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Post by TheInvoker on Aug 26, 2024 19:30:13 GMT
so? i saw a slot for a second weapon. but i can just use 2 2h weapons..i'm not talking about this video. we are talking about the trait. what if i don't have a shield in my inventory? what if i have 2 2h weapons? or just one with empty slots in the secondary weapon?
It could be i can still launch the shield even if i'm wielding the 2H weapon IF ONE THE WEAPON SET is sword and shield but i'm not forced to have 2 weapon sets.
I'm pretty sure this work like in DAI, where if you didn't set a weapon inside one of the slot, the game default to a basic weapon to use anyway. In other words, there will always be a shield available. Weapon ok, but the shield?
Why do they suppose i want a shield if i have nothing? why not giving a 2h weapon instead? and again, if i put a 2h weapon in the primary slot, i can't use a shield. The secondary is just for a weapon. If i chose a 2h weapon as primary do they move the second slot down to the seconday weapon??
I hope it's not this way because it would mean that they are forcing us to use 2 different type of weapons and it's not possible to have 2 weapons of the same type.
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Post by theascendent on Aug 26, 2024 19:35:57 GMT
So warriors can swap from sword and board to two handed, rogues from dual wielding to archery and Mages from staff to orb and magical blade? Huh. Combat going to be much more fluid and dynamic than previous entries. Will there be any point or reason to switch fighting style if you commit to one mode of combat and ignore/exclude the other?
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Post by azarhal on Aug 26, 2024 19:40:54 GMT
Go back to part one of the video, it has the inventory screen where you can see there a dedicate two-handed weapon slot and sword&shield have their own. The rogue bow special attack is in the same spot as the shield toss abliity and always available. rogue bow ability being in the same spot? Did we get a new screen shot? I'm talking about "hip fire"*, it's the Rogue equivalent of the Warrior's Shield Toss and the Mage's charge attack (I don't know the name of that one). In the 20 minute gameplay, it has a single gauge at the top that gets charged when used (note that the 20 minutes gameplay is probably an unfinished build, beside the UI difference, the Minrathous citadel is also a different asset then in the Nvidia RTX trailer). *the article mentioning it called it like that, but I'm not sure if it's the real name of it.
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Post by Syv on Aug 26, 2024 19:41:43 GMT
I remained silent the whole last weekend after seeing the warrior gameplay. Didn't know what to say. Didn't know what I felt.
The design of enemies is very very bad, terrible. We are at level 30… They are supposed to be threatening, not goofy. What have they done to the darkspawn, I'm sorry, they look like shit even if there is a story reason behind their change. That's not an excuse.
From what I've seen, they also literally killed the spirit of playing a warrior. What was that ? I'm a guy who plays warrior or soldier all the time since DAO and ME1, at the beginning of both franchise. In all fantasy games, I choose warrior !
Players who always choose this path have a particular mindset.
A warrior is a grounded fighter ! He is all about physical strength, endurance, martial arts and skills, dexterity, bravery, discipline and tactics…gravitas. An armor is a lot of weight. And you have to learn to move with it, it has to be part of you, an extension of your body in spite of iron load, and it’s always a challenge in battle, all the time. (I get that it has to be quick but even with DAII, I was satisfied)
A warrior is someone with years of physical training and practices, who built his muscles over the years, who strictly followed a disciplined warrior regime enhanced with an implacable mindset.
That’s the spirit… And I’m not feeling it here… Until DAI I didn't have to complain because even if it isn't possible to be realistic about it entirely, all the abilities felt like it belonged to that style of gameplay. The spirit was there.
I see the protagonist in the current gameplay jumping and rolling everywhere, his finishing moves where he jumps particularly, with all these distracting flashs absolutely everywhere and magic thrown every 15 seconds. And I'm wondering if I'm seeing the arcane warrior there. So much magic for a warrior is absolutely insane, you almost see nothing !
I see him with his foot hitting the ground, and enemies are suddenly frozen around him.
If I want to throw a lot of magic things, I'll ll play a mage.
I'm totally okay with runes, and magic tools and mages helping me, that's obvious, but it's something else entirely.
I'm literally crossing my finger for the other warrior specializations allowing me to play and roleplay a random warrior with just his muscles, martial skills with a sword, tactics and his combat intelligence as assets, without flashs everywhere !
