Vesta is that you?
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Post by winterking on Jul 2, 2021 13:47:47 GMT
Bottom line. Green is crap. Shoot the tube. It's very easy. Point, then fire. I kind wish they added an interrupt for Shepard to start walking towards the tube after the Catalyst explained "destroy". Don't even bother to listen to the other two options.
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Post by gothpunkboy89 on Jul 2, 2021 14:05:20 GMT
You have argued that Shepard's revival was considered a miracle by modern technology. But what about technology 100 years in the future? 200 years? 500 years? The techniques used to revive Shepard being studied. New possible avenues or ideas being found and tested. Advancing of general technology but also medical technology making the work less and less a miracle.
The first recorded surgery on the heart was done in 1895 to stop a stab wound. The patient died 3 days later of meningitis. In 1925 Henry Souttar performed the first heart valve surgery and the patient survived for years. 1944 the first pediatric cardiac surgery was done to a 1 year old girl. In the 1950's doctors and scientists created the cardiopulmonary bypass and the first open heart surgery to utilize it was done in 1952. As they found a stationary heart was easier and quicker to perform surgery on so they found a way to bypass the heart allowing to to be stopped while keeping the patient alive. In 1990 another advancement was made with off-pump coronary artery bypass to avoid the time limit issues of cardiopulmonary bypass and it allows the heart to be stabilized so surgery can be performed on it as if it is not beating.
In 1945 Nikolai Sinitsyn successful transplanted a heart from one frog to another and one dog to another. The first adult and pediactric human heart transplant was done in 1967 by Christiaan Barnard and Adrian Kantrowitz respective.
There was only a 72 year gap between first recorded surgery on a human heart. To having a heart transplanted from one human to another and surviving for years. And as medical technology has advanced the mortality rate from these surgeries has dropped.
So I ask again is your argument that all science has stopped and will never advance any further then it is now in the Mass Effect universe no matter how much time has passed?
LMAO. Wow, just wow. Let me break this down for you. I already gave you a better example than what you came up with to support your idea that "with sufficiently advanced technology the body becomes as easy to sculpt as clay" and paraphrasing here "because it is easy it isn't forced alteration". I disagree with the second part vehemently. Why stick to your original example and keep moving the goal post so to speak, when I already gave you a superior example that currently exists within the ME universe and not some timeline your are concocting? There is no need for it. Evidence already exists to SUPPORT your statement. I had a guildmate back in my WOW raiding days who liked to argue with others just for the sake of arguing. The only reason the guild kept him around was due to being the best dps rogue on the roster. Funnily enough he seemed to lose interest in raiding once people started ignoring him. Its been has been more the 15 years, and I don't remember the exact spelling; Vesta is that you? I am sticking to my original argument to @illusivechad who said the idea of flesh being as easy to sculpt as clay was a bullshit argument. I used Shepard as an example because we quite literally see him go from a genetically enhanced human. Into a burnt corpse. Into a cyberpunk style cyborg. And then back to looking like a completely normal human. You then again called bullshit using the logic that seemed to say technology can never and will never advance any further then shown in the ME universe. So I have been pointing out real world medical advancements to highlight the fact technology can and will advance. While also mentioning how studying the tech and techniques used to revive Shepard could lead to uncountable new technologies or break troughs with existing technology and medicine.
As shown the Kenji's Grey Box they are already able to store memories in a technological implant. It was created as a method of treatment for Alzheimer patients to counter the neural decay and loss of memory. If that technology advanced enough to actually be able to copy the entire neural pathways of the user combined with the cloning technology Cerberus was shown to use. It would mean if you recovered their grey box and cloned a new body you could literally be reborn in a new body with all the memories you previously had.
Or perhaps a little more grounded simply use the technology to copy the experiences of a veteran solider and upload their decades of experience and battle into the heads of new recruits giving them decades of experience in a fraction of the time.
If you want me to address you specifically your argument you need to answer a few questions. Iakus already deflected away from addressing them. Which isn't unexpected as they would rather burn their grandparent's house down then ever admit to me even having the vague concept of a point. So now it is your turn. Since your argument leans heavily on the lack of consent argument then explain or validate these events in the game and how consent was given or not given and how they were acceptable or not acceptable.
Shepard convincing the mother whether to get or not get the genetic modification to correct a possible genetic heart defect that killed her husband. Specifically how would the baby consent to this procedure and what gives the mother the right to make the choice on behalf of the baby?
