The Elder King
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Post by The Elder King on Nov 14, 2016 11:06:33 GMT
I don't get the connection. The fact that the Nomad doesn't have weapon is related to their unwillingness to calibrate the combat system with a powerful vehicle, not on how empty of full the areas in the game will be. What do you mean by that? That if the Nomad had weapons we would have two ways to fight enemies. They would need to calibrate the combat to make it challenging for both types, without going on being too easy or too hard in one type. I don't completely agree with the choice, but I can understand why they didn't want to spend more resources and time for this. And it's not relevant to how empty or full the areas will be.
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Post by Ahriman on Nov 14, 2016 11:10:50 GMT
What do you mean by that? That if the Nomad had weapons we would have two ways to fight enemies. They would need to calibrate the combat to make it challenging for both types, without going on being too easy or too hard in one type. I don't completely agree with the choice, but I can understand why they didn't want to spend more resources and time for this. And it's not relevant to how empty or full the areas will be. If areas wouldn't be empty you wouldn't need to skip them on Nomad. It's entirely relevant to Nomad, because it's only purpose is to move. It's a horse basically.
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The Elder King
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Post by The Elder King on Nov 14, 2016 11:22:41 GMT
That if the Nomad had weapons we would have two ways to fight enemies. They would need to calibrate the combat to make it challenging for both types, without going on being too easy or too hard in one type. I don't completely agree with the choice, but I can understand why they didn't want to spend more resources and time for this. And it's not relevant to how empty or full the areas will be. If areas wouldn't be empty you wouldn't need to skip them on Nomad. It's entirely relevant to Nomad, because it's only purpose is to move. It's a horse basically. TW3 wasn't empty and it had an horse system. Just because DAI was like that, it doesn't mean every open world with an horse system has to have empty areas. Some people prefer to have a faster method to travel that isn't fast travel. It's not relevant to how empty the areas are.
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Post by Ahriman on Nov 14, 2016 11:27:53 GMT
If areas wouldn't be empty you wouldn't need to skip them on Nomad. It's entirely relevant to Nomad, because it's only purpose is to move. It's a horse basically. TW3 wasn't empty and it had an horse system. 1. You could fight on horse there. 2. It can be used to get from one quest point to another. Guess what was between them. Nothing, except random ghouls/bandits which you could get rid off without stepping on foot.
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Post by The Elder King on Nov 14, 2016 11:37:50 GMT
TW3 wasn't empty and it had an horse system. 1. You could fight on horse there. 2. It can be used to get from one quest point to another. Guess what was between them. Nothing, except random ghouls/bandits which you could get rid off without stepping on foot. TW3's open world was still not empty as in DAI. The fact that the horse is used to get from quest points to quest points doesn't make it empty. If your problem is with open worlds in general, then this was going to happen regardless if the Nomad was present or have weapons. And we knew the game would be like this for a while.
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Post by Adhin on Nov 14, 2016 11:37:56 GMT
It's space, of course there is going to be empty ehh, space. And I mean on planet/moons. If we land on a moon and it's cram pack full of monsters all over then fuck that. I want it to be actual goddamn space, not a shooting gallery. Nomad having guns or not doesn't change that. This isn't DAI, it's Mass Effect, it's in fucking space (heh, space fucking, we'll bang ok?).
Point is it's a different setting, with different expectations. If we get into a linear story mission and there is a long ass stretch of pure nothingness to drive through it better be atmospheric as all hell but the open world areas (like landing on a moon or whatever). I dunno, whine more I guess? I'm happy to just drive around and look at all the space at that point.
edit: Might point out in ME1 we had long stretchs of driving in ME1, which had 'combat' which was pretty pointless. With the Nomad being less combat oriented those sequences would of most likely not of happened at all (which would of been nice). The Mako sequence on Noveria, for instance may of been shorter and just involved going from point A to point B quickly with some audio briefing on what your gonna have to do as you get there and frankly I'd of preferred that.
Don't get me wrong I liked the Mako, I liked the guns on em, but the combat during that sequence wasn't exactly thrilling.
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The Elder King
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Post by The Elder King on Nov 14, 2016 11:39:54 GMT
It's space, of course there is going to be empty ehh, space. And I mean on planet/moons. If we land on a moon and it's cram pack full of monsters all over then fuck that. I want it to be actual goddamn space, not a shooting gallery. Nomad having guns or not doesn't change that. This isn't DAI, it's Mass Effect, it's in fucking space (heh, space fucking, we'll bang ok?). Point is it's a different setting, with different expectations. If we get into a linear story mission and there is a long ass stretch of pure nothingness to drive through it better be atmospheric as all hell but the open world areas (like landing on a moon or whatever). I dunno, whine more I guess? I'm happy to just drive around and look at all the space at that point. It's true that the setting accommodates the open world situation better, as well as the plot of there game making the exploration focus better. I do think that some areas should be packed with more content compared to DAI though.
