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Post by Catilina on Apr 17, 2017 16:42:15 GMT
Oh my gosh, that default world state of all three games is so far off from what I did and all of my PTs so far. US which is whatever... We got our cure letter, but it makes me worried they're not going to follow that plot line, regardless of HoF involvement. didn't help find Sten's sword? <- how can he even return to his people to be the Arishok if he's shot on sight? NEar all of the side quests were not completed, which who does that, but I noticed it didn't matter one way or the other when I clicked them for my worlds but then, why even have the tiles for them? And Connor dies, but Ser Landry lives- we see connor in the live games, but I've never met Ser Landry since the first game. Both Avernus and Sophia killed? Why? Avernus is such an interesting plot point and they've already introduced the Cure plot line. Hawke died in the Fade? That's canon? Sigh. At least we got a slide about returning to Kirkwall with friend Varric if we didn't do that. They'll leave Hawke alone now. But what I'm most irritated about is teh Trespasser choices. Why is bull's betrayal canon? Why is keeping the Inquisition canon? Why is killing Solas canon? @_@ I suppose, this isn't canon, just a basic set up. |
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Post by Nightscrawl on Apr 17, 2017 16:49:49 GMT
Oh my gosh, that default world state of all three games is so far off from what I did and all of my PTs so far. US which is whatever... We got our cure letter, but it makes me worried they're not going to follow that plot line, regardless of HoF involvement. didn't help find Sten's sword? <- how can he even return to his people to be the Arishok if he's shot on sight? NEar all of the side quests were not completed, which who does that, but I noticed it didn't matter one way or the other when I clicked them for my worlds but then, why even have the tiles for them? And Connor dies, but Ser Landry lives- we see connor in the live games, but I've never met Ser Landry since the first game. Both Avernus and Sophia killed? Why? Avernus is such an interesting plot point and they've already introduced the Cure plot line. Hawke died in the Fade? That's canon? Sigh. At least we got a slide about returning to Kirkwall with friend Varric if we didn't do that. They'll leave Hawke alone now. But what I'm most irritated about is teh Trespasser choices. Why is bull's betrayal canon? Why is keeping the Inquisition canon? Why is killing Solas canon? @_@ As far as Sophia, Avernus, the Warden, Hawke, and Bull dying, I think the rationale Bioware gave is that they don't want people who didn't import to get any plotlines that a first-time player of the series wouldn't care about. Which is probably something they'd only care about if they at least hadn't ruled out those characters returning. (Though of course Sophia is unlikely to.) Yes, this is exactly it. The default canon is just that: a default, bare bones world state. There are hardly any side quests completed, the least amount of followers were recruited, loyalty missions are not completed, there are no romances, character deaths are very high to minimize the risk of cameos. The world state has to be based on something for certain things, like the ruler of Ferelden showing up at the end of In Hushed Whispers, or the Warden contact. The default world state doesn't mean it's "canon," it is simply the default world state that the game uses when nothing has been imported. It doesn't mean that the devs are going to base anything around this, and I see no cause for irritation. If there is to be a novel or comic, the writer will decide what, if any, canon they're going to use, just as DG did with that first run of comics where Alistair is king. Also, with the Bull choice, you will likely find that it is because Bull is not recruited. Most of the DAI followers are not recruited. There is no Keep tile for Trespasser relating to a non-recruited Bull, it is only loyal/traitor, which of course doesn't even makes sense if he wasn't there to betray you in the first place. |
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Post by raikas on Apr 17, 2017 17:46:33 GMT
Oh my gosh, that default world state of all three games is so far off from what I did and all of my PTs so far. US which is whatever... We got our cure letter, but it makes me worried they're not going to follow that plot line, regardless of HoF involvement. didn't help find Sten's sword? <- how can he even return to his people to be the Arishok if he's shot on sight? NEar all of the side quests were not completed, which who does that, but I noticed it didn't matter one way or the other when I clicked them for my worlds but then, why even have the tiles for them? And Connor dies, but Ser Landry lives- we see connor in the live games, but I've never met Ser Landry since the first game. Both Avernus and Sophia killed? Why? Avernus is such an interesting plot point and they've already introduced the Cure plot line. Hawke died in the Fade? That's canon? Sigh. At least we got a slide about returning to Kirkwall with friend Varric if we didn't do that. They'll leave Hawke alone now. But what I'm most irritated about is teh Trespasser choices. Why is bull's betrayal canon? Why is keeping the Inquisition canon? Why is killing Solas canon? @_@ If you're using the default, it's probably because you didn't play the previous games (or did, but aren't invested enough in your choices to have them carry over). If you don't know who Bull is, it makes more sense to have him dead (and therefore not going to show up) than to have a cameo from a character who doesn't mean anything to you. |
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Post by Aren on Apr 17, 2017 17:52:41 GMT
I know almost all the plot points of DAI but I haven't bought the game for several reasons,one of them being the inclusion of Kieran.
