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Post by midnight tea on Jun 18, 2024 21:33:59 GMT
The Mark that they received from touching the Orb in the fist place. That isn't the point though - point is that in the end what killed Cory wasn't any sort of giant explosion. Okay, neat. Doesn’t change the fact that when the Orb was used, it made massive explosion because of all the magic stored in it. No, that is the point. You’re just avoiding it. What actually killed Corypheus has nothing to do with the way Silas planned for Corypheus to die I am avoiding nothing whatsoever - it's you who are trying to avoid the simple reality of the fact that there is nothing in the game suggesting that Solas had any plans for Cory to explode himself, or anyone else, at the Conclave. In fact, considering that WE KNOW that Solas didn't know that Corypheus was an immoral blighted monstrosity, the plans of Solas for Corypheus were really basic and simple - he opens the orb and kills himself, very likely in a blast that doesn't have to be any stronger than something that can kill a regular mortal standing very close to the source of explosion.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jun 18, 2024 21:38:45 GMT
Okay, neat. Doesn’t change the fact that when the Orb was used, it made massive explosion because of all the magic stored in it. No, that is the point. You’re just avoiding it. What actually killed Corypheus has nothing to do with the way Silas planned for Corypheus to die I am avoiding nothing whatsoever - it's you who are trying to avoid the simple reality of the fact that there is nothing in the game suggesting that Solas had any plans for Cory to explode himself, or anyone else, at the Conclave. In fact, considering that WE KNOW that Solas didn't know that Corypheus was an immoral blighted monstrosity, the plans of Solas for Corypheus were really basic and simple - he opens the orb and kills himself, very likely in a blast that doesn't have to be any stronger than something that can kill a regular mortal standing very close to the source of explosion. And a dad who gives his kid a gun has no plans for his kid to shoot up a school, yet if that kid does that dad is still also held responsible. The simple reality is this: Solas doesn’t give Corypheus the orb = nobody at Conclave dies Solas does give Corypheus the orb = people at the Conclsve dies Therefore, it is Solas’s fault as an accessory. He owns this, why can’t you?
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Post by colfoley on Jun 18, 2024 21:41:51 GMT
So on the current conversation while its probably been said, it is worth saying again, but the Orb didn't actually do the massive explosion until the Inquisitor touched the damn thing which interrupted the ritual. Now maybe it would've done so with Corypheus doing it in the first place as well, or maybe the results would've been much more catastrophic if Cory was able to open a rift into the Fade with the thing, but its posisble that the full extent of the explosion was an uncontrolled accident that neither Solas nor Cory intended. On the article itself some interesting stuff going on in here and a lot of stuff that has basically already been shared... Seems I missed the bit about Solas getting trapped in the Fade and him speaking to us through dreams, granted the last bit was a little on the speculative side , but it is presupposed on the former. Only thing I am a *little* dissapointed on is how one to one this opening is to Inquisition. Now this is with the huge asterisk on it that basic plot premsises can be very similar but the actual events end up being very different...and it does remind me of when I had the same criticisms during the marketing for AC 7, that it seemed like it could be way too similar to AC 5. It excited me since I was a big fan of AC 5 as well but also worried me since repetitive plot points always carry with it some sort of risk...but in the end AC 7 did probably become my second favorite game of that series and the simularties, while there, did end up being very different. Likewise here them starting it off with the same plot structure from Inquisition, like I love Inquisition to death, but Inquisition was very much a big adventure high fantasy romp through Southern Thedas against very big good and very big evil forces. Nothing wrong with this story again I loved it and it does seem to be what BioWare is best at...but might not be the story I was hoping Veilguard would be either. Still will probably end up enjoying it either way and ultimatly small complaint and I gotta try and keep the hype levels below 9000
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Post by midnight tea on Jun 18, 2024 21:44:33 GMT
And a dad who gives his kid a gun has no plans for his kid to shoot up a school, yet if that kid does that dad is still also held responsible. That's not an analogy that works here at all. Solas is no dad to Cory and he doesn't give him an orb for the same reason dad would give kid a gun - in fact, he gives the Orb to Cory specifically because he wants to open the orb AND eliminate a Vint magister at the head of an increasingly dangerous Tevinter cult. He literally tells us that killing Cory was his goal as well. Because the context of his actions matters, and the fact that he didn't give Cory the orb specifically so he can explode himself at the Conclave is not something you can easily ignore too, Hanako.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jun 18, 2024 21:47:14 GMT
And a dad who gives his kid a gun has no plans for his kid to shoot up a school, yet if that kid does that dad is still also held responsible. That's not an analogy that works here at all. Solas is no dad to Cory and he doesn't give him an orb for the same reason dad would give kid a gun - in fact, he gives the Orb to Cory specifically because he wants to open the orb AND eliminate a Vint magister at the head of an increasingly dangerous Tevinter cult. He literally tells us that killing Cory was his goal as well. Wow, okay guess I have to spell it out for you. If. You. Give. Bad. Person. Dangerous. Thing. And. They. Use. It. For. Bad. Things. You. Are. Responsible. For. Those. Bad. Things. Even. If. You. Didn’t. Want. Bad. Things. To. Happen.
