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Post by KaiserShep on Feb 21, 2017 5:58:20 GMT
Bonus points if squaddies can complain that they don't get to jump around with a jet pack like Ryder can. Which makes me wonder….If they aren't as mobile, how often will we find ourselves separated from them or simply having them constantly spawn next to you?
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Post by Element Zero on Feb 21, 2017 6:01:14 GMT
Bonus points if squaddies can complain that they don't get to jump around with a jet pack like Ryder can. I've assumed they will use jump-jets, at least a bit. Otherwise, how will they keep up with us during climbs or multi-elevation combat? Please, no DAI teleportation in a puff of smoke. :/
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Post by amoebae on Feb 21, 2017 6:04:37 GMT
Bonus points if squaddies can complain that they don't get to jump around with a jet pack like Ryder can. I've assumed they will use jump-jets, at least a bit. Otherwise, how will they keep up with us during climbs or multi-elevation combat? Please, no DAI teleportation in a puff of smoke. :/ These are both good points. It's not something I'd considered until now. They're going to have to have their own jet packs, right? Even so, I bet my bum there will still be more magical teleportations than usual.
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Post by KaiserShep on Feb 21, 2017 6:04:43 GMT
Bonus points if squaddies can complain that they don't get to jump around with a jet pack like Ryder can. I've assumed they will use jump-jets, at least a bit. Otherwise, how will they keep up with us during climbs or multi-elevation combat? Please, no DAI teleportation in a puff of smoke. :/ I just can't imagine how the follower AI would properly make use of the jump jet in the first place. Maybe for strafing back and forth to dodge enemy fire, much like how clone Shepard can do combat rolls, but actually managing to jump through multiple levels seems beyond their capacity. It seems a lot more elaborate than followers automatically jumping over gaps like in ME3, but follower spawning is something that already happens in Inquisition. Like, if you're jumping up levels on a small cliff, the companions will eventually spawn above you. In any case, we can clearly see that at least Cora and Liam have more basic suits without jump jets, whereas I'm guessing that your PC always have one no matter the armor.
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Post by amoebae on Feb 21, 2017 6:09:57 GMT
In that video where they first announced jetpacks... where they're in the vault I think... did it show what happened with the squad after Ryder jetpacked across the gap to the platform/other side?
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Post by Element Zero on Feb 21, 2017 6:11:54 GMT
I've assumed they will use jump-jets, at least a bit. Otherwise, how will they keep up with us during climbs or multi-elevation combat? Please, no DAI teleportation in a puff of smoke. :/ These are both good points. It's not something I'd considered until now. They're going to have to have their own jet packs, right? Even so, I bet my bum there will still be more magical teleportations than usual. I've assumed they will use jump-jets, at least a bit. Otherwise, how will they keep up with us during climbs or multi-elevation combat? Please, no DAI teleportation in a puff of smoke. :/ I just can't imagine how the follower AI would properly make use of the jump jet in the first place. Maybe for strafing back and forth to dodge enemy fire, much like how clone Shepard can do combat rolls, but actually managing to jump through multiple levels seems beyond their capacity. I think they will definitely have jet packs; will definitely suck at using them to keep up; will absolutely teleport (it wouldn't be a BioWare game, otherwise); and will definitely not be able to use them in combat like Ryder can.
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Post by KaiserShep on Feb 21, 2017 6:11:56 GMT
In that video where they first announced jetpacks... where they're in the vault I think... did it show what happened with the squad after Ryder jetpacked across the gap to the platform/other side? No. The entire playable sequence shows Ryder by himself. You don't see another character until the cut scene kicks in.
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Post by KaiserShep on Feb 21, 2017 6:13:29 GMT
These are both good points. It's not something I'd considered until now. They're going to have to have their own jet packs, right? Even so, I bet my bum there will still be more magical teleportations than usual. I just can't imagine how the follower AI would properly make use of the jump jet in the first place. Maybe for strafing back and forth to dodge enemy fire, much like how clone Shepard can do combat rolls, but actually managing to jump through multiple levels seems beyond their capacity. I think they will definitely have jet packs; will definitely suck at using them to keep up; will absolutely teleport (it wouldn't be a BioWare game, otherwise); and will definitely not be able to use them in combat like Ryder can. I'm seriously doubting that anyone will have one, especially Drack.