It irks me the fact that despite I had negated the ritual in DAO the child was born the same only to be literally stolen by Morrigan from my PC in WH.
I don't like the fact that despite the in-game promise I had made to hunt her and even kill her if need to be in WH to take the child back was just ignored in favor of a ludicrous quest to cure the calling,I'm not going to follow her leads just because BioWare wants to appease the needs of DR-players.
If they will include Morrigan or the child in DA4 I will pass the game just as I did with DAI,I've reached a point where her mere precence is enough to let me pass an entire game.
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Post by riverdaleswhiteflash on Apr 17, 2017 17:59:11 GMT
I know almost all the plot points of DAI but I haven't bought the game for several reasons,one of them being the inclusion of Kieran. It irks me the fact that despite I had negated the ritual in DAO the child was born the same only to be literally stolen by Morrigan from my PC in WH. I don't like the fact that despite the in-game promise I had made to hunt her and even kill her if need to be in WH to take the child back was just ignored in favor of a ludicrous quest to cure the calling,she is my enemy number 1 I'm not going to follow her leads just because BioWare wants to appease the needs of DR-players. If they will include Morrigan or the child in DA4 I will boycott the game just as I did with DAI,I've come to a point where her mere precence is enough to let me pass an entire game. If you didn't do the ritual, what's the problem? Just tell the Keep you didn't and the promise-problem is moot. Apparently half the reason they made the Keep in the first place was so that you could fix problems like that. (Not the former PC isn't doing what you want problem. That's not getting a fix. But you can fix flawed imports using the Keep.) Also, you're going to have to explain why a quest to cure the Calling is ridiculous. Oh, and how the woman who gives birth to a child you didn't want can steal him. |
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Post by raikas on Apr 17, 2017 18:09:56 GMT
I know almost all the plot points of DAI but I haven't bought the game for several reasons,one of them being the inclusion of Kieran. It irks me the fact that despite I had negated the ritual in DAO the child was born the same only to be literally stolen by Morrigan from my PC in WH. What do you mean? If you use a Keep state without the ritual Kieran doesn't exist. |
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Post by Aren on Apr 17, 2017 18:10:46 GMT
I know almost all the plot points of DAI but I haven't bought the game for several reasons,one of them being the inclusion of Kieran. It irks me the fact that despite I had negated the ritual in DAO the child was born the same only to be literally stolen by Morrigan from my PC in WH. I don't like the fact that despite the in-game promise I had made to hunt her and even kill her if need to be in WH to take the child back was just ignored in favor of a ludicrous quest to cure the calling,she is my enemy number 1 I'm not going to follow her leads just because BioWare wants to appease the needs of DR-players. If they will include Morrigan or the child in DA4 I will boycott the game just as I did with DAI,I've come to a point where her mere precence is enough to let me pass an entire game. If you didn't do the ritual, what's the problem? Just tell the Keep you didn't and the promise-problem is moot. Apparently half the reason they made the Keep in the first place was so that you could fix problems like that. (Not the former PC isn't doing what you want problem. That's not getting a fix. But you can fix flawed imports using the Keep.) Also, you're going to have to explain why a quest to cure the Calling is ridiculous. Oh, and how the woman who gives birth to a child you didn't want can steal him. You didn't even understood half of my post. 1)The promise made by the warden in WH to take the child back from her. 2)Cure the calling is a ridiculous quest from my POV as given point number one it isn't my priority. 3)I never wanted any OGB not a regular kid which is different so yes she took it by force in WH. |
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Post by oyabun on Apr 17, 2017 18:14:49 GMT
What do you mean? If you use a Keep state without the ritual Kieran doesn't exist. His existence is not bound to the ritual. |
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Post by Catilina on Apr 17, 2017 18:19:42 GMT