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Post by DragonKingReborn on Jun 18, 2024 21:50:39 GMT
Same people. Moving from thread to thread. It is getting old.
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Post by colfoley on Jun 18, 2024 21:50:52 GMT
Would this make the Inquisitor an accessory since they actually detonated the damn thing?
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Post by midnight tea on Jun 18, 2024 21:51:09 GMT
That's not an analogy that works here at all. Solas is no dad to Cory and he doesn't give him an orb for the same reason dad would give kid a gun - in fact, he gives the Orb to Cory specifically because he wants to open the orb AND eliminate a Vint magister at the head of an increasingly dangerous Tevinter cult. He literally tells us that killing Cory was his goal as well. Wow, okay guess I have to spell it out for you. If. You. Give. Bad. Person. Dangerous. Thing. And. They. Use. It. For. Bad. Things. You. Are. Responsible. For. Those. Bad. Things. Even. If. You. Didn’t. Want. Bad. Things. To. Happen. This. Is. Kindargerten. Morality. That. Has. No. Application. In. A. World. That. Isn't. A. Cartoon. We're not going to reach an agreement here. For you, there's no grey - it's only black-and-white. We best leave at it over here.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jun 18, 2024 21:53:25 GMT
So our companions so far in recruitment order are Harding, Neve, Bellara. Wonder what the rest of the order will be, or if after that it opens up a bit more and we choose who we can get first.
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Post by sageoflife on Jun 18, 2024 21:56:43 GMT
I think people are assuming a little too much from what happens at the very beginning of the game. That aside, I really hope the Inquisitor at least has the option to live through the whole game. If he dies no matter what I do, I will be very unhappy.
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Post by The Elder King on Jun 18, 2024 21:56:59 GMT
So our companions so far in recruitment order are Harding, Neve, Bellara. Wonder what the rest of the order will be, or if after that it opens up a bit more and we choose who we can get first. I think it's be less forced after Bellara, going to Arlathan seems to be quite reasonable after the opening. Regardless if we'd look to recruit them or solve some issues in the areas they're in, it makes sense to give the player freedom in pursuing the different plots. Arlathan would be similar to Lothering in that regards.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jun 18, 2024 21:57:43 GMT
I think people are assuming a little too much from what happens at the very beginning of the game. That aside, I really hope the Inquisitor at least has the option to live through the whole game. If he dies no matter what I do, I will be very unhappy. I highly doubt the Inquisitor will be killed off no matter what. Every BioWare protagonist has an option to survive.
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Post by jennica on Jun 18, 2024 22:01:30 GMT
Same people. Moving from thread to thread. It is getting old. I feel like the discourse about Solas is a new mages vs templars discourse. People have very strong opnions about him, which is not a bad thing but yeah, it's pretty mich the same argumants over and over.
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Post by midnight tea on Jun 18, 2024 22:01:57 GMT
Same people. Moving from thread to thread. It is getting old. I'd prepare for more discussions of that sort, considering just how pivotal Solas is to the story. And trying to guess his character and motivations feeds directly into trying to guess where this story (or at least, significant parts of it) could go. Even according to this article (in which we also received new information) both the author and the devs he spoke to underline that this is still quite Solas-centric story, even if they want to shift focus more on the team they've built around Rook. IMO just making the Dread Wolf a fairly straightforward baddie makes the story of DAVe potentially way more boring for me - and given what we saw already, I have reasons to believe that Bioware doesn't particularly care about that direction.
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Post by colfoley on Jun 18, 2024 22:03:52 GMT
So our companions so far in recruitment order are Harding, Neve, Bellara. Wonder what the rest of the order will be, or if after that it opens up a bit more and we choose who we can get first. I think it's be less forced after Bellara, going to Arlathan seems to be quite reasonable after the opening. Regardless if we'd look to recruit them or solve some issues in the areas they're in, it makes sense to give the player freedom in pursuing the different plots. Arlathan would be similar to Lothering in that regards. do wonder how on rails the game will be based on order. Afterall it's been said you can recruit all the companions before the end of Act 1. Also makes me wonder how many times we'll get to visit each country. Time 1: pickup companions Time 2: solve plot. Etc.
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Post by The Elder King on Jun 18, 2024 22:06:09 GMT
I think it's be less forced after Bellara, going to Arlathan seems to be quite reasonable after the opening. Regardless if we'd look to recruit them or solve some issues in the areas they're in, it makes sense to give the player freedom in pursuing the different plots. Arlathan would be similar to Lothering in that regards. do wonder how on rails the game will be based on order. Afterall it's been said you can recruit all the companions before the end of Act 1. Also makes me wonder how many times we'll get to visit each country. Time 1: pickup companions Time 2: solve plot. Etc. They did say we can return to explore the areas afterwards, to explore them and find secrets.