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Post by Element Zero on Feb 21, 2017 6:15:33 GMT
In that video where they first announced jetpacks... where they're in the vault I think... did it show what happened with the squad after Ryder jetpacked across the gap to the platform/other side? Not that I recall. We had squaddies jumping with us in ME3. I can't imagine they won't be able to jet-boost up a rock face or to a higher platform to follow us. I don't expect them to be as agile as we are in combat, but I'm sure they'll keep up reasonably well, with the occasional teleport, otherwise.
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Post by The Elder King on Feb 21, 2017 6:16:48 GMT
In that video where they first announced jetpacks... where they're in the vault I think... did it show what happened with the squad after Ryder jetpacked across the gap to the platform/other side? No. The entire playable sequence shows Ryder by himself. You don't see another character until the cut scene kicks in. They were intentionally cut off from that footage. They weren't with Ryder even when he was just walking. I don't know how much teleporting there'll be in, but I don't think it'll be like that footage. On the topic of squad commands, I don't like much this choice (although they said squadmates can still be used to make combos), but to be fair, we didn't just suspect this. Shinobi definitely said this before, after the GI issue, and maybe some devs as well. It was already confirmed before.
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Post by The Elder King on Feb 21, 2017 6:19:09 GMT
I think they will definitely have jet packs; will definitely suck at using them to keep up; will absolutely teleport (it wouldn't be a BioWare game, otherwise); and will definitely not be able to use them in combat like Ryder can. I'm seriously doubting that anyone will have one, especially Drack. That wouldn't make much sense if krogans in MP will have jetpacks, which will surely happen.
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Post by Element Zero on Feb 21, 2017 6:20:45 GMT
I think they will definitely have jet packs; will definitely suck at using them to keep up; will absolutely teleport (it wouldn't be a BioWare game, otherwise); and will definitely not be able to use them in combat like Ryder can. I'm seriously doubting that anyone will have one, especially Drack. Then they won't be able to believably explore with us. They pretty much have to have them. Cora and Liam are part of the Pathfinder team, same as Ryder. It stands to reason that their kit would match pretty well. Once Drack joins the team, why wouldn't he equip himself accordingly? His greater mass isn't an issue, considering the technological basis of this IP. The smallest mass effect field, generated by his hardsuit (something we've discussed in other threads), could reduce his mass for easier propulsion.
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Post by cloud9 on Feb 21, 2017 8:00:47 GMT
The animations are choppy than ever and I see no fluid organic movement whatsoever and they look like reused ME1 animations with jetpack, hell even ME3 animations are better in my opinion, and the graphics look like a downgrade compared to other games that is better than the demo. It doesn't look as impressive as I have expected it's like they're adding features but not improving or fixing the common problems such as animations and gunplay.
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Post by colfoley on Feb 21, 2017 9:39:07 GMT
Of course I played the original trilogy in fact I am playing the original trilogy right now in preparation for ME A. And almost done with it actually (and sadly). And I think I have only specifically told my squad mate to use a power once throughout the entire three games up to this point. Usually your squad was pretty good at determining what powers they should use all by themselves. The problem is that you played weapon specialists pretty exclusively, no? That being the case, you're not realizing that we casters used squaddie powers constantly to set up power combos. If shinobi is correct, and I see no reason to doubt him in this case, I'm definitely put off by this. It's what we suspected for a long while, but confirmation makes it worse. I'd like to see squaddies in action ASAP. I don't have much faith in their ability to program intelligent AI that can reliably partner with me in a precise way. I feel like they're trying to emulate MP in the SP campaign. "Here, meet Cora and Liam, you're semi-autonomous adventuring buddies." I know this is an exaggeration, but it's how I'm feeling, at the moment. Sure, I have. But, that is one of the reasons why you can, if you want, set up your own combos because there are no longer cooldowns across all of your powers. So, you can set up and detonate all the explosions you want to. And BioWare has said you can set up combos with squadmates or have them set up their own combos. And, I had no problem setting up combos (usually tech and fiery explosions) with my pure gun slinger 'Soldier' Shepard. Either me detonating theirs, or them detonating mine. Its how I came up with the phrase "James make them explode" from the Javik mission, which was the third mission I ran of my first PT of ME 3. Incendiary ammo + Shepard's Concussive Shot or James's Carnage...fiery death. Sure I am a little concerned about the team AI too and I do wonder if there is some way they will go around this, but right now, I don't see a lot of problems with the combat system as it exists now.
