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Post by javeart on Dec 23, 2016 18:57:54 GMT
That is what I am gathering as well, but it is still a Jack-of-All-Trades to start out, you just chose to either specialize to replicate the class system the best you can, or to spread out your talents more, and gain less points in each. But you still lose the feel of the identity that Class gave.
The sort of when you talk about your character in a game is incorporated with gender, race and alignment to form fairly precise picture of what your character is.
If we get a Pathfinder vs Soldier duality, that probably will start substituting for the class identity. We'll see.
Overall, the absence of classes in the ME:A (along with the length of the campaign and the micro-management crafting/gifts/etc aspects of the game) does influence me to think in terms of running the SP campaign once, and play MP the rest of the time (& catch up on the DA story for story-telling fix).
That's what I dislike the most of all this, and that's probably my biggest problem with DAI in the end: it seems like they're rewarding very long pts with not much narrative content where you can get almost everything (like in Skyrim, I think it's a good reference in this regard) and not encouraging replayability as much as other games did, which is a shame for me, because I'd like it to be exactly the other way around
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Post by Muddy Boots on Dec 23, 2016 19:12:53 GMT
Surely the kit swapping is only going to be as far as you have leveled up into those builds? I don't see the game handing you everything from the get go. Quote: "you basically level up your character, you assign your points, and you can rearrange those points as you need to."So if you are offended that your Adept might go all Vanguard, don't spec any points into Vanguard (problem solved) That's how I took it. It doesn't mean you're going to be all-powerful with every single style capped. I think you'll still have to make choices about how you want to play. I'm keeping an open mind and waiting to see what they actually have planned. I did play an MMO that did something similar, though at some point you literally could max out all skills and abilities. I still don't think this is how ME will do it, but who knows? That said, I agree. Nobody is saying you'll have to swap out. Edit: Nope. I just read the article and it reads as though you can move your points around at will. A little strange to me, but then again, you still aren't forced to do so. It seems that stopping in the middle of combat to change all your points would be more than a little cumbersome. But that's just me. And I don't see myself changing because if you can be anything at any time, why have squad mates with skills? Personally, I'm a one-trick pony.
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Post by Amirit on Dec 23, 2016 19:14:18 GMT
So, I read the article and yes, different personalities for both Scott and Sara as PC... I'm not sure how I feel about that, I do want a PC with more of a personality than the Inquisitor, so I guess it's good news, but I did like that Shepard was just Shepard regardless of the gender... And from a very selfish point of view, just thinking of my personal preferences, I don't really like playing male PCs and it would suck if it turns out that I like Scott "personality" better I panicked a bit too before I read the article and now as confused as you are. Though, now I begin to think that he did in fact meant "different reaction from NPC sibling" and slightly different presentation of of the same dialog options adjusted to the gender. At least I want to think this Because taking away character personality would be too much even for modern BW.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 23, 2016 19:25:11 GMT
That is what I am gathering as well, but it is still a Jack-of-All-Trades to start out, you just chose to either specialize to replicate the class system the best you can, or to spread out your talents more, and gain less points in each. But you still lose the feel of the identity that Class gave.
The sort of when you talk about your character in a game is incorporated with gender, race and alignment to form fairly precise picture of what your character is.
If we get a Pathfinder vs Soldier duality, that probably will start substituting for the class identity. We'll see.
Overall, the absence of classes in the ME:A (along with the length of the campaign and the micro-management crafting/gifts/etc aspects of the game) does influence me to think in terms of running the SP campaign once, and play MP the rest of the time (& catch up on the DA story for story-telling fix).
That's what I dislike the most of all this, and that's probably my biggest problem with DAI in the end: it seems like they're rewarding very long pts with not much narrative content where you can get almost everything (like in Skyrim, I think it's a good reference in this regard) and not encouraging replayability as much as other games did, which is a shame for me, because I'd like it to be exactly the other way around I do not mind the pt to be tacked into the MP mode rather than reruns of the SP, but I do hope that the campaign is not prohibitively long, to at least do male and female. I guess, that is where someone like me with 2-3 hrs per day runs at cross-purposes with someone who plays 5-8 hrs daily. I am really surprised to see bio starting to orient their games towards the less casual time-investment. Must be alll the MMO staff they took in over the years.