If you didn't do the ritual, what's the problem? Just tell the Keep you didn't and the promise-problem is moot. Apparently half the reason they made the Keep in the first place was so that you could fix problems like that. (Not the former PC isn't doing what you want problem. That's not getting a fix. But you can fix flawed imports using the Keep.) Also, you're going to have to explain why a quest to cure the Calling is ridiculous. Oh, and how the woman who gives birth to a child you didn't want can steal him. You didn't even understood half of my post. 1)The promise made by the warden in WH to take the child back from her. 2)Cure the calling is a ridiculous quest from my POV as given point number one it isn't my priority. 3)I never wanted any OGB not a regular kid which is different so yes she took it by force in WH. If your Warden slept with her, she conceived. With or without the Dark Ritual. Deal with it, and be careful, use a condom! |
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Post by riverdaleswhiteflash on Apr 17, 2017 18:20:31 GMT
If you didn't do the ritual, what's the problem? Just tell the Keep you didn't and the promise-problem is moot. Apparently half the reason they made the Keep in the first place was so that you could fix problems like that. (Not the former PC isn't doing what you want problem. That's not getting a fix. But you can fix flawed imports using the Keep.) Also, you're going to have to explain why a quest to cure the Calling is ridiculous. Oh, and how the woman who gives birth to a child you didn't want can steal him. You didn't even understood half of my post. 1)The promise made by the warden in WH to take the child back from her. 2)Cure the calling is a ridiculous questo from my POV as given point number one it isn't my priority. 3)I never wanted any OGB not a regular kid which is different so yes she took it by force in WH. Okay, I'm still not 100% sure I understand your post. Are you saying that the imports into Witch Hunt got bugged and you got an OGB even though you shouldn't have? Or is Kieran normal? Because if Morrigan has an OGB you didn't do the Ritual for, you could just moot the problem by telling the Keep you didn't do the Ritual. No ritual, no OGB, no oath of vengeance. Warden has no incentive not to go on the Calling-Cure-Quest. If Morrigan did have an ordinary kid, then I think you would have had to romance her, wouldn't you? Which should have meant that she'd have let you help raise him. If you don't take that offer, then why shouldn't she just keep him to herself? And wouldn't it be wise to ensure you'll live your full lifespan before taking your kid back? So that you don't turn into a ghoul in front of him? |
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raikas
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by raikas on Apr 17, 2017 18:20:37 GMT
What do you mean? If you use a Keep state without the ritual Kieran doesn't exist. His existence is not bound to the ritual. Not exclusively, no. But if you didn't do the ritual and didn't play a warden who slept with Morrigan he's not there. I've done an ultimate sacrifice import (with a warden who never slept with her) and Morrigan was single and alone in DAI. |
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Post by gervaise21 on Apr 17, 2017 18:21:30 GMT
I think the logic for Bull is that if you didn't recruit him or you didn't do his loyalty quest, then he is still a loyal member of the Qun and thus available for the Viddasala to use against you in Trespasser. Whilst I don't think he appears if you didn't recruit him, if you don't do his loyalty quest then he does turn against you. Whilst technically he doesn't actually betray you if you never recruited him, it amounts to the same when it comes to the next game. So for writing purposes they only have to acknowledge two outcomes, either he died or he didn't. As already said, since to new players Bull having become Tal'Vashoth would mean nothing to them, the default world state has him dying/betraying the Inquisitor. If referenced at all in the new game, it would be no more than someone saying how you can't trust Tal'Vashoth because you don't know if they are really agents of the Qun (as is stated is the upshot of Bull's action in the epilogue) or even just a codex entry.
I agree, though, if they are going to make Sten Arishok, it doesn't make sense for the default world state not to give him back his sword. However, the likelihood is that we may not actually meet the new Arishok but if we do then there may well be a default Arishok to replace Sten for those importing the default world state (or who did not recruit him in their game/find his sword, etc) where any dialogue concerning his previous appearances in the game, or possibly people recognising him, will be omitted. It will probably be a bit like they did for Legion in ME3 if you didn't recruit him in ME2.