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Post by Thrombin on Feb 21, 2017 12:46:16 GMT
Honestly I think I would be a lot more put out if this were Dragon Age, but it isn't. Mass Effect has always been fairly protagonist centric and about the protag rolling in and knocking over people left and right with biotic and tech attacks, etc, etc, etc. In combat the squadmates were just window dressing. Unlike over in the Dragon Age universe where squad mate synergy was the point. That just isn't true. Just because you played the combat with the equivalent of one hand tied behind your back doesn't mean that the synergies between squad mates and coordinating their powers wasn't a huge part of the Mass Effect combat system. It was just a huge part that you ignored! I reckon I used pause after pretty much every kill or cool down in every battle in every run through of every version of the game! The synergy in Dragon Age is nowhere near as significant. In fact I can't even think of any synergies in Dragon Age combat at all If there are any I've never paid much attention to them! Now I'm not saying that the new system won't be just as enjoyable as the old one. I can probably adjust and if the squad mate AI is clever enough then just telling them to target your target could be enough to have them strip shields for your biotics to work or set primers for your detonators (or vice-versa). Certainly I would never have trusted the old system to be that clever but if they can swing that then I have hope that at least the squad mate synergies will still work. I'm still going to miss the opportunity to pause and assess the battlefield though. That was also pretty key for me.
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Post by Madflavor on Feb 21, 2017 12:54:20 GMT
Confirmation that we cannot in any way tell our squad what powers to use during battle, with or without pause: "You can command your squadmates where to go and who to attack, but not their powers." Gotta say, this is the first bit of news about Andromeda that I'm truly disappointed about. I wasn't even that upset about the three power limit, since I assumed I could rely on directed squadmate power usage to compensate for whatever I lacked (barring the favorites system). And now that's gone, supposedly. Ah, I suppose I'll just have to wait until they expand on it more in the gameplay series, but I'd be lying if I said my previous optimism wasn't at all dented. We've always had the option to command our party to us their powers. So for them to remove this feature in the 4th game, it has to be a very intentional design choice. Perhaps it was for balancing reasons. I'm not happy about it, but I'm willing to reserve judgement when I get my hands on the game.