Shepard choosing to withhold the Alliance Fleet which results in the deaths of hundreds of Turians and Asari as well as the Council. Where and when did any of them consent to Shepard being the one to decide if they live or die?
The Krogan consenting to both the development and deployment of the Genophage by the Salarians and Turians during the Krogan Rebellion.
Shepard's choice to deactivate one misled that was launched by Batarian slavers at a colony planet. Were and when did any of them consent to Shepard making the choice on who would die and who would live?
When and where did the Geth consent to Shepard refusing to allow the Reaper code upgrade to the Geth Fleet?
Where and when did the Turains consent to Victus withdrawing all Turian military from Palivan to be held in reserve for the Crucible? The same argument for Hackett. As both actions left billions at the hand of the Reapers to be hunted down and harvested.
Where and when did the Geth and EDI consent to Shepard committing genocide of their entire race when picking the Destroy ending?
Where and when did the galaxy consent to Shepard letting the Reapers harvest everyone when choosing the refuse ending?
Your moral absolutist argument only works if consent is a universal fundamental aspect like gravity. Yet the events in game show the concept of consent to be far more flexible and malleable with multiple examples of consent being irrelevant to Shepard's actions or the actions of others.
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Post by themikefest on Jul 2, 2021 14:08:39 GMT
Where and when did the galaxy give Shepard consent to have their dna changed when choosing the green?
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Post by gothpunkboy89 on Jul 2, 2021 14:11:07 GMT
Where and when did the galaxy give Shepard consent to have their dna changed when choosing the green? The same time and place the Geth both agreed to not upload the Reaper code and to be wiped out by Destroy.
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Post by Son of Dorn on Jul 2, 2021 14:16:02 GMT
Where and when did the galaxy give Shepard consent to have their dna changed when choosing the green? They didn't. As far as I recall. There was no one saying "please! Make us into the Reapers playthings!" |
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Post by themikefest on Jul 2, 2021 14:19:45 GMT
Where and when did the galaxy give Shepard consent to have their dna changed when choosing the green? The same time and place the Geth both agreed to not upload the Reaper code and to be wiped out by Destroy. And yet you failed to put that question in your long winded post.
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Post by Iakus on Jul 2, 2021 15:52:02 GMT
Bottom line. Green is crap. Shoot the tube. It's very easy. Point, then fire. I'd rather put those rounds into Starkid's mainframe. But sadly that's not a option. And now Bioware actually trolls you if you try.
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Post by Son of Dorn on Jul 2, 2021 15:54:08 GMT
I'd rather put those rounds into Starkid's mainframe. But sadly that's not a option. And now Bioware actually trolls you if you try. Shows how many fucks they give to their fanbase now, doesn't it? |
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Post by Iakus on Jul 2, 2021 16:00:18 GMT
If you want me to address you specifically your argument you need to answer a few questions. Iakus already deflected away from addressing them. Which isn't unexpected as they would rather burn their grandparent's house down then ever admit to me even having the vague concept of a point. So now it is your turn. Since your argument leans heavily on the lack of consent argument then explain or validate these events in the game and how consent was given or not given and how they were acceptable or not acceptable. I'd report this as a personal attack if I thought for a moment it would do any good...
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Post by Iakus on Jul 2, 2021 16:01:10 GMT
And now Bioware actually trolls you if you try. Shows how many fucks they give to their fanbase now, doesn't it? Definitely a case of caveat emptor. It's why I keep the box on my desk, as a reminder.
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Post by Son of Dorn on Jul 2, 2021 16:05:10 GMT
Shows how many fucks they give to their fanbase now, doesn't it? Definitely a case of caveat emptor. It's why I keep the box on my desk, as a reminder. Sold mine when I got rid off my old 360 to buy an Xbox One, never regretted that decision since. Plus I got 3 better games for doing it. 😉 |
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Post by gothpunkboy89 on Jul 2, 2021 19:17:56 GMT
The same time and place the Geth both agreed to not upload the Reaper code and to be wiped out by Destroy. And yet you failed to put that question in your long winded post. I did. Shepard convincing the mother whether to get or not get the genetic modification to correct a possible genetic heart defect that killed her husband. Specifically how would the baby consent to this procedure and what gives the mother the right to make the choice on behalf of the baby? Shepard choosing to withhold the Alliance Fleet which results in the deaths of hundreds of Turians and Asari as well as the Council. Where and when did any of them consent to Shepard being the one to decide if they live or die?