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Post by Adhin on Nov 14, 2016 11:47:13 GMT
It's space, of course there is going to be empty ehh, space. And I mean on planet/moons. If we land on a moon and it's cram pack full of monsters all over then fuck that. I want it to be actual goddamn space, not a shooting gallery. Nomad having guns or not doesn't change that. This isn't DAI, it's Mass Effect, it's in fucking space (heh, space fucking, we'll bang ok?). Point is it's a different setting, with different expectations. If we get into a linear story mission and there is a long ass stretch of pure nothingness to drive through it better be atmospheric as all hell but the open world areas (like landing on a moon or whatever). I dunno, whine more I guess? I'm happy to just drive around and look at all the space at that point. It's true that the setting accommodates the open world situation better, as well as the plot of there game making the exploration focus better. I do think that some areas should be packed with more content compared to DAI though. Oh yeah I agree. One of my biggest issues with the original Mass Effect was just that. The side stuff is whatever, happy to have it be mostly desolate blah blah. It was the story mission points we did that kinda irked me. I liked them, mind you, but this was coming off KotOR. When the game told me I had 3 main planets to hit up and 2 of them where a colony and a settlement I was 'expecting' hub areas. The liara one I wasn't, I was like 'ok 2 main things +getting a person'. That's where it bummed me out the most, get to Noveria and your like yeeeah second hub area and there's 1 side quest involving delivering a goddamn package. It was just a glorified linear mission. Where as if that was KotOR it would of been a hub area with multiple side missions along with it's main overarching story mission. Sadly Citadel was the only place with that in ME1. That is exactly what I am praying is different in MEA, and that is definitely also in relation to DAI. DAI lacked any major hub areas as well. Every area you went to, for the most part, was just some random place screwed over by demons. They couldn't even be bothered to put in functional towns with quests you kept going back to like in past games. So yeah I agree, some planets should definitely have more stuff then DAI, or any of the past ME games for that matter. I love my linear with choice story missions but gimmie a few hub worlds dang it. Lemmy sink my time into a few of em. And you know, also have those desolate planet/moons I can drive around on and explore.
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Post by Kappa Neko on Nov 14, 2016 11:54:29 GMT
Any open world game needs a "horse" as a means of getting quicker from A to B. From a gameplay perspective it makes sense for the Nomad to be a transportation vehicle.
However, driving an unarmed vehicle on an alien planet with possible hostile inhabitants makes zero sense to me from a storytelling point of view. And that's what I personally don't like about the Nomad's purpose. Nobody goes exploring expecting to find only friendly Teletubbies.
Again, from a game design perspective I get it. Like mentioned above, if the player can kill an enemy easily with the vehicle's cannon (as was the case in ME1), you have a combat imbalance. In ME1 it wasn't an issue because most enemies out in the open could only with a lot more effort be killed on foot. You COULD get out of the Mako and fight a tresher maw with your pistol, but it wasn't the smart thing to do. It's not what you were supposed to do. The armed Mako had no impact on 99% of combat. No issues. Would be different with the Nomad. So makes sense it's not armed.
So I guess we have to live with how stupid an idea this is from a story point of view.
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Post by Pounce de León on Nov 14, 2016 12:03:54 GMT
Any open world game needs a "horse" as a means of getting quicker from A to B. From a gameplay perspective it makes sense for the Nomad to be a transportation vehicle. However, driving an unarmed vehicle on an alien planet with possible hostile inhabitants makes zero sense to me from a storytelling point of view. And that's what I personally don't like about the Nomad's purpose. Nobody goes exploring expecting to find only friendly Teletubbies. Again, from a game design perspective I get it. Like mentioned above, if the player can kill an enemy easily with the vehicle's cannon (as was the case in ME1), you have a combat imbalance. In ME1 it wasn't an issue because most enemies out in the open could only with a lot more effort be killed on foot. You COULD get out of the Mako and fight a tresher maw with your pistol, but it wasn't the smart thing to do. It's not what you were supposed to do. The armed Mako had no impact on 99% of combat. No issues. Would be different with the Nomad. So makes sense it's not armed. So I guess we have to live with how stupid an idea this is from a story point of view. The last time I had some "vehicle" experience in ME3 was using emplacement guns (shuttle, Palaven moon). Compared to the character combat gameplay, they were inferior. I'm OK if they leave out a not so good vehicle combat and concentrate on character combat gameplay. For the giggles I bet there will be roadkill opportunities along the way.
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Post by Adhin on Nov 14, 2016 12:17:07 GMT
Yeah, said it before (may even of been in this thread) but I'm hoping for some power sliding into enemies while getting outa the vehicle and triggering a biotic charge at whatevers left standing. If I can make that happen I'm gonna be pretty damn excited.