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Post by Element Zero on Feb 21, 2017 13:24:16 GMT
The problem is that you played weapon specialists pretty exclusively, no? That being the case, you're not realizing that we casters used squaddie powers constantly to set up power combos. If shinobi is correct, and I see no reason to doubt him in this case, I'm definitely put off by this. It's what we suspected for a long while, but confirmation makes it worse. I'd like to see squaddies in action ASAP. I don't have much faith in their ability to program intelligent AI that can reliably partner with me in a precise way. I feel like they're trying to emulate MP in the SP campaign. "Here, meet Cora and Liam, you're semi-autonomous adventuring buddies." I know this is an exaggeration, but it's how I'm feeling, at the moment. Sure, I have. But, that is one of the reasons why you can, if you want, set up your own combos because there are no longer cooldowns across all of your powers. So, you can set up and detonate all the explosions you want to. And BioWare has said you can set up combos with squadmates or have them set up their own combos. And, I had no problem setting up combos (usually tech and fiery explosions) with my pure gun slinger 'Soldier' Shepard. Either me detonating theirs, or them detonating mine. Its how I came up with the phrase "James make them explode" from the Javik mission, which was the third mission I ran of my first PT of ME 3. Incendiary ammo + Shepard's Concussive Shot or James's Carnage...fiery death. Sure I am a little concerned about the team AI too and I do wonder if there is some way they will go around this, but right now, I don't see a lot of problems with the combat system as it exists now. These examples don't exactly translate well. Incendiary Ammo sets everything ablaze. A Soldier with a properly specced Concussive Shot can set off explosions every two seconds, or so. The weapon-focused classes are the most powerful classes in ME3, as much as I poke fun at the stupidly OP Nova-Vanguard, because those classes optimize your weapon damage as you progress. The casters, on the other hand, needed their constant explosions to hope to even appear to keep pace with a weapon user. Constant explosions meant using companions' abilities to supplement our own. Playing an Adept? Javik + Liara is an insanely good squad to bring along, since the BEs just keep on coming. With MEA, we do get rid of universal cooldown, as you say. That means that the initial "self-combo" will be essentially automatic. The individual cooldowns, though, are much longer, now. This means more gunplay in between powers (boo!) or relying upon squaddies' powers to supplement our own. I know they will contribute in some fashion. It just likely won't be as precise as "Shepard Warp - Liara Warp - Javik Dark Channel - Shepard Throw - Liara Warp - Shepard Warp, etc..." I'm eager to see how helpful these new squaddies are in combat. I'm used to having powers on demand. That's how I choose my crew. If they're just meatshields with weapons, now, I'll be disappointed.
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Post by The Elder King on Feb 21, 2017 13:54:11 GMT
Sure, I have. But, that is one of the reasons why you can, if you want, set up your own combos because there are no longer cooldowns across all of your powers. So, you can set up and detonate all the explosions you want to. And BioWare has said you can set up combos with squadmates or have them set up their own combos. And, I had no problem setting up combos (usually tech and fiery explosions) with my pure gun slinger 'Soldier' Shepard. Either me detonating theirs, or them detonating mine. Its how I came up with the phrase "James make them explode" from the Javik mission, which was the third mission I ran of my first PT of ME 3. Incendiary ammo + Shepard's Concussive Shot or James's Carnage...fiery death. Sure I am a little concerned about the team AI too and I do wonder if there is some way they will go around this, but right now, I don't see a lot of problems with the combat system as it exists now. These examples don't exactly translate well. Incendiary Ammo sets everything ablaze. A Soldier with a properly specced Concussive Shot can set off explosions every two seconds, or so. The weapon-focused classes are the most powerful classes in ME3, as much as I poke fun at the stupidly OP Nova-Vanguard, because those classes optimize your weapon damage as you progress. The casters, on the other hand, needed their constant explosions to hope to even appear to keep pace with a weapon user. Constant explosions meant using companions' abilities to supplement our own. Playing an Adept? Javik + Liara is an insanely good squad to bring along, since the BEs just keep on coming. With MEA, we do get rid of universal cooldown, as you say. That means that the initial "self-combo" will be essentially automatic. The individual cooldowns, though, are much longer, now. This means more gunplay in between powers (boo!) or relying upon squaddies' powers to supplement our own. I know they will contribute in some fashion. It just likely won't be as precise as "Shepard Warp - Liara Warp - Javik Dark Channel - Shepard Throw - Liara Warp - Shepard Warp, etc..." I'm eager to see how helpful these new squaddies are in combat. I'm used to having powers on demand. That's how I choose my crew. If they're just meatshields with weapons, now, I'll be disappointed. I think Bioware should try to improve on squadmate AI in general because they were always meat shields. The only different is that you used them to set up combo before. I'd like if they eventually reach a level where they can function without commanding them. Not because I don't want to to that, but because they're utterly stupid if you don't control every single step they make, so far. They still have access to powers and the devs said they can still be used to make combos. While concerned, I'll wait until the next video to form an opinion on the issue.