I haven't actually played Witch Hunt but if you romanced Morrigan and got her pregnant, then moved on to someone else, but didn't do the DR, does she even mention that she had a child by you? I only ask because I assumed she didn't and altered the Keep accordingly to say I didn't follow her through the eluvian before playing DAI. On that run, she mentioned how she had parted with his father on bad terms and she regretted it, which I took to mean before the Battle of Denerim because from what I have seen on You Tube, you only part with her on bad terms in Witch Hunt if you try to kill her. |
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Post by Kei on Apr 17, 2017 18:22:05 GMT
Glad I didn't romanced her so I didn't had this issue. Just an advice I saw into another thread,Don't get attached to anyone that way you can't lose. |
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Post by Catilina on Apr 17, 2017 18:23:06 GMT
His existence is not bound to the ritual. Not exclusively, no. But if you didn't do the ritual and didn't play a warden who slept with Morrigan he's not there. I've done an ultimate sacrifice import (with a warden who never slept with her) and Morrigan was single and alone in DAI. Morrigan always single, because the warden went for the cure. But Morrigan still wait for him. |
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Post by Kei on Apr 17, 2017 18:26:25 GMT
If your Warden slept with her, she conceived. With or without the Dark Ritual. Deal with it, and be careful, use a condom! I can't even understand why you bother to quote people if you only have stupid things to say. |
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Post by Catilina on Apr 17, 2017 18:31:30 GMT
If your Warden slept with her, she conceived. With or without the Dark Ritual. Deal with it, and be careful, use a condom! I can't even understand why you bother to quote people if you only have stupid things to say. Because I'm so childish, and I'm proud of it! |
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Post by Prince on Apr 17, 2017 18:31:52 GMT
I haven't actually played Witch Hunt but if you romanced Morrigan but didn't do the DR, does she even mention that she had a child by you? I only ask because I assumed she didn't and altered the Keep accordingly to say I didn't follow her through the eluvian before playing DAI. On that run, she mentioned how she had parted with his father on bad terms and she regretted it, which I took to mean before the Battle of Denerim because from what I have seen on You Tube, you only part with her on bad terms in Witch Hunt if you try to kill her. She does and unless you agree to her rules (following her) you won't be able to see it like for forever and she even rubs that dialogue on the warden's face. |
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Post by Kei on Apr 17, 2017 18:37:33 GMT
I can't even understand why you bother to quote people if you only have stupid things to say. Because I'm so childish, and I'm proud of it! Well good for you but there are people who may not like to be mocked for no reason. The way I see it that user did a Good job at not even responding to you. |
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Post by phoray on Apr 17, 2017 19:44:46 GMT
I think the logic for Bull is that if you didn't recruit him or you didn't do his loyalty quest, then he is still a loyal member of the Qun and thus available for the Viddasala to use against you in Trespasser. Whilst I don't think he appears if you didn't recruit him, if you don't do his loyalty quest then he does turn against you. Whilst technically he doesn't actually betray you if you never recruited him, it amounts to the same when it comes to the next game. So for writing purposes they only have to acknowledge two outcomes, either he died or he didn't. As already said, since to new players Bull having become Tal'Vashoth would mean nothing to them, the default world state has him dying/betraying the Inquisitor. If referenced at all in the new game, it would be no more than someone saying how you can't trust Tal'Vashoth because you don't know if they are really agents of the Qun (as is stated is the upshot of Bull's action in the epilogue) or even just a codex entry.
I agree, though, if they are going to make Sten Arishok, it doesn't make sense for the default world state not to give him back his sword. However, the likelihood is that we may not actually meet the new Arishok but if we do then there may well be a default Arishok to replace Sten for those importing the default world state (or who did not recruit him in their game/find his sword, etc) where any dialogue concerning his previous appearances in the game, or possibly people recognising him, will be omitted. It will probably be a bit like they did for Legion in ME3 if you didn't recruit him in ME2.
