Cyan_Griffonclaw
N5
Uncle Cyan
Dang it.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: griffonclaw39
Posts: 2,516 Likes: 2,607
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griffonclaw39
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Cyan_Griffonclaw on Apr 26, 2017 16:54:46 GMT
If you're doing 1080p gaming (and planning on staying at that for long time), 1080ti (and to some extent 1070) is an overkill. So you can save some money by going 1060 by NVidia or RX580 by AMD. If you decide to go above 1080p at some point, you can either buy the 1080(ti) now (more expensive) or buy it when you decide to get a new monitor at which point the card will be cheaper. As a side note, never had a single problem with AMD drivers (clean install is a must, people). As for CPU, I'd go for Ryzen 5 (Ryzen 7 is not really worth getting if you're mainly gaming): 1) More bang for the buck from the get go (ie. 1600x has 6C/12T as opposed to 7600K with 4C/4T for virtually same price) 2) You won't need to change the motherboard for at least 4 years (in case you need to change CPU in the meantime) 3) Future proof, more and more games will require more cores/threads, not less Very good advice. I have made six columns and the middle columns with all the variants is actually coming out in line with the lower-end models. I'm getting a much clearer picture. Undoubtably, in the end, I will not have buyer's remorse as long as I gather all this great information. Thank you.
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griffith82
Hope for the best, plan for the worst
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Post by griffith82 on Apr 26, 2017 16:55:26 GMT
I would say -never- buy a top-end Nvidia card (XX80) when it's newish. One step down to a 1070, and you'll get the same RAM, and about 85+% of the performance for a whole lot cheaper. Also, i7's are overrated for gaming. An i5 will do just as well. In fact, I can run this game on High at 4k with an i5-4690k and a GTX 1070. ...strangely enough it runs just about identical on my other system which is an i7-4790k with a 1070. I'm not a programmer, but I build systems to run research simulations at a university research lab. The processor hype is just that, hype. Unless your application is specifically written for and optimized to utilize more than 4 cores it does you almost no good. And the majority of games are optimized with less than 8 cores (or threads in Intel's case) in mind. Havard, you're right! The shop has an i5-5* and a GTX 1080 for $620. That's half cost of the i7 and 1080ti. Will it get me through the next three years at 60fps on a 27" monitor is what I'm concentrating on. Thank you. This is great advice. An I5 will work as long as it's 4.0ghz quad core or above. That's if you don't want to replace it soon.
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Cyan_Griffonclaw
N5
Uncle Cyan
Dang it.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: griffonclaw39
Posts: 2,516 Likes: 2,607
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Uncle Cyan
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Nov 17, 2024 18:04:04 GMT
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Dang it.
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March 2017
griffonclaw39
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Cyan_Griffonclaw on Apr 26, 2017 17:00:47 GMT
Havard, you're right! The shop has an i5-5* and a GTX 1080 for $620. That's half cost of the i7 and 1080ti. Will it get me through the next three years at 60fps on a 27" monitor is what I'm concentrating on. Thank you. This is great advice. An I5 will work as long as it's 4.0ghz quad core or above. That's if you don't want to replace it soon. I don't want to step into a shop for at least three years unless there is some sort of catastrophic failure on a part.
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cotheer
N2
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 116 Likes: 210
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by cotheer on Apr 26, 2017 17:01:47 GMT
When you are running say intel CPU and a Radeon card numerous compatibility issues pop up. There are ways to fix them but not for a novice who is told by some computer clerk what should go with what. Biggest issue is the CPU working harder to pull the graphics and it causes bigger issues if the game is designed for one setup or the other. I'm not stalking you, i swear but: I have i5 2500K and had it paired with: 1) Radeon 6950 2) R9 290 3) RX 480 Zero issues popped up. Also had Pentium 3 paired with some Nvidia cards, also no problems. Athlon x4 paired with both Nvidia (FX5200 i believe) and Radeon (HD 3850), never noticed "communication" problems. If a game is designed for one setup, than that's not something you can blame on hardware. Just like when a game uses GWorks, you can't blame it on AMD.