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Post by Element Zero on Feb 21, 2017 14:00:19 GMT
These examples don't exactly translate well. Incendiary Ammo sets everything ablaze. A Soldier with a properly specced Concussive Shot can set off explosions every two seconds, or so. The weapon-focused classes are the most powerful classes in ME3, as much as I poke fun at the stupidly OP Nova-Vanguard, because those classes optimize your weapon damage as you progress. The casters, on the other hand, needed their constant explosions to hope to even appear to keep pace with a weapon user. Constant explosions meant using companions' abilities to supplement our own. Playing an Adept? Javik + Liara is an insanely good squad to bring along, since the BEs just keep on coming. With MEA, we do get rid of universal cooldown, as you say. That means that the initial "self-combo" will be essentially automatic. The individual cooldowns, though, are much longer, now. This means more gunplay in between powers (boo!) or relying upon squaddies' powers to supplement our own. I know they will contribute in some fashion. It just likely won't be as precise as "Shepard Warp - Liara Warp - Javik Dark Channel - Shepard Throw - Liara Warp - Shepard Warp, etc..." I'm eager to see how helpful these new squaddies are in combat. I'm used to having powers on demand. That's how I choose my crew. If they're just meatshields with weapons, now, I'll be disappointed. I think Bioware should try to improve on squadmate AI in general because they were always meat shields. The only different is that you used them to set up combo before. I'd like if they eventually reach a level where they can function without commanding them. Not because I don't want to to that, but because they're utterly stupid if you don't control every single step they make, so far. They still have access to powers and the devs said they can still be used to make combos. While concerned, I'll wait until the next video to form an opinion on the issue. It sounds like that might be BioWare's thinking, too; but I can't imagine this will work until we're all gaming on Watson: Gaming Edition.
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Post by KaiserShep on Feb 21, 2017 14:02:41 GMT
In that video where they first announced jetpacks... where they're in the vault I think... did it show what happened with the squad after Ryder jetpacked across the gap to the platform/other side? Not that I recall. We had squaddies jumping with us in ME3. I can't imagine they won't be able to jet-boost up a rock face or to a higher platform to follow us. I don't expect them to be as agile as we are in combat, but I'm sure they'll keep up reasonably well, with the occasional teleport, otherwise. Squaddies would climb ladders and hop over cover in ME3, but they may reach their limit at platforming. It would be nice if allies were able to jet up to our location, but I just don't trust that BioWare is able to get them to do this properly. Just look at how followers could not hop over gaps in Inquisition, even short ones. If they manage to achieve some basic pathfinding with that mechanic I'd be very surprised.
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Post by Element Zero on Feb 21, 2017 14:07:38 GMT
Not that I recall. We had squaddies jumping with us in ME3. I can't imagine they won't be able to jet-boost up a rock face or to a higher platform to follow us. I don't expect them to be as agile as we are in combat, but I'm sure they'll keep up reasonably well, with the occasional teleport, otherwise. Squaddies would climb ladders and hop over cover in ME3, but they may reach their limit at platforming. It would be nice if allies were able to jet up to our location, but I just don't trust that BioWare is able to get them to do this properly. Just look at how followers could not hop over gaps in Inquisition, even short ones. If they manage to achieve some basic pathfinding with that mechanic I'd be very surprised. DAI has its own unique, abysmal mechanics, so I never consider it when thinking of Mass Effect. I expect that they'll at least be able to traverse the landscape with us, vertical or otherwise. (I sure hope so!) I can definitely understand your skepticism. They don't have the best track record. Skepticism is likely the safe course.