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Post by fade9wayz on Dec 23, 2016 20:33:21 GMT
Ah! I so called the different personalities for Scott and Sara. I'm glad. Having two supposedly different protagonists sharing the exact same personality would have been such stupid writing, and would have made no sense to me. Somehow, I expect it might be a little based off on the VA's. Tom sounds like a generally steady, analytical kind of guy, and Fryda sounds a bit more outgoing. It is inevitable I will prefer one over the other, though I don't know which yet, but that will not mean the one I like less is bad (unless the writing is truly awful, but considering how enthusiastic Tom, a MET fan, was about it, I feel cautiously hopeful it won't be a narrative disaster).
Edit: I don't have much expectations it will be some grandiose narrative to begin with, I never do with video games. I admit I'll be happy if it's coherent and entertaining enough. At least with two different personalities, I already feel more compelled to do multiple playthrough. Something I don't see the point of with TW3, and most other SP games.
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Post by sjsharp2010 on Dec 23, 2016 20:49:42 GMT
Ah! I so called the different personalities for Scott and Sara. I'm glad. Having two supposedly different protagonists sharing the exact same personality would have been such stupid writing, and would have made no sense to me. Somehow, I expect it might be a little based off on the VA's. Tom sounds like a generally steady, analytical kind of guy, and Fryda sounds a bit more outgoing. It is inevitable I will prefer one over the other, though I don't know which yet, but that will not mean the one I like less is bad (unless the writing is truly awful, but considering how enthusiastic Tom, a MET fan, was about it, I feel cautiously hopeful it won't be a narrative disaster). Me too I'm kind of glad they're 2 different characters gives us moer of a reason to play both to see the various differences.
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Post by colfoley on Dec 23, 2016 21:16:17 GMT
So two pieces of interesting news. First of all...I am very intrigued about this multi personality thing. On the one hand having a larger base to launch from sometimes helps out the role playing. The more solid the foundation, the better it is to actually role play a specific character I have found. At least in general...see Hawke. What I worry about is their ability to execute and pull it off, without pissing people off. Me included. They are playing a very interesting game and the balance is the key. On the flip side...replayibility frak yeah.
My read on this whole 'swappable profile thing' is...based on the information we know, if we unlock and are using various skills and powers through the game at any given time the profile will 'unlock' which will give the player the option to invest in those, likely three, particular skills and give them bonuses. So if you are a combat type person it'll likely give you Overkill, Adrenaline Rush, and Marksman, for instance. But then, if you unlock another profile by speccing into those powers at some point decide, "I want to be an engineer", and then run those specific skills and bonuses that gives you. It does not mean you "forget" the other skills. No more then logging off Microsoft Word and loading Mass Effect on my computer means its forgotten Word. At the worse you will have to temporarily "delte" those programs on your omni tool and then reload them at a later time. And, for more of a gameplay related reference, it does not mean Kara Trevelyan "forgot" how to use leaping shot just because I specced her into "explosive shot". She still knew how to use the former, but preffered the latter.
Which I wish they did something like this for the Original Triology. It made no sense to me that my Sentinel Cameron Shepard could use this amazing ability with his Omni tool known as Tech Armor and yet my soldier Abigail Shepard couldn't 'download' that program onto her Omni tool and use it. Especially when it matched her gameplay style a bit more then it did his. Granted it gets a little wonky when you introduce Biotics into the equation, but if we just assume the pathfinder is a biotic, then there is that explanation.
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Post by akots on Dec 23, 2016 21:18:27 GMT
This reminds me a lot of Kingdom of Amalur... which makes sense, considering they have the same gameplay designer. Anyone played that game? As others said already, combat is really the shining point of KoA. It is seamless and quite precise at the same time. Despite the fact that the game has been out for quite some time, there is nothing that comes even close. Well, maybe Dishonored has similar feeling of overall fluidity once you get comfortable with controls. KoA also had most excellent systems of crafting, looting and leveling/respec. Reasonably complex but clearly described and rewarding. Soundtrek was not very memorable but also generally good. Unfortunately, overall plot, dialog, and general world design in KoA are not so stellar. So, it is a mediocre RPG with super-duper fun combat. I played through the whole game plus DLCs twice and enjoyed it immensely. Just make sure to skip most of the dialogs. It will be hard for MEA to get to the same degree of fluidity in combat. Knowing how Bioware likes to put some animations in its games that cannot be interrupted, this may significantly and adversely impact the immersion. In KoA essentially any animation can be interrupted, controls are very responsive on PC, shooting and aiming powers require precision, etc. etc. Well, nobody really cares as long there is a sort of a pause button in single player. But in the case of DAIMP, the animations were just blindly transferred from SP into MP and that ... did not go well. Whereas ME3MP completely reworked the system and made it reasonable.