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The Elder King
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Post by The Elder King on Nov 14, 2016 12:31:49 GMT
Any open world game needs a "horse" as a means of getting quicker from A to B. From a gameplay perspective it makes sense for the Nomad to be a transportation vehicle. However, driving an unarmed vehicle on an alien planet with possible hostile inhabitants makes zero sense to me from a storytelling point of view. And that's what I personally don't like about the Nomad's purpose. Nobody goes exploring expecting to find only friendly Teletubbies. Again, from a game design perspective I get it. Like mentioned above, if the player can kill an enemy easily with the vehicle's cannon (as was the case in ME1), you have a combat imbalance. In ME1 it wasn't an issue because most enemies out in the open could only with a lot more effort be killed on foot. You COULD get out of the Mako and fight a tresher maw with your pistol, but it wasn't the smart thing to do. It's not what you were supposed to do. The armed Mako had no impact on 99% of combat. No issues. Would be different with the Nomad. So makes sense it's not armed. So I guess we have to live with how stupid an idea this is from a story point of view. That's how I feel. I understand the reasoning from a gameplay perspective but from a story is not really great.
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Post by wright1978 on Nov 14, 2016 13:00:16 GMT
I'm more than skeptical about Nomad right now. If it doesn't have weapons, it means that it's only purpose is to get across large areas of void. Which isn't a good thing no matter how you look at this. Just #emptySpace for the sake of #emptySpace. I had enough of these in DAI, trust me. Yeah i'm rather sceptical. A vehicle without any form of weaponry means we're either using it solely in areas completely devoid of any hostile lifeforms or we're going to be constantly forced to debus from the nomad. Whatever the faults of the mako at least it was designed with an actual gameplay and story purpose that was thought out.
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The Elder King
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Post by The Elder King on Nov 14, 2016 13:04:33 GMT
I'm more than skeptical about Nomad right now. If it doesn't have weapons, it means that it's only purpose is to get across large areas of void. Which isn't a good thing no matter how you look at this. Just #emptySpace for the sake of #emptySpace. I had enough of these in DAI, trust me. Yeah i'm rather sceptical. A vehicle without any form of weaponry means we're either using it solely in areas completely devoid of any hostile lifeforms or we're going to be constantly forced to debus from the nomad. Whatever the faults of the mako at least it was designed with an actual gameplay and story purpose that was thought out. Hostiles weren't the thing lacking in DAI's open world though.
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Post by Princess Trejo on Nov 17, 2016 18:26:12 GMT
We could always do the Trojan Horse trick on the hostile aliens.
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Post by kumazan on Nov 17, 2016 18:42:08 GMT
Yeah i'm rather sceptical. A vehicle without any form of weaponry means we're either using it solely in areas completely devoid of any hostile lifeforms or we're going to be constantly forced to debus from the nomad. Whatever the faults of the mako at least it was designed with an actual gameplay and story purpose that was thought out. Hostiles weren't the thing lacking in DAI's open world though. Indeed, it was rather the other way around, too many hostiles for the little amount of common folks you met to actually interact with.
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Post by RageUnderFire on Dec 4, 2016 1:22:48 GMT
this is my biggest gameplay concern. I read somewhere that the Mako will serve no direct combat function. Simply driving the Mako around to get from point A to point B could become a very boring repetitive task.
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Post by hammerstorm on Dec 4, 2016 1:25:16 GMT
Well, it is either that or a very boring walk that would be just as repetitive. We will see how they implement it.
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The Elder King
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Post by The Elder King on Dec 4, 2016 1:25:39 GMT
At least there won't be disappearing squadmates this time it might get boring, but it depends on how they designed the maps, I guess.
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Post by RageUnderFire on Dec 4, 2016 1:28:11 GMT
Well, it is either that or a very boring walk that would be just as repetitive. We will see how they implement it. At least there won't be disappearing squadmates this time it might get boring, but it depends on how they designed the maps, I guess. If it can't be used to fire at enemies, perhaps it will serve as cover? Also running over enemies
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Post by Wheeljack on Dec 4, 2016 1:40:15 GMT
We won't be riding the Mako, at all. Now the Nomad is another matter entirely... Though, more seriously, I'm looking forward to testing the new vehicle out! I never really had a problem with the Mako, but then I probably had way too much fun veering into stuff and watching it roll or bounce into lava. Pretty sure no one in their right mind would have let my Shepard drive after the first mission. The whole thing was so bad that I can't help but be nolstagic about it nowadays.
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Post by warbaby2 on Dec 4, 2016 1:54:26 GMT
I dunno... if the maps are big enough for a fast transport vehicle to be useful, than it'll be fine, I guess. The problem with the Mako in ME1 was the fact that it was your primary means of planetary gameplay, period. For that, it was far to clunky and boring to use.
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The Elder King
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Post by The Elder King on Dec 4, 2016 1:58:31 GMT
I dunno... if the maps are big enough for a fast transport vehicle to be useful, than it'll be fine, I guess. The problem with the Mako in ME1 was the fact that it was your primary means of planetary gameplay, period. For that, it was far to clunky and boring to use. Well, the game didn't require the Mako to be used for fighting. I did several playthroughs were I used my sniper rifle for killing every enemies I was supposed to kill with the Mako. It was fun.
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Post by themikefest on Dec 4, 2016 2:26:33 GMT
I hope they have a trophy called "Its Evel Knievel in Andromeda." Make a jump over 500m in the Nomad
Looking forward to driving the thing and running over anything that's in the way.
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Post by lilyenachaos on Dec 4, 2016 2:28:48 GMT
It would be neat if there was squadmate banter while we were driving too.
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