sjsharp2010
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Post by sjsharp2010 on Jul 9, 2024 15:19:28 GMT
For Andromeda and BG3, the companions were never the focal point of the game. That was still the main story. Meanwhile so far BioWare has talked more about how the companions are the focus than the main plot, hence the name change. The last time they did this was ME2. Well to be fair in regards to ME 2 spending more resources on Companions, Harbinger and the Collectors weren't exactly complex... To be fair I don't think theenem yneeded t obe complex in tha tgam eas they were jus tset up t obe do wha tthe reapers wanted
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illuminated11
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Post by illuminated11 on Jul 9, 2024 17:34:18 GMT
That is a kind of sort of a matter of relativity. Sure, when it comes to BioWare games specifically I suppose companions mattered a little more in ME 2 then it did in their other games...but for BioWare when compared to the industry their companion characters are pretty much the focus of every single BioWare game out there. Its the main thing that tends to draw people in and what tends to make or break their games. I think while Veilguard will focus on the companions, maybe in a way they haven't done in awhile, its not really that far beyond what they have done to this point and I'm looking forward to them improving on the formula. Yeah...this is in large part one of the problems I had with Andromeda and Inquisition. The entire cast (aside from Varric, Cassandra, and Leliana) were just....there. As in, they were just mouth breathers - taking up space. They had all the charm of a cardboard cutout (Dorian did show promise, and Harding is returning, so there is that). If they're going to refocus on companions more, a la ME2, then that'd be another big win for the "Play this game" column.
Sadly though, I don't think they have that level of writing anymore to pull it off. I really hope I'm wrong and they do; I'm just not going to bet on it.
You know, I was furiously typing up an essay about Varric and how his humanism is such a fundamental aspect of Inquisition, before realizing you meant him as one of the exceptions. Whoops! Haha.
Still, I strongly disagree with this take. Frankly, comparing the character writing in Inquisition to Andromeda is wild to me, and I say that as someone who liked Andromeda. All of the companions in Inquisition are wonderfully idiosyncratic and feed into its overarching themes of personhood and idealism, faith and identity, myth and reality, the individual opposed to the group. Bloat can sometimes obfuscate matters, and the guarded nature of certain characters makes it hard to understand where they're coming from unless you drag them around with Cole, but they all connect to form a larger, holistic picture of Thedas and what it means to be in service to an institution.
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Guardian
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Post by Guardian on Jul 9, 2024 23:03:32 GMT
Yeah...this is in large part one of the problems I had with Andromeda and Inquisition. The entire cast (aside from Varric, Cassandra, and Leliana) were just....there. As in, they were just mouth breathers - taking up space. They had all the charm of a cardboard cutout (Dorian did show promise, and Harding is returning, so there is that). If they're going to refocus on companions more, a la ME2, then that'd be another big win for the "Play this game" column.
Sadly though, I don't think they have that level of writing anymore to pull it off. I really hope I'm wrong and they do; I'm just not going to bet on it.
You know, I was furiously typing up an essay about Varric and how his humanism is such a fundamental aspect of Inquisition, before realizing you meant him as one of the exceptions. Whoops! Haha.
Still, I strongly disagree with this take. Frankly, comparing the character writing in Inquisition to Andromeda is wild to me, and I say that as someone who liked Andromeda. All of the companions in Inquisition are wonderfully idiosyncratic and feed into its overarching themes of personhood and idealism, faith and identity, myth and reality, the individual opposed to the group. Bloat can sometimes obfuscate matters, and the guarded nature of certain characters makes it hard to understand where they're coming from unless you drag them around with Cole, but they all connect to form a larger, holistic picture of Thedas and what it means to be in service to an institution.
Oh yes, Varric was one of the exceptions lol.
But I'm glad it worked for you! For me....all of them were just one-dimensional. I've said it before, like Cora, who only seems to tell you about how she trained with the Asari Huntresses. And that's the only thing I remember about her because that's all she talks about. They had no charm or personality to any of them. I had such high hopes for Drack, hoping to get interesting stories out of him, but...nothing.
I'm replaying Inquisition again since the last time I did about 7 years ago, and I remember no one's personal quests, aside from Bull and Varric. I even somehow messed up Cassandra's, and I actually like Cassandra. All of this is just...new again to me because I remembered zero of it outside of the beginning of the game, and a tiny thing in both Jaws of Haakon and Descent.
Don't mistake my criticism as me not enjoying those games. They're decent; I wouldn't say they're the best of their franchises. I've even said that they are worth playing at least once. But these two games are the first time BioWare failed in the character department to make me care about them. If there had been some sort of "suicide run" a la ME2 in either one....I probably wouldn't be as upset if someone died.
I just think that some seem to forget that what works for them, doesn't work for others, and that does not invalidate either person's opinion.