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Post by midnight tea on Jun 18, 2024 22:06:37 GMT
I think people are assuming a little too much from what happens at the very beginning of the game. That aside, I really hope the Inquisitor at least has the option to live through the whole game. If he dies no matter what I do, I will be very unhappy. My guess is that we should prolly prepare ourselves for "who stays in the Fade" scenario, like in case of Hawke and Alistair/Loghain/Stroud in Inquisition. Although who'd will be choosing between remains an open question - Solas? Morrigan? Varric? ...Rook?
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Post by colfoley on Jun 18, 2024 22:07:20 GMT
Same people. Moving from thread to thread. It is getting old. I'd prepare for more discussions of that sort, considering just how pivotal Solas is to the story. And trying to guess his character and motivations feeds directly into trying to guess where this story (or at least, significant parts of it) could go. Even according to this article (in which we also received new information) both the author and the devs he spoke to underline that this is still quite Solas-centric story, even if they want to shift focus more on the team they've built around Rook. IMO just making the Dread Wolf a fairly straightforward baddie makes the story of DAVe potentially way more boring for me - and given what we saw already, I have reasons to believe that Bioware doesn't particularly care about that direction. fun thing about all great villains is motivation and back story. Voldemort is a pretty good example for this since he was portrayed as a very black villain...until HBP filled in his backstory. He remained a very evil character that had to be stopped but we got understanding on how he got that way and how he essentially was Harry who went wrong, a reminder that we could all be him.
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Post by TabithaTH on Jun 18, 2024 22:08:51 GMT
We'll be in Solas house, with our babe, our friends, our loot, saving the world. Didn't someone say something about a spirit entity helping us craft things? What's the betting that's Solas trying to be helpful from the Fade because he just can't imagine how we can manage without him. I’m thinking it’s the spirit librarian/archivist mentioned in the article. The one Bellara takes with her to fix at the end of the demo.
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Post by sageoflife on Jun 18, 2024 22:10:56 GMT
I think people are assuming a little too much from what happens at the very beginning of the game. That aside, I really hope the Inquisitor at least has the option to live through the whole game. If he dies no matter what I do, I will be very unhappy. My guess is that we should prolly prepare ourselves for "who stays in the Fade" scenario, like in case of Hawke and Alistair/Loghain/Stroud in Inquisition. Although who'd will be choosing between remains an open question - Solas? Morrigan? Varric? ...Rook? I doubt it will be Rook. That's one of the reasons they didn't have the Hero of Ferelden appear in Inquisition. Every other option you listed is getting left behind if that situation happens.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jun 18, 2024 22:10:59 GMT
Wow, okay guess I have to spell it out for you. If. You. Give. Bad. Person. Dangerous. Thing. And. They. Use. It. For. Bad. Things. You. Are. Responsible. For. Those. Bad. Things. Even. If. You. Didn’t. Want. Bad. Things. To. Happen. This. Is. Kindargerten. Morality. That. Has. No. Application. In. A. World. That. Isn't. A. Cartoon. We're not going to reach an agreement here. For you, there's no grey - it's only black-and-white. We best leave at it over here. Well, and places like the justice system but you know, details. Nice ad hominem attacks there. Also never said Solas was equally responsible, so you pulled that no grey thing out of thin air. Not continuing this conversation, just addressing these last couple points. Please do not respond.
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Post by jennica on Jun 18, 2024 22:12:31 GMT
do wonder how on rails the game will be based on order. Afterall it's been said you can recruit all the companions before the end of Act 1. Also makes me wonder how many times we'll get to visit each country. Time 1: pickup companions Time 2: solve plot. Etc. They did say we can return to explore the areas afterwards, to explore them and find secrets. I hope exploraion wise DAVe will be more like DAO rather than, say, Mass effect 2/3, where most areas were mission exclusive and i'm not sure you could even go back and explore them later.
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Post by colfoley on Jun 18, 2024 22:13:30 GMT
They did say we can return to explore the areas afterwards, to explore them and find secrets. I hope exploraion wise DAVe will be more like DAO rather than, say, Mass effect 2/3, where most areas were mission exclusive and i'm not sure you could even go back and explore them later. I think that's likely.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jun 18, 2024 22:14:43 GMT
Didn't someone say something about a spirit entity helping us craft things? What's the betting that's Solas trying to be helpful from the Fade because he just can't imagine how we can manage without him. I’m thinking it’s the spirit librarian/archivist mentioned in the article. The one Bellara takes with her to fix at the end of the demo. I think so too. To continue the Lothering comparison, it’s like bumping into Bodahn and Sandal before leaving.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jun 18, 2024 22:17:09 GMT
They did say we can return to explore the areas afterwards, to explore them and find secrets. I hope exploraion wise DAVe will be more like DAO rather than, say, Mass effect 2/3, where most areas were mission exclusive and i'm not sure you could even go back and explore them later. Unfortunately with how they’re emphasizing how hand-crafted for missions all the locations are, I think it’s going to be mostly like ME2/ME3. A couple hub areas, but most places will just be for that mission. Could be wrong though.
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