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TheInvoker
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Post by TheInvoker on Aug 26, 2024 20:33:14 GMT
I remained silent the whole last weekend after seeing the warrior gameplay. Didn't know what to say. Didn't know what I felt. The design of enemies is very very bad, terrible. We are at level 30… They are supposed to be threatening, not goofy. What have they done to the darkspawn, I'm sorry, they look like shit even if there is a story reason behind their change. That's not an excuse. From what I've seen, they also literally killed the spirit of playing a warrior. What was that ? I'm a guy who plays warrior or soldier all the time since DAO and ME1, at the beginning of both franchise. In all fantasy games, I choose warrior ! Players who always choose this path have a particular mindset. A warrior is a grounded fighter ! He is all about physical strength, endurance, martial arts and skills, dexterity, bravery, discipline and tactics…gravitas. An armor is a lot of weight. And you have to learn to move with it, it has to be part of you, an extension of your body in spite of iron load, and it’s always a challenge in battle, all the time. (I get that it has to be quick but even with DAII, I was satisfied) A warrior is someone with years of physical training and practices, who built his muscles over the years, who strictly followed a disciplined warrior regime enhanced with an implacable mindset. That’s the spirit… And I’m not feeling it here… Until DAI I didn't have to complain because even if it isn't possible to be realistic about it entirely, all the abilities felt like it belonged to that style of gameplay. The spirit was there. I see the protagonist in the current gameplay jumping and rolling everywhere, his finishing moves where he jumps particularly, with all these distracting flashs absolutely everywhere and magic thrown every 15 seconds. And I'm wondering if I'm seeing the arcane warrior there. So much magic for a warrior is absolutely insane, you almost see nothing ! I see him with his foot hitting the ground, and enemies are suddenly frozen around him. If I want to throw a lot of magic things, I'll ll play a mage. I'm totally okay with runes, and magic tools and mages helping me, that's obvious, but it's something else entirely. I'm literally crossing my finger for the other warrior specializations allowing me to play and roleplay a random warrior with just his muscles, martial skills with a sword, tactics and his combat intelligence as assets, without flashs everywhere ! i agree and already written about warrior's mobility . nothing to say about this But he's not using magic. he's using elemental items/abilities. The one that froze enemies was the rune. There are many runes to choose from and i suppose there are runes that are not based on elemental damage. Also the weapon was doing fire damage and he showed he picked an ability to add more fire damage on parry (he based his build on fire because darkspawn is vulnerable to fire) I suppose we will also have abilties not based on elements for warrior. Just take the one you prefer. Of course we have to see each single passive and active ability to see if we like the tree or not
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Post by OhDaniGirl on Aug 26, 2024 20:45:52 GMT
I don't get it. If you don't think a warrior should be able to dodge, don't use the dodge button. I think using the finishers is also optional. What am I missing?
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Post by jennica on Aug 26, 2024 20:56:38 GMT
I don't get it. If you don't think a warrior should be able to dodge, don't use the dodge button. I think using the finishers is also optional. What am I missing? I'm more confused about the fact that in Origins warrior would leap several meters off the ground in a full massive armor and not only i never saw anyone complain about it, but people actually praised finishers in DAO. Which is probably the reason why in DAVe warriors do the same thing.
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Post by SofaJockey on Aug 26, 2024 21:05:09 GMT
warrior would leap several meters off the ground Yep, those leaping finishers from Origins are back...
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Post by midnight tea on Aug 26, 2024 21:10:01 GMT
I don't get it. If you don't think a warrior should be able to dodge, don't use the dodge button. I think using the finishers is also optional. What am I missing? I'm not sure we're missing anything - the video itself was a 10-minute showcase of basics of combat in DA with a specific build they chose, WHILE underlining in the descriptions that this is just one of the many builds we could be using while playing the game. In other words: that is just one way of playing the class.
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Post by Syv on Aug 26, 2024 21:12:52 GMT
I don't get it. If you don't think a warrior should be able to dodge, don't use the dodge button. I think using the finishers is also optional. What am I missing? Where did I mention he couldn't dodge ? You can dodge without rolling on the ground, no ? Is it necessary with a warrior in heavy armor ? Do you know how much it weights to be able to get up from the ground with it ? lol I never take this ability in DAI, and it was totally OPTIONAL. There, I can see, that dodge is actually one of the basic abilities.... Too bad I can't remove it and replace it by something else.. __ So the answer for finishing moves, is not " make them in a smart way for every class ", as a warrior in this case, it's to the players to never use this mecanic if you don't like it, deal with it and that's it ? Is it supposed to be some kind of constructive critics for the devs ? I don't think so, it never is, and never will. The finishing moves were totally fine in Dragon age origins for example, because they made sense and were believable, they weren't cringy for the most part, I'm hoping the same here. This finishing move from the saturday gameplay, is totally lame. Not only the protagonist doesn't need to jump to finish off the monster, but it is dangerous and dumb.