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Old Scientist Contrarian
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Post by alanc9 on Apr 26, 2017 17:09:29 GMT
I'm not talking used i5s, can't really be talking about prices in the US, but that was an example of how processors may live way past their prime. Can my Sandy Bridge compete with a Kabylake? No. But it gets the job done every day and twice on Sunday. It will also never be a gaming machine without a real GPU (maybe 980s would be a fine budget variant for the 1080, last time I was properly acquainted with GPUs was when I was buying my 770, and you can probably tell that wasn't yesterday) but if you put in a good processor (and for a new PC, I don't think I'd recommend anything below the ix-7x000 stuff, for longevity) you can have a great base, and the only thing you'll do to it for the few coming years is switch the GPU. My i5 has seen at least three GPUs throughout it's service. And two mobo's. The stuff I'm seeing is mostly 3570s (3470s are kicking around for <150 USD too), and a few low-end i7s. Lots of Dell rigs, but as long as you avoid the SFF you can upgrade Dells these days. (SFFs lock you into half-height low-power cards, and the proprietary cases make PSU upgrades almost unavailable.) i don't know why they're being sold off. I can't imagine any business user needing anything better than a midrange i5, and these can't have been used for gaming unless people are putting the crappy original PSUs back before selling, though I guess that's a possibility. Yeah, this is min spec for ME:A, but you're in console territory or lower cost-wise even with the upgrades. I'm just bringing it up for the bottom feeders who may be lurking.
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Post by Cyonan on Apr 26, 2017 17:44:02 GMT
Havard, you're right! The shop has an i5-5* and a GTX 1080 for $620. That's half cost of the i7 and 1080ti. Will it get me through the next three years at 60fps on a 27" monitor is what I'm concentrating on. Thank you. This is great advice. A lot of it is going to depend on the resolution of the monitor rather than its physical size. What I'd say right now in terms of GPU is: > If you're going for 1080p then the 1060 will do okay, or the 1070 if you want more power. The 1070 will likely last more than 3 years because it is kind of still overkill at 1080p right now. > If you're going for 1440p then the 1070 will do okay but the 1080 will be better overall for games coming out in the next 2-3 years. The 1080ti is overkill in this area and will likely last more than 3 years. > At 4k if you're serious about 60 FPS then I would say hold out for the next gen of GPUs from Nvidia, otherwise 1080ti is the best choice right now. Some of it will also depend on how badly you want to maintain ultra settings in games as well. In most of the ME:A benchmarks I can find at 1440p the 1070 is a few frames short of averaging 60 FPS, but that's at ultra. You can push more life out of it if you don't mind going to high at some point, or turning a few things down that are particularly demanding like AA.
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Cyan_Griffonclaw
N5
Uncle Cyan
Dang it.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: griffonclaw39
Posts: 2,516 Likes: 2,607
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Uncle Cyan
5620
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Nov 17, 2024 18:04:04 GMT
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Cyan_Griffonclaw
Dang it.
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March 2017
griffonclaw39
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Cyan_Griffonclaw on Apr 26, 2017 18:08:44 GMT
Havard, you're right! The shop has an i5-5* and a GTX 1080 for $620. That's half cost of the i7 and 1080ti. Will it get me through the next three years at 60fps on a 27" monitor is what I'm concentrating on. Thank you. This is great advice. A lot of it is going to depend on the resolution of the monitor rather than its physical size. What I'd say right now in terms of GPU is: > If you're going for 1080p then the 1060 will do okay, or the 1070 if you want more power. The 1070 will likely last more than 3 years because it is kind of still overkill at 1080p right now. > If you're going for 1440p then the 1070 will do okay but the 1080 will be better overall for games coming out in the next 2-3 years. The 1080ti is overkill in this area and will likely last more than 3 years. > At 4k if you're serious about 60 FPS then I would say hold out for the next gen of GPUs from Nvidia, otherwise 1080ti is the best choice right now. Some of it will also depend on how badly you want to maintain ultra settings in games as well. In most of the ME:A benchmarks I can find at 1440p the 1070 is a few frames short of averaging 60 FPS, but that's at ultra. You can push more life out of it if you don't mind going to high at some point, or turning a few things down that are particularly demanding like AA. Yes, I'm trying to get the card to last a good three years at 60fps at 1440. 4k, isn't necessary. I want things on Ultra because I know someone took the time to move a sketch on a piece of a paper and brought it to life using an engine canvas. Frostbite demands it. This is where the new Bioware seems to kick ass, but the lack of polishing drives me nuts. However, I want to experience as they did. That's all, really.