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illuminated11
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Post by illuminated11 on Jul 10, 2024 2:56:59 GMT
To be clear, I don't think the character writing is that strong in Andromeda, although I like Drack and Jaal well enough. It's the comparison to Inquisition that I found outrageous. Then again, while I've always enjoyed Mass Effect I've never really had strong feelings for the games like I do for Dragon Age. For me, it's not about the personal quests when it comes to Inquisition, although some are stronger than others, it's the way the different companions all reflect and resonate as foils and parallels to each other. The sum is greater than than the individual parts, and Varric and Cassandra are a good example of this, as a lot of their scenes are intertwined and frankly more memorable than their actual personal quests.
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sjsharp2010
N7
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Post by sjsharp2010 on Jul 12, 2024 15:09:54 GMT
To be clear, I don't think the character writing is that strong in Andromeda, although I like Drack and Jaal well enough. It's the comparison to Inquisition that I found outrageous. Then again, while I've always enjoyed Mass Effect I've never really had strong feelings for the games like I do for Dragon Age. For me, it's not about the personal quests when it comes to Inquisition, although some are stronger than others, it's the way the different companions all reflect and resonate as foils and parallels to each other. The sum is greater than than the individual parts, and Varric and Cassandra are a good example of this, as a lot of their scenes are intertwined and frankly more memorable than their actual personal quests. Yeah Varri cand Leliana are 2 o fm yfavourite characters in Dragon Age as I found them both intriguing characters. I think there is potential for some interesting stories with our Veilguard companions but we won' tknow until we play.
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helios969
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Post by helios969 on Jul 13, 2024 14:27:26 GMT
What, were not arguing about meaningless sex anymore?!. How boring.  |
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RelevantRevenant
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Post by RelevantRevenant on Jul 13, 2024 20:03:24 GMT
What, were not arguing about meaningless sex anymore?!. How boring. What, 10+ pages of arguing about brothels/sex workers/sex isn't enough? 😁 I suppose we could start over... |
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Post by Syv on Jul 22, 2024 1:39:17 GMT
As a straight guy I want to push back against the narrative that BioWare doesn't try to appeal to us anymore. Straight men had the most romance options in Mass Effect Andromeda, and most of the love interests in DATV are women. When it comes to looks I think Neve is very attractive and none of the others can be called ugly. When it comes to DAI both Josephine and Vivvienne to me are conventionally attractive. Just because some of the female characters don't appeal to some straight men's tastes, doesn’t mean BioWare has an agenda against creating female characters that are appealing to straight men. Looking at the DATV female cast Neve to me is a 10 out of 10. Bellara and Harding are cute in the same way Merrill was in DA2 to me. Taash is the only one that doesn’t grab my attention instantly from a purely attractive standpoint, but neither did Lae’zel from BG3 and by the end of act one I saw her appeal. I also want to point out that not only Neve is hot (even tho she is not exactly my type), she also shows quite a bit of cleavage in her casual outfit, even if it's not on Isabela level. Yeah I saw that too ! Quite sexy.  I also find Neve attractive from what I've seen, I got my eyes on her. Though I don't think she had been helped by her black transparent veil hiding a little her face, her hat and the dark lightening from the gameplay. I hope we'll have a close up like for Bellara next week while they reveal her voice.  I was very frustrated with the lighthouse pic, I wanted to see her face with her hair down. Didn't have yet a wow moment though. But maybe it will be like it happened with Baldur'gate III, the best game I ever played recently. There too, I didn't have a wow moment at the beginning. Before playing the game I kept seeing Shadowheart (and also lae'zel) on youtube or on some posters on the net, I knew she was a romance option and I saw how popular she was with guys. As far as I was concerned I just thought " mhh yeah, she is quite attractive, but that's it, geez emo girl ", and to be honest the fact that she was popular quite annoyed me. I was like geez why everyone is fond of her. I was more attracted to Lae'zel, pretty eyes and felt we would get along. Was totally indifferent to Shadowheart at the beginning. But the more I played the game, the more, the more I talked to her, I followed the story, I was like " wait................ holycrap...... that girl is actually fucking hot, it's too much, I understand better now " I wasn't willing to deviate from Laezel. Buuut cute voice, sexy garnment, hot hairstyle, pretty face, hot personality, awesome writting, very satisfying romance from I've seen, and more surprising, she approved a lot of my actions and we got along very well, as much as with Lae'zel. Ok babe, just wait, I'm coming. I was already locked up with Lae'zel, so I restarted the whole game, first time I did such thing, that character just stole my heart, one of the best romance. And you know what ? I loved the fact that I went for someone I didn't expect and that I realised whe was more attractive than what I initially thought. Hope you all will feel the same with DAV ---- Otherwise hoping that this time, at least for the romance for the guys, won't be forced to play only one path, the romantic and KISA guy, just doing or following what gals want, zero diversity like with Cassandra and Josephine. Zero possibility of roleplaying another path. Forced to get along with poetry or chevalry, almost screaming I love youuuuuu.  From my own experience, my preference go toward when at the beginning all is about fun and spicy things. Being dead serious , formal and already romantic first, I do not really believe in such things. Always have been a disaster when it started like that in my life, while, just starting by having first a spontaneous relationship based just on fun, complicity, without romantic and formal pressure, before getting serious, always led me to the best love relationships. I will probably get along with the one female character who is like that. So obiviously hoping Neve could lead to such thing lol.
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