The Krogan consenting to both the development and deployment of the Genophage by the Salarians and Turians during the Krogan Rebellion.
Shepard's choice to deactivate one misled that was launched by Batarian slavers at a colony planet. Were and when did any of them consent to Shepard making the choice on who would die and who would live?
When and where did the Geth consent to Shepard refusing to allow the Reaper code upgrade to the Geth Fleet?
Where and when did the Turains consent to Victus withdrawing all Turian military from Palivan to be held in reserve for the Crucible? The same argument for Hackett. As both actions left billions at the hand of the Reapers to be hunted down and harvested. Where and when did the Geth and EDI consent to Shepard committing genocide of their entire race when picking the Destroy ending? Where and when did the galaxy consent to Shepard letting the Reapers harvest everyone when choosing the refuse ending? Your moral absolutist argument only works if consent is a universal fundamental aspect like gravity. Yet the events in game show the concept of consent to be far more flexible and malleable with multiple examples of consent being irrelevant to Shepard's actions or the actions of others.
So yea I brought that up to justify the consent argument when your actions are either direct opposites or very questionable consent situations.The fact I'm 3 for 3 now with people talking about consent but being unable or perhaps unwilling to actually address these examples of hypocrisy that goes against their moral absolutist mind set speaks volumes. I've found the people who yell about morals the loudest are often the ones who either have their mouths shuts the fastest or become very indignant and angry and start trying to shout down people as soon as they are asked to justify apparent or direct hypocrisy in their own actions or logic.
I'd report this as a personal attack if I thought for a moment it would do any good... At this point it isn't so much a personal attack as an overly exaggerated accurate description of your own actions and behavior.
Remember when I said you hated the whole Kai Leng fight on Thessia? You challenged me to ask were you said that. Then you disagreed my conclusion of your stance based on the quote I provided. I then asked if you instead thought he fight was adequete or you liked it. Because if you agreed with my assumption you would have simply not said anything. And if my statement I made on this thread was inaccurate you would have either said that my assumption about how you felt about Leng was accurate or you would have said I was wrong and explained how you viewed it in a posative light. Instead you chose: So yea don't get upset when you get called out for the behavior you engage when when people have literal physical proof of your behavior. Unlike the vast majority of people on this forum who just disagree with me. You and a select few would sooner cut off your own noses then admit to the idea of the concept of me making a valid point or argument.
Because again literally all you had to say was that I was correct and that you didn't like the whole fight on Thessia. But you just couldn't do it.
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Post by themikefest on Jul 2, 2021 19:23:43 GMT
Nope. Where in your post did you post the question I asked about where and when did the galaxy give consent for Shepard to change their dna when choosing the green?
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Post by Iakus on Jul 2, 2021 22:46:34 GMT
At this point it isn't so much a personal attack as an overly exaggerated accurate description of your own actions and behavior.
Remember when I said you hated the whole Kai Leng fight on Thessia? You challenged me to ask were you said that. Then you disagreed my conclusion of your stance based on the quote I provided. I then asked if you instead thought he fight was adequete or you liked it. Because if you agreed with my assumption you would have simply not said anything. And if my statement I made on this thread was inaccurate you would have either said that my assumption about how you felt about Leng was accurate or you would have said I was wrong and explained how you viewed it in a posative light. Instead you chose: So yea don't get upset when you get called out for the behavior you engage when when people have literal physical proof of your behavior. Unlike the vast majority of people on this forum who just disagree with me. You and a select few would sooner cut off your own noses then admit to the idea of the concept of me making a valid point or argument.
Because again literally all you had to say was that I was correct and that you didn't like the whole fight on Thessia. But you just couldn't do it.
No, it was a personal attack on me and my family. Which you don't know sh*t about. You were also completely wrong about what I said about the Kai Leng fight. Which, given I really haven't commented much on it, means anything you even THINK I said is wrong. And you simply put words in my mouth and then declared victory. At this point you're just ranting incoherently so I'll bow out for now.
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Post by gothpunkboy89 on Jul 2, 2021 23:42:00 GMT
Nope. Where in your post did you post the question I asked about where and when did the galaxy give consent for Shepard to change their dna when choosing the green? And I responded with the same time and place the Geth gave permission to allow or disallow the Reaper code upload and/or be wiped out by Destroy. The point being that the Geth never did. Both of these actions are against their consent.