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Post by midnight tea on Aug 26, 2024 21:18:33 GMT
I don't get it. If you don't think a warrior should be able to dodge, don't use the dodge button. I think using the finishers is also optional. What am I missing? Where did I mention he couldn't dodge ? You can dodge without rolling on the ground, no ? Is it necessary with a warrior in heavy armor ? Do you know how much it weights to be able to get up from the ground with it ? lol But why assume that an armor in a fantasy game behaves exactly how it does on Earth? It's a magical armor, made out of magical materials and usually heavily enchanted. That's been true since DAO. Like... it's as unrealistic that this armor can withstand the hit from a dragon the size of a small castle, or an axe the size of the door wielded by a creature with strength and size of a rhinoceros. If there exist enchants or materials capable of making it withstand that, then there can also exist materials that make it feel much lighter than it appears visually.
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Post by Syv on Aug 26, 2024 21:19:23 GMT
warrior would leap several meters off the ground Yep, those leaping finishers from Origins are back... Lol find me such thing except for dragons, the arch demon and trolls, You won't. It's obviously for epic purpose at one specific moment, it is not that bothering. it won't be all the time in your face during all your playthrough, even there I cringed a bit. You won't have any such thing among random enemies and during all your playthrough.
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Post by OhDaniGirl on Aug 26, 2024 21:22:05 GMT
I don't get it. If you don't think a warrior should be able to dodge, don't use the dodge button. I think using the finishers is also optional. What am I missing? Where did I mention he couldn't dodge ? You can dodge without rolling on the ground, no ? Is it necessary with a warrior in heavy armor ? Do you know how much it weights to be able to get up from the ground with it ? lol I never take this ability in DAI, and it was totally OPTIONAL. There, I can see, that dodge is actually one of the basic abilities.... Too bad I can't remove it and replace it by something else.. __ So the answer for finishing moves, is not " make them in a smart way for every class ", as a warrior in this case, it's to the players to never use this mecanic if you don't like it, deal with it and that's it ? Is it supposed to be some kind of constructive critics for the devs ? I don't think so, it never is, and never will. The finishing moves were totally fine in Dragon age origins for example, because they made sense and were believable, they weren't cringy for the most part, I'm hoping the same here. This finishing move from the saturday gameplay, is totally lame. Not only the protagonist doesn't need to jump to finish off the monster, but it is dangerous and dumb. How would you make a dodge movement more believable? I assume if you're not mobile enough to do a somersault, you're not mobile enough to do any other rapid movement. I guess I just don't know. And you may be able to rebind the dodge key to something else. They said key binding was a thing.
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Post by The Elder King on Aug 26, 2024 21:28:31 GMT
Yep, those leaping finishers from Origins are back... Lol find me such thing except for dragons, the arch demon and trolls, You won't. It's obviously for epic purpose at one specific moment, it is not that bothering. it won't be all the time in your face during all your playthrough, even there I cringed a bit. You won't have any such thing among random enemies and during all your playthrough. That finisher is indeed unique for special type of enemies, and it's likely that Veilguard will have a higher frequency of those, but I never understood trying to justify the breaking of realism for epic purposes/specific and unique moments. I understand wanting a more realistic kind of gameplay, and that people could tolerate Origins more then Veilguard (or DA2, or Inquisition) in this regard...but the special finisher in Origins has the same problem of the one we saw in Veilguard. Being less present doesn't make it better, as well as being reserved for epic moments. It 'sucks' on both cases, with the difference that if you don't like it in Veilguard, you don't have to trigger it.