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Post by Iakus on Dec 23, 2016 21:21:03 GMT
Well I thought that the no-restrictions things was going to be just more about combining powers as you will, this profiles thing sounds less apealing to me... I'm not really interested in switching between adept or infiltrator "load outs", sounds a bit like we're headed to a PC that will be able to do just anything once we get a high level or am I understanding it wrong? I hope at least that there's no real need to switch between profiles and that you can actually choose to play the whole game as more of a pure infitrator, soldier or whatever if you want to Sounds like Ryder=Transformer Pathfinders! Roll out!
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Post by Iakus on Dec 23, 2016 21:22:09 GMT
I'll have to see how they explain it. Why can this suddenly be the case in the ME setting? It's never been this way before, so unless they add in an explanation, it's going to kind of shit all over the lore from the first trilogy. It kind of ruins Shep a bit. I get that you don't have to do it, but it just feels like another step away from the stuff that I loved about ME to begin with. Combat wasn't originally the focus of the series, but it's becoming more and more in that direction. I'll still play it, but I'll end up finding my style in spite of the new system, not because of it. I think that, philosophically, it's just another example of how the series is moving further away from what I love about Bioware games and moving towards a more generic "casual fan" type of game. But, again, I'll have to see it play out before I can say this for sure. It's just my knee-jerk reaction to this news. They've already said in previous articles/interviews that there is an in-game reason for why Ryder can switch abilities. It was something to do with being a Pathfinder. My guess is that it is related to Sam. Sam can make you non-biotic?
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Post by Beerfish on Dec 23, 2016 21:29:29 GMT
Maybe the pathfinder stumbles on a bowling ball that makes his/her hand glow green and gives them these abilities?
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Post by Iakus on Dec 23, 2016 21:32:23 GMT
Maybe the pathfinder stumbles on a bowling ball that makes his/her hand glow green and gives them these abilities? Nah, this is science fiction, not fantasy. I'm betting on "organic energy"
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Post by sosolaris on Dec 23, 2016 22:10:39 GMT
I'm still disappointed about this, to be honest. I don't think "tactical pause" would be as intrusive as they think it is. This just feels more like BioWare is continuing their habit of fixing things that weren't broken in the first place.
Ehhh.
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Post by Link"Guess"ski on Dec 23, 2016 22:37:54 GMT
My biggest beef with his comment on tactical pausing is that he refers to it as "turn-based style". Ugh, such ignorance.
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Post by colfoley on Dec 23, 2016 22:42:10 GMT
I don't honestly get why they don't implement something like the XCOM TPS or more specifically Witcher 3 where going to a wheel does not entirely stop the action just slows it down. If they are so worried about interupting pacing that seems to be the way to go.
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Post by Vall on Dec 23, 2016 22:46:38 GMT
I honestly don't care how they implement skill trees as long as I can be sword-wielding biotic rogue Also, love different personalities for Sara and Scott, especially if they more or less align with Fryda's and Tom's personalities
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Post by Link"Guess"ski on Dec 23, 2016 22:48:23 GMT
One thing I hope is that - and I have confidence in Montreal on this one - that there will still be cutscene variations depending on your playstyle, so if you've unlocked an "adept" title by selecting the required abilities in the skill-tree certain cutscenes will show you using biotics rather than tech or weaponry, like in Omega DLC where it actually mattered a little bit. (Citadel DLC as well)
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Post by sandalisthemaker on Dec 23, 2016 22:49:35 GMT
Hmmm.... I'm just hoping that this kit swapping is entirely optional. I will be more than happy to not put any skill points into multiple class types. I like having a specific skill set for my PC with things they can do well, and things they can't do at all. It makes companions/squad mates more important. Hopefully we aren't forced to switch between these 'kits' or whatever, and aren't given starting abilities from every 'class' type from the beginning of the game. Even if it's just the starting tutorial. Now I keep thinking of this tutorial scenario where the game pauses and tells me: 'Now switch to your biotic power to take out those ranged targets!!!' and doesn't let me proceed until I do so, I will be quite peeved. I don't like playing as a biotic for the same reason I don't like playing as a mage in DA. I don't like my characters to be special. Yes, I know the simple fact of being the PC automatically means your character is special in BioWare games, but I like the idea of not having magic or biotic powers. So don't force them on me please. In regards to Pathfinder!Scott and Pathfinder!Sara having different personalities- I am fine with this. I've listened to the various interviews of both voice actors, and especially with the one where they are together- and I keep getting the vibe that Scott is more 'Yin' and Sara is more 'Yang.' So this doesn't surprise me. I rather like the idea.