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Post by Cyonan on Apr 26, 2017 18:52:03 GMT
Yes, I'm trying to get the card to last a good three years at 60fps at 1440. 4k, isn't necessary. I want things on Ultra because I know someone took the time to move a sketch on a piece of a paper and brought it to life using an engine canvas. Frostbite demands it. This is where the new Bioware seems to kick ass, but the lack of polishing drives me nuts. However, I want to experience as they did. That's all, really. In this case I'd probably recommend the GTX 1080. Looking at benchmarks for ME:A, the 1080 tends to average in the high 60s while the 1070 is usually sitting a bit short of 60. So even though the 1070 is doing okay right now, it'll probably start dropping below 60 more in games over the next 2-3 years while the 1080 has some room to work with. and ME:A is one of the most demanding games out there right now, so its benchmark isn't too bad of one to look at.
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Post by wolfsite on Apr 26, 2017 18:57:32 GMT
I nice video about Ryzon
This guy also has tons of videos about building gaming PC's based on several different budget types so his channel is worth going through.
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Hope for the best, plan for the worst
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Post by griffith82 on Apr 26, 2017 19:51:08 GMT
When you are running say intel CPU and a Radeon card numerous compatibility issues pop up. There are ways to fix them but not for a novice who is told by some computer clerk what should go with what. Biggest issue is the CPU working harder to pull the graphics and it causes bigger issues if the game is designed for one setup or the other. I'm not stalking you, i swear but: I have i5 2500K and had it paired with: 1) Radeon 6950 2) R9 290 3) RX 480 Zero issues popped up. Also had Pentium 3 paired with some Nvidia cards, also no problems. Athlon x4 paired with both Nvidia (FX5200 i believe) and Radeon (HD 3850), never noticed "communication" problems. If a game is designed for one setup, than that's not something you can blame on hardware. Just like when a game uses GWorks, you can't blame it on AMD. There used to be a lot of games that either had a tag of works best with Nvidia (Crysis) and some with Amd. Now that has changed slightly and companies have tried to make cross compatibility better. I'm not saying it always causes issues there are plenty of times it doesn't but when it doesn't work it's usually a spectacular mess.
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Cyan_Griffonclaw
N5
Uncle Cyan
Dang it.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: griffonclaw39
Posts: 2,516 Likes: 2,607
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Uncle Cyan
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Nov 17, 2024 18:04:04 GMT
2,607
Cyan_Griffonclaw
Dang it.
2,516
March 2017
griffonclaw39
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Cyan_Griffonclaw on Apr 26, 2017 21:16:36 GMT
I nice video about Ryzon This guy also has tons of videos about building gaming PC's based on several different budget types so his channel is worth going through. Nice Wolfsite. Thank you. And the embedded video. Good stuff.
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scouserant23
N2
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: ScouserAnt23
XBL Gamertag: ScouserAnt23
Posts: 148 Likes: 119
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148
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scouserant23
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by scouserant23 on Apr 28, 2017 0:54:30 GMT
In my experience they have trouble communicating. Sometimes the two types of architecture don't work well together. For the last 20 years, I've had six rigs custom made. The majority of them started out as AMD/ATI Radeon combos. I made the mistake twice to replace the ATI card with an nVidia and went through all sorts of hell. Every time, new system install and that was turned out to be a waste of time. All sorts of problems would pop up in different game engines. The worst was Unreal. I also had a i5 in one system and swapped out the nVidia for the current Radeon 7870 I am using. Holy crap. Three days of troubleshooting and I was done. So, for me, I agree with Griffith82, I'm not smart enough (and that's the key issue here, I'm smart enough to be "dangerous") to overcome the issues. I also hate returning the system to the shop with their smug faces. "So, you tried to do this... okay...." Yeh I'm the same want bang for my buck but also want to use max settings when i have the funds. The 1080Ti is a beast of a card and reasonably priced compared to the Titan X it just isn't needed for the original monitor you linked which had a resolution of 1920-1080. If you go the 2k monitor route id advise getting either the 1080Ti (it's 11GBVram will mean its sli potential in the future is safer especially at 2K resolution, you never know but 8GB might not be enough in 4+ years) or