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Post by Syv on Aug 26, 2024 21:35:47 GMT
Where did I mention he couldn't dodge ? You can dodge without rolling on the ground, no ? Is it necessary with a warrior in heavy armor ? Do you know how much it weights to be able to get up from the ground with it ? lol But why assume that an armor in a fantasy game behaves exactly how it does on Earth? It's a magical armor, made out of magical materials and usually heavily enchanted. That's been true since DAO. Like... it's as unrealistic that this armor can withstand the hit from a dragon the size of a small castle, or an axe the size of the door wielded by a creature with strength and size of a rhinoceros. If there exist enchants or materials capable of making it withstand that, then there can also exist materials that make it feel much lighter than it appears visually. Yes, true. We could think like that. I mean it's also from the point of view of having something we could truly feel different from the rogue gameplay, loyal to the traditional warrior gameplay we are used to even if it has to evolve from every game. In Skyrim, Dragon Dogma, you could see that every single class felt truly different from each other, the moves had nothing to do between them even if there were fantasy abilities. You felt slowness, weight and power with the warrior, compared to the rogue. There are people who could be disappointed with what they saw with the mage gameplay, because they felt it went beyond the classe itself. There too for example in the next game we could have the protagonist, being suddenly a ninja with magic, suddenly fighting like ninjas at close range, with vast rogue and warrior abilities, thanks to his magic (not the arcane warrior), nothing could prevent us such thing. But then here again, from a gameplay point of view, it would hurt the perception of a lot of folks. And you could be certain that a lot of folks wouldn't be happy. it's a bit of both. i'm really hoping I will be able to choose abilities that will make me enjoy the warrior as usual.
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Post by Syv on Aug 26, 2024 21:44:39 GMT
Lol find me such thing except for dragons, the arch demon and trolls, You won't. It's obviously for epic purpose at one specific moment, it is not that bothering. it won't be all the time in your face during all your playthrough, even there I cringed a bit. You won't have any such thing among random enemies and during all your playthrough. That finisher is indeed unique for special type of enemies, and it's likely that Veilguard will have a higher frequency of those, but I never understood trying to justify the breaking of realism for epic purposes/specific and unique moments. I understand wanting a more realistic kind of gameplay, and that people could tolerate Origins more then Veilguard (or DA2, or Inquisition) in this regard...but the special finisher in Origins has the same problem of the one we saw in Veilguard. Being less present doesn't make it better, as well as being reserved for epic moments. It 'sucks' on both cases, with the difference that if you don't like it in Veilguard, you don't have to trigger it. Eeeh no, they were totally good for a video game released in 2009.... A video game doesn't have to execute in a perfect way what we could have in reality. That's not what we mean by having believable finishing moves. You won't see the protagonist doing super jump ( except for the dragons, trolls etc), he will just get to the point and cut off the head of the enemy without wasting time. Obviously it's a video game, so you won't ever have a perfect execution, but it was totally good for what it was, and the finishing moves in DAO were totally praised by most people back at that time and it is still the case in 2024, it's not for nothing.
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Post by SofaJockey on Aug 26, 2024 21:55:37 GMT
it won't be all the time in your face during all your playthrough The gameplay appeared to require a button prompt to trigger it. The creature was staggered awaiting a [Stick press] to get the finisher, or you could just hit it and kill it normally if the enemy doesn't deserve a big finish.
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Post by The Elder King on Aug 26, 2024 22:02:28 GMT
That finisher is indeed unique for special type of enemies, and it's likely that Veilguard will have a higher frequency of those, but I never understood trying to justify the breaking of realism for epic purposes/specific and unique moments. I understand wanting a more realistic kind of gameplay, and that people could tolerate Origins more then Veilguard (or DA2, or Inquisition) in this regard...but the special finisher in Origins has the same problem of the one we saw in Veilguard. Being less present doesn't make it better, as well as being reserved for epic moments. It 'sucks' on both cases, with the difference that if you don't like it in Veilguard, you don't have to trigger it. Eeeh no, they were totally good for a video game released in 2009.... A video game doesn't have to execute in a perfect way what we could have in reality. That's not what we mean by having believable finishing moves. You won't see the protagonist doing super jump ( except for the dragons, trolls etc), he will just get to the point and cut off the head of the enemy without wasting time. Obviously it's a video game, so you won't ever have a perfect execution, but it was totally good for what it was, and the finishing moves in DAO were totally praised by most people back at that time and it is still the case in 2024, it's not for nothing. I mentioned in my post that Origins is more tolerable in regards of realistic gameplay in comparison to Veilguard, and a videogame can't indeed mimic in a perfect way reality...but the ogre/dragon finisher didn't divert from realism because of technical issues. It was a conscious decision to make it more 'epic', which lead to the unrealistic jump, in a similar way as Veilguard does. They could've done the special finisher in a way that would've been more 'realistic' if they wanted to. I'm not sure the reason why finishers were praised was because of how realistic they were, especially considering that the normal ones *can* break immersion and realism by being used on characters that aren't supposed to lose their heads in the fight.