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Raising Hell with the Flavor XX
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate
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Post by Ivory Samoan on Feb 21, 2017 15:09:14 GMT
Confirmation that we cannot in any way tell our squad what powers to use during battle, with or without pause: "You can command your squadmates where to go and who to attack, but not their powers." Pretty much how it worked in the trilogy. Not sure which trilogy you are referring to....it can't be the Mass Effect one, since that's completely wrong..lol. Oooosh...this is a bit of a blow (although from the footage, it looked like only go and attack were commands), I am dissappoint I must say :/ Hopefully this is a non-issue and squadmate AI is next level good. Your team will need to be so on point re: combos and stuff....since you can't manage their cooldowns now then I'm wondering how that will work if you think you've primed the target for a Cora detonation.....but oh snap, she's run out of juice since she wasted her nova and charge on a trash mob instead of this big boss in front of me *cue death music*. Please be a motherfucking non-issue....pretty please with cherries on top haha....
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Post by longshadow on Feb 21, 2017 15:24:36 GMT
Sure, I have. But, that is one of the reasons why you can, if you want, set up your own combos because there are no longer cooldowns across all of your powers. So, you can set up and detonate all the explosions you want to. And BioWare has said you can set up combos with squadmates or have them set up their own combos. And, I had no problem setting up combos (usually tech and fiery explosions) with my pure gun slinger 'Soldier' Shepard. Either me detonating theirs, or them detonating mine. Its how I came up with the phrase "James make them explode" from the Javik mission, which was the third mission I ran of my first PT of ME 3. Incendiary ammo + Shepard's Concussive Shot or James's Carnage...fiery death. Sure I am a little concerned about the team AI too and I do wonder if there is some way they will go around this, but right now, I don't see a lot of problems with the combat system as it exists now. These examples don't exactly translate well. Incendiary Ammo sets everything ablaze. A Soldier with a properly specced Concussive Shot can set off explosions every two seconds, or so. The weapon-focused classes are the most powerful classes in ME3, as much as I poke fun at the stupidly OP Nova-Vanguard, because those classes optimize your weapon damage as you progress. The casters, on the other hand, needed their constant explosions to hope to even appear to keep pace with a weapon user. Constant explosions meant using companions' abilities to supplement our own. Playing an Adept? Javik + Liara is an insanely good squad to bring along, since the BEs just keep on coming. With MEA, we do get rid of universal cooldown, as you say. That means that the initial "self-combo" will be essentially automatic. The individual cooldowns, though, are much longer, now. This means more gunplay in between powers (boo!) or relying upon squaddies' powers to supplement our own. I know they will contribute in some fashion. It just likely won't be as precise as "Shepard Warp - Liara Warp - Javik Dark Channel - Shepard Throw - Liara Warp - Shepard Warp, etc..." I'm eager to see how helpful these new squaddies are in combat. I'm used to having powers on demand. That's how I choose my crew. If they're just meatshields with weapons, now, I'll be disappointed. Exactly! Another thing that I haven't seen mentioned here... The video had ZERO information about the special ammo types. They didn't even used them once in the entire video.
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Post by simsimillia on Feb 21, 2017 15:28:08 GMT
A thing I noticed, which might be nothing, but could be something. Later during the gameplay, a red beam appears on the screen, coming from an elevated position where an enemy sniper was. Could be that "Assassination" is making somehow a comeback, at least for enemies? If it does, I hope it won't be a OHK like in Mass Effect. Those were worse than Sync Kills.
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Element Zero on Feb 21, 2017 15:30:21 GMT
<snip> With MEA, we do get rid of universal cooldown, as you say. That means that the initial "self-combo" will be essentially automatic. The individual cooldowns, though, are much longer, now. This means more gunplay in between powers (boo!) or relying upon squaddies' powers to supplement our own. I know they will contribute in some fashion. It just likely won't be as precise as "Shepard Warp - Liara Warp - Javik Dark Channel - Shepard Throw - Liara Warp - Shepard Warp, etc..." I'm eager to see how helpful these new squaddies are in combat. I'm used to having powers on demand. That's how I choose my crew. If they're just meatshields with weapons, now, I'll be disappointed. Exactly! Another thing that I haven't seen mentioned here... The video had ZERO information about the special ammo types. They didn't even used them once in the entire video. What type of info are you hoping for in connection with the ammo?
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