If Synthesis is bad because no consent then Destroy is equally bad because no consent. This is the cognitive dissonance I want you or anyone else to explain. So far all I've seen is the 5 Ds of avoiding explaining apparent hypocrisy. Dodge, Duck, Dip, Dive and Dodge.
No, it was a personal attack on me and my family. Which you don't know sh*t about. You were also completely wrong about what I said about the Kai Leng fight. Which, given I really haven't commented much on it, means anything you even THINK I said is wrong. And you simply put words in my mouth and then declared victory. At this point you're just ranting incoherently so I'll bow out for now. No a personal attack on you is calling you stupid. Calling someone stubborn is not a personal attack when it is a fact. If you have been on this forum talking about this game for 9 years you qualify as stubborn automatically. You damaging property out of spite is not a personal attack on your family. It is an over the top and ridiculous situation to highlight how I see you acting.
You are not someone who simply disagrees because of a difference of opinion. You are a little forum troll who has spent the last 9 years complaining about the same things over and over again. Getting into a huff each time people don't automatically bow down to your "superior" logic. Hence why all your complaint about consent when presented with situations that happen in game that contradict your consent argument you deflect so hard that if we harvested a fraction of it and converted it into energy you could power the entire planet for 5 years.
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Post by mikaelnovasun on Jul 2, 2021 23:56:11 GMT
Nope. Where in your post did you post the question I asked about where and when did the galaxy give consent for Shepard to change their dna when choosing the green? And I responded with the same time and place the Geth gave permission to allow or disallow the Reaper code upload and/or be wiped out by Destroy. The point being that the Geth never did. Both of these actions are against their consent.
If Synthesis is bad because no consent then Destroy is equally bad because no consent. This is the cognitive dissonance I want you or anyone else to explain. So far all I've seen is the 5 Ds of avoiding explaining apparent hypocrisy. Dodge, Duck, Dip, Dive and Dodge.
No, it was a personal attack on me and my family. Which you don't know sh*t about. You were also completely wrong about what I said about the Kai Leng fight. Which, given I really haven't commented much on it, means anything you even THINK I said is wrong. And you simply put words in my mouth and then declared victory. At this point you're just ranting incoherently so I'll bow out for now. No a personal attack on you is calling you stupid. Calling someone stubborn is not a personal attack when it is a fact. If you have been on this forum talking about this game for 9 years you qualify as stubborn automatically. You damaging property out of spite is not a personal attack on your family. It is an over the top and ridiculous situation to highlight how I see you acting.
You are not someone who simply disagrees because of a difference of opinion. You are a little forum troll who has spent the last 9 years complaining about the same things over and over again. Getting into a huff each time people don't automatically bow down to your "superior" logic. Hence why all your complaint about consent when presented with situations that happen in game that contradict your consent argument you deflect so hard that if we harvested a fraction of it and converted it into energy you could power the entire planet for 5 years.
Oh the irony of this entire post. It did make me laugh so there is that. Sorry! I was really trying to avoid feeding the troll, but couldn't refrain  . I will endeavor to do better.
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Post by gothpunkboy89 on Jul 3, 2021 2:18:38 GMT
And I responded with the same time and place the Geth gave permission to allow or disallow the Reaper code upload and/or be wiped out by Destroy. The point being that the Geth never did. Both of these actions are against their consent.
If Synthesis is bad because no consent then Destroy is equally bad because no consent. This is the cognitive dissonance I want you or anyone else to explain. So far all I've seen is the 5 Ds of avoiding explaining apparent hypocrisy. Dodge, Duck, Dip, Dive and Dodge.
No a personal attack on you is calling you stupid. Calling someone stubborn is not a personal attack when it is a fact. If you have been on this forum talking about this game for 9 years you qualify as stubborn automatically. You damaging property out of spite is not a personal attack on your family. It is an over the top and ridiculous situation to highlight how I see you acting.
You are not someone who simply disagrees because of a difference of opinion. You are a little forum troll who has spent the last 9 years complaining about the same things over and over again. Getting into a huff each time people don't automatically bow down to your "superior" logic. Hence why all your complaint about consent when presented with situations that happen in game that contradict your consent argument you deflect so hard that if we harvested a fraction of it and converted it into energy you could power the entire planet for 5 years.