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Post by SofaJockey on Aug 26, 2024 22:08:47 GMT
To be honest, for a fantasy game about a war with ancient gods from a demon realm. I'm not sure 'realism' is the hill to die upon...
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Post by midnight tea on Aug 26, 2024 22:13:45 GMT
I mean it's also from the point of view of having something we could truly feel different from the rogue gameplay, loyal to the traditional warrior gameplay we are used to even if it has to evolve from every game. In Skyrim, Dragon Dogma, you could see that every single class felt truly different from each other, the moves had nothing to do between them even if there were fantasy abilities. You felt slowness, weight and power with the warrior, compared to the rogue. There are people who could be disappointed with what they saw with the mage gameplay, because they felt it went beyond the classe itself. There too for example in the next game we could have the protagonist, being suddenly a ninja with magic, suddenly fighting like ninjas at close range, with vast rogue and warrior abilities, thanks to his magic (not the arcane warrior), nothing could prevent us such thing. But then here again, from a gameplay point of view, it would hurt the perception of a lot of folks. And you could be certain that a lot of folks wouldn't be happy. it's a bit of both. i'm really hoping I will be able to choose abilities that will make me enjoy the warrior as usual. Who said that they won't feel different? We didn't yet see all the possible builds - heck, we only saw 4 skills out of dozens a single class has, and a handful of passives and gear specific to build that was used. That is why I'm partially confused - we've seen something, but we didn't see all there is. And we only saw a few seconds of mage gameplay, so it's really hard to judge the class just on that - if people are complaining, they're mostly complaining at presence of only 3 skills (though there's more than that), and a potential lack of elemental mage (Evoker's recent description makes the specialization seem like it's ice-related). Also - the debate about pure classes vs hybrid classes is far older than DA itself, and people will argue about it long after Veilguard is published.
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Post by illuminated11 on Aug 26, 2024 22:14:51 GMT
I'm not sure the reason why finishers were praised was because of how realistic they were, especially considering that the normal ones *can* break immersion and realism by being used on characters that aren't supposed to lose their heads in the fight. Lol so I'm not the only one who got the glitch where you talk to headless characters?
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The Elder King
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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The Elder King
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theelderking
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Post by The Elder King on Aug 26, 2024 22:21:48 GMT
I'm not sure the reason why finishers were praised was because of how realistic they were, especially considering that the normal ones *can* break immersion and realism by being used on characters that aren't supposed to lose their heads in the fight. Lol so I'm not the only one who got the glitch where you talk to headless characters? I was referring more to the fact that you can finish several characters in combat by decapitating them, but afterwards in cutscenes their head is attached to their body...with some of them very well being able to live for long afterward, given that Loghain and Zevran can join the party.
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azarhal
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Post by azarhal on Aug 26, 2024 22:27:41 GMT
To be honest, for a fantasy game about a war with ancient gods from a demon realm. I'm not sure 'realism' is the hill to die upon... I can't wait after release, I'm expecting a bunch of people will be complaining about the ancient elven gods power level being way too much for the settings because they always considered it to be low fantasy instead of the high fantasy setting that it was. We can thank Drakon's Chantry for the misconception.
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illuminated11
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Post by illuminated11 on Aug 26, 2024 22:29:27 GMT
Lol so I'm not the only one who got the glitch where you talk to headless characters? I was more referring to the fact that you can finish several characters in combat by decapitating them, but afterwards in cutscenes their head is attached to their body...with some of them very well being able to live for long afterward, given that Loghain and Zevran can join the party. Oh lol, never got that, I can imagine it though. I did once have a conversation with a headless Carta member however.
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Post by river82 on Aug 26, 2024 22:43:31 GMT
To be honest, for a fantasy game about a war with ancient gods from a demon realm. I'm not sure 'realism' is the hill to die upon... I can't wait after release, I'm expecting a bunch of people will be complaining about the ancient elven gods power level being way too much for the settings because they always considered it to be low fantasy instead of the high fantasy setting that it was. We can thank Drakon's Chantry for the misconception. Very few know what high or low fantasy is so people probably won't care I feel like people care much more about it being dark fantasy. It was created when there was a dark fantasy kick going on I think as well
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