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Post by Link"Guess"ski on Dec 23, 2016 22:54:25 GMT
Hmmm.... I'm just hoping that this kit swapping is entirely optional. I will be more than happy to not put any skill points into multiple class types. I like having a specific skill set for my PC with things they can do well, and things they can't do at all. It makes companions/squad mates more important. Hopefully we aren't forced to switch between these 'kits' or whatever, and aren't given starting abilities from every 'class' type from the beginning of the game. Even if it's just the starting tutorial. Now I keep thinking of this tutorial scenario where the game pauses and tells me: 'Now switch to your biotic power to take out those ranged targets!!!' and doesn't let me proceed until I do so, I will be quite peeved. I don't like playing as a biotic for the same reason I don't like playing as a mage in DA. I don't like my characters to be special. Yes, I know the simple fact of being the PC automatically means your character is special in BioWare games, but I like the idea of not having magic or biotic powers. So don't force them on me please. In regards to Pathfinder!Scott and Pathfinder!Sara having different personalities- I am fine with this. I've listened to the various interviews of both voice actors, and especially with the one where they are together- and I keep getting the vibe that Scott is more 'Yin' and Sara is more 'Yang.' So this doesn't surprise me. I rather like the idea. The approach they're taking sounds like Witcher 3 to be honest, where you have all talent trees available and you just have to commit to whichever one you like to unlock certain abilities and then once you have earned an ability you have to activate it to make use of it. It sounds like we'll have to unlock plenty and then select the few ones we want. There's no "pausing" apparently and all gameplay footage only shows 3 active abilities at once so I'm guessing that's how it works. They commented earlier that this time you'd have to scroll through abilities instead of pausing and selecting, but the more I think about it the more I think they meant what I just described above, so you only have 3 abilities per combat scenario and then if you want to change it, you'll have to switch around your build in a menu.
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Post by sosolaris on Dec 23, 2016 22:55:34 GMT
My biggest beef with his comment on tactical pausing is that he refers to it as "turn-based style". Ugh, such ignorance. Yeah I wasn't sure why he brought up turn based at first.
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Post by wright1978 on Dec 23, 2016 22:57:52 GMT
*´¨) ¸.•´¸.•*´¨) ¸.•*¨) (¸.•´ (¸.•` ¤ Mass Effect Andromeda
**There may be spoiler ahoy in the interview. ** Mike said: 1- Brought back many of the systems we had not done like crafting and elements of progression. 2- Sara and Scott will react differently to situations or people because of their own personalities. 3- Same story for both of them but writers gave them different responses. Not sure I like the sounds of it. Sounds like established personalities for protagonists rather than player getting a say into characterising them. getting prepared for reams of characterised auto-dialogue.
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Post by Space Cowboy on Dec 23, 2016 23:07:21 GMT
What came to my mind regarding the ability switching was weapon load outs.
If I switch from vanguard to infiltrator does my shotgun morph into a sniper rifle, or does the game let us carry around as many weapon types as we like?
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Post by peebee on Dec 23, 2016 23:24:47 GMT
It's weird to read this after just having played the Asteroid X57 DLC on Mass Effect 1 and choosing not to fight Balak so people could survive, instead of letting him blow everyone up just so I could kill him.
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Post by colfoley on Dec 23, 2016 23:27:36 GMT
What came to my mind regarding the ability switching was weapon load outs. If I switch from vanguard to infiltrator does my shotgun morph into a sniper rifle, or does the game let us carry around as many weapon types as we like? Maybe not as many as you like but we have seen you can carry, say, different weapons of the some type into battle. So yes, you can carry all da weapons.
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Post by hammerstorm on Dec 23, 2016 23:40:15 GMT
It's weird to read this after just having played the Asteroid X57 DLC on Mass Effect 1 and choosing not to fight Balak so people could survive, instead of letting him blow everyone up just so I could kill him. I have seen that there seem to be many people that see that comment as if he said: "there will only be fighting and that is all we have done on ME". I took it more that he meant that the fighting is in the majority of missions. I would be really surprised if there isn't any missions that can be solved without killing. Just like in OT the bigger part of the game WAS shoot the bad guy. That didn't mean that was all there was.
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