I haven't actually played Witch Hunt but if you romanced Morrigan and got her pregnant, then moved on to someone else, but didn't do the DR, does she even mention that she had a child by you? I only ask because I assumed she didn't and altered the Keep accordingly to say I didn't follow her through the eluvian before playing DAI. On that run, she mentioned how she had parted with his father on bad terms and she regretted it, which I took to mean before the Battle of Denerim because from what I have seen on You Tube, you only part with her on bad terms in Witch Hunt if you try to kill her. 1. Okay. 2. That'd be an interesting idea. LEgion or even which Warden you get, but same role hole. 3. I imported a female warden who did not get loghain to perform the dark ritual. She left angrily in dog form. I didn't do Witch Hunt. Child free Morrigan said she regretted parting from my Warden on bad terms. |
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Post by Aren on Apr 17, 2017 19:50:40 GMT
If Morrigan did have an ordinary kid, then I think you would have had to romance her, wouldn't you? Which should have meant that she'd have let you help raise him. If you don't take that offer, then why shouldn't she just keep him to herself? And wouldn't it be wise to ensure you'll live your full lifespan before taking your kid back? So that you don't turn into a ghoul in front of him? I dismissed the first part of thy post as I didn't experienced any bug in WH and I was referring to the regular child not to the OGB. Just because she is offering to let me help raising him at her own conditions(entering the eluvian,continue the relationship,forgive her) that doesn't mean I have to obey. Morrigan decided on her own to destroy that relationship and there is no turning back,it isn't written anywhere that I should let her keep the son of my PC,the same she wanted to use as a pawn. Cure the calling(you are not even sure that it can be cured that way)is a waste of time as I prefer to hunt her directly without losing time and she was easy to find so long as she was in Orlais. |
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Post by riverdaleswhiteflash on Apr 17, 2017 19:54:45 GMT
I dismissed the first part of thy post as I didn't experienced any bug in WH and I was referring to the regular child not to the OGB. Just because she is offering to let me help raising him at her own conditions(entering the eluvian,continue the relationship,forgive her) that doesn't mean I have to obey. and there is no turning back and it isn't written anywhere that I should her keep a son of my PC,the same she wanted to use as a pawn. Thanks for clearing that up. But the thing is, it's not written anywhere that she should have to give up her kid, either. And while she wants to use the OGB as a pawn, where do you get that she's raising a normal Kieran for any reason other than because he's her son? |
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Post by Aren on Apr 17, 2017 20:03:26 GMT
Thanks for clearing that up. But the thing is, it's not written anywhere that she should have to give up her kid, either. And while she wants to use the OGB as a pawn, where do you get that she's raising a normal Kieran for any reason other than because he's her son? And that's why we are enemies and there is no turning back(in all fairness it could have endend in WH if it wasn't for her plot protection)she started it in DAO with her deception and now she has gained a new powerful foe. I don't have to trust her into raising that kid after her attempt to use him as a pawn,especially now that she is bound with the will of someone else. |
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Post by Catilina on Apr 17, 2017 20:08:51 GMT
Thanks for clearing that up. But the thing is, it's not written anywhere that she should have to give up her kid, either. And while she wants to use the OGB as a pawn, where do you get that she's raising a normal Kieran for any reason other than because he's her son? And that's why we are enemies and there is no turning back(in all fairness it could have endend in WH if it wasn't for her plot protection)she started it in DAO with her deception and now she has gained a new powerful foe. I don't have to trust her into raising that kid after her attempt to use him as a pawn,especially now that she is bound with the will of someone else. I think, she doesn't want to "use" her son anymore, no matter he has old god soul or not. She changed a lot, as Leliana also said in Inquisition, but that was clear in the Wich Hunt, at least for me. She wants to be a real mother, not such kind was Flemeth toward her. |
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oyabun
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Post by oyabun on Apr 17, 2017 20:38:31 GMT
And that's why we are enemies and there is no turning back(in all fairness it could have endend in WH if it wasn't for her plot protection)she started it in DAO with her deception and now she has gained a new powerful foe. I don't have to trust her into raising that kid after her attempt to use him as a pawn,especially now that she is bound with the will of someone else. I think, she doesn't want to "use" her son anymore, no matter he has old god soul or not. She changed a lot, as Leliana also said in Inquisition, but that was clear in the Wich Hunt, at least for me. She wants to be a real mother, not such kind was Flemeth toward her. But there is still a problem,we can see as players that even if she has a kid she doesn't stop to jump in the well of sorrow and imho she got lucky that it was Flemeth the owner rather than a demon. If only Mythal want she can order to Morrigan to jump from a cliff or to kill her own son for revenge from the events of DAO(she has total control over her body afterall)I think there is no way to trust her now that she isn't free to choose. |
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Post by Aren on Apr 18, 2017 10:09:17 GMT
I think, she doesn't want to "use" her son anymore, no matter he has old god soul or not. She changed a lot, as Leliana also said in Inquisition, but that was clear in the Wich Hunt, at least for me. She wants to be a real mother, not such kind was Flemeth toward her. I don't care either way,neither about what she intends to do nor about the change others see in her. She is irresponsible and proof of that is her jumping on the well of sorrow regardless of her being a mother,I'm not going to give her the benefit of the doubt. Catilina(or whatever your real name is)listen.I've noticed your previous reply and if there is something that I deeply loathe that is rudeness,measure your words if you want to respond to me. The same kind of rudeness,mockery and disrespect I had to bear from Morrigan in Redcliffe,that is among the other things what it brought me on the settled path of vengence. |
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