Oh the irony of this entire post. It did make me laugh so there is that. Sorry! I was really trying to avoid feeding the troll, but couldn't refrain . I will endeavor to do better. There is no irony. I make no excuse for the fact I disagree with people. The difference is I will address arguments. I will argue in good faith. A few people will not and it goes beyond simply not agreeing and having differing perspectives. Iakus is one of them. They do the same thing over and over again. They start a conversation then after a couple of replies they start to get vaguer and vaguer and drift further and further from the original point. And at any time their stance gets challenged with a difficult question or point they start posting memes or any other way to deflect from addressing something. And when they get called out on it they get huffy over it.
Both you and Iakus state that synthesis is bad because the rest of the galaxy did not consent to it full stop. I hold a much more flexible idea based on a lot of history were consent is all well in good until you need to make a choice for the future of your city, state, country, world or galaxy depending on which applies to you. And when I point out events in game that violate your consent argument and highlights a cognitive dissonance in your logic both you and Iakus suddenly stop addressing my argument and scream troll to disregard everything I say.
Meeting someone just as stubborn and opinionated as yourself doesn't make them a troll just because they disagree with you. And this fandom's habit of calling anyone who disagrees with them a troll is saddening. I know every fandom has those people but this one seems to have a much higher ratio. I honestly think this fandom would be a very interesting psychological study given the sheer number of stubborn opinionated people who meet other equally stubborn and opinionated people and then get really angry at each other when they disagree.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 3, 2021 20:54:22 GMT
The lost irony in this thread would feed every Thresher Maw for the rest of this cycle.
I have reported several posts in this thread, all from one user who cannot refrain from name calling. Begone.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 3, 2021 23:09:05 GMT
So after watching husband do his green ending, I still don’t like it because it changes all organic everything as we see with the plants. Yes Joker gets a happy ending and there is peace for now until someone finds something to fight about which we will always do. But here is why it bugs me. What about those non space traveling civilizations who suddenly get up lifted. It reminds me of Star Trek’s prime directive. Is this a bad thing, we don’t know. Sovereign says because of the reapers they up lifted each cycle to take the path that the reapers wanted. I don’t like this, they should not have done that, nor should the Salarians have done it or even the Prothians. I pick destroy because it was wrong to create AI to begin with. I liked Legion a lot but sorry the Leviathan started this crap. I cure the genophage because it was wrong to do that to the Krogan who should never have been messed with in the first place. I do understand that even in real life we progress through discovery and yes the synth end is basically pushing progress forwards super fast to the point of Ascension like the Ancients from stargate. But that’s what I don’t like, what if we aren’t ready. It’s a matter of what you believe is right for you. I think AI being self aware is bad and my husband thinks all things that ask if they are alive should be allowed to live and forcing evolution forward is ok. First of all, welcome to the board. Most of us are veterans from BSN prime, and saw the devastating effects of the original endings on some fans, and how many people were distraught by the implications of each ending. The Extended Cut relieved some of that, but many fans still believe Bioware irreparably damaged the franchise. I do recommend for all the fans unhappy with ME3, to truly experience it in a positive way, go to Nexus mods, install Galaxy Mod Overhaul, Project Variety, Ark mod, Priority Earth Overhaul, Jon's Ending and Citadel Overhaul (in this mod the Citadel DLC occurs many years after the destroy ending). It's the only way I can play ME3 nowadays. The Vanilla experience is unplayable to me. |
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Iakus
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Post by Iakus on Jul 3, 2021 23:58:33 GMT
The lost irony in this thread would feed every Thresher Maw for the rest of this cycle. I have reported several posts in this thread, all from one user who cannot refrain from name calling. Begone. I've tried that before. It won't work. Said poster must be protected or something.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 4, 2021 0:12:39 GMT
I will always defend the right to free speech, even when its hateful. There's no offense, there's only the offended. That said, there's something pernicious in social media discourse. Basic pleasantry and empathy is almost nonexistent, and common ground is never achieved. Debates rapidly degrade on name calling and circular arguments. Is there a way to fix that? I really don't know.
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mousestalker
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ღ The Untitled
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Post by mousestalker on Jul 4, 2021 0:16:28 GMT
Please stop with the quote pyramids and personal comments.
Thank you.
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. I will endeavor to do better.