an Asus Strix 1080 Asus Strix cards are stably overclocked and have better cooling. They cost a little extra but that extra performance keeps them maxing out games for another 3-6 months after the stock cards start to slow down. In 2 years time i'd imagine buying a second 1080strix near the end of year 3 would extend the lifetime by another 2 years. I would also advise that the 1080 is already a year old next month. So again if you have the time to wait till the revised model comes in later this year and getting the 2080 It will give you more lifespan for your money. This would also allow you to see if 8GB will still be enough Vram to handle max settings at 2k in 3 1/2 years time. As if you go the 1080 route now when it comes to upgrading your risking that not enough information will be available to see if the Vram will survive. The 780Titan (4 Years old) had this problem, its 3GB memory left putting it in sli useless even at 1080p (even though this was a standard even 4 years ago) as most games now are requiring 3-4GB Andromeda is very close to hitting 4GB at 1080p maxed out. The 980Titan however had 6GBVram and while that will probably struggle in 2 years (when it is 4 years old) at 2k resolutions (though it might not) it will definitely get a long long life span in sli at 1080p. All the current cards coming out this year at 8GBVram are the last of their generation. The next generation from AMD and Nvidia due in 2018/2019 will have 12-16GB. Now as these aren't standard cards that isn't a concern, but once they've been out 2-3 years and the second wave of that generation comes out that can lead developers to push graphics up for those who want to max their settings (what we are seeing with most AAA games in 2017 now they starting to leave the 4GB cards behind at max settings at 1080p). Here i do believe the 11GB Ti is a safer bet for 2k resolutions but that's only if your wanting to sli up in 3-4 years time meaning you wouldn't have to spend much on a gcard in 3 years time (more money for other upgrades/holiday/car/whatever), if not your better going the 1080strix and then replacing it with its equivalent later on but this will cost more in the long run.
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Cyan_Griffonclaw
N5
Uncle Cyan
Dang it.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: griffonclaw39
Posts: 2,516 Likes: 2,607
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Uncle Cyan
5620
0
Nov 17, 2024 18:04:04 GMT
2,607
Cyan_Griffonclaw
Dang it.
2,516
March 2017
griffonclaw39
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
griffonclaw39
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Post by Cyan_Griffonclaw on Apr 28, 2017 1:09:17 GMT
For the last 20 years, I've had six rigs custom made. The majority of them started out as AMD/ATI Radeon combos. I made the mistake twice to replace the ATI card with an nVidia and went through all sorts of hell. Every time, new system install and that was turned out to be a waste of time. All sorts of problems would pop up in different game engines. The worst was Unreal. I also had a i5 in one system and swapped out the nVidia for the current Radeon 7870 I am using. Holy crap. Three days of troubleshooting and I was done. So, for me, I agree with Griffith82, I'm not smart enough (and that's the key issue here, I'm smart enough to be "dangerous") to overcome the issues. I also hate returning the system to the shop with their smug faces. "So, you tried to do this... okay...." Yeh I'm the same want bang for my buck but also want to use max settings when i have the funds. The 1080Ti is a beast of a card and reasonably priced compared to the Titan X it just isn't needed for the original monitor you linked which had a resolution of 1920-1080. If you go the 2k monitor route id advise getting either the 1080Ti (it's 11GBVram will mean its sli potential in the future is safer especially at 2K resolution, you never know but 8GB might not be enough in 4+ years) or an Asus Strix 1080 Asus Strix cards are stably overclocked and have better cooling. They cost a little extra but that extra performance keeps them maxing out games for another 3-6 months after the stock cards start to slow down. In 2 years time i'd imagine buying a second 1080strix near the end of year 3 would extend the lifetime by another 2 years. I would also advise that the 1080 is already a year old next month. So again if you have the time to wait till the revised model comes in later this year and getting the 2080 It will give you more lifespan for your money. This would also allow you to see if 8GB will still be enough Vram to handle max settings at 2k in 3 1/2 years time. As if you go the 1080 route now when it comes to upgrading your risking that not enough information will be available to see if the Vram will survive. The 780Titan (4 Years old) had this problem, its 3GB memory left putting it in sli useless even at 1080p (even though this was a standard even 4 years ago) as most games now are requiring 3-4GB Andromeda is very close to hitting 4GB at 1080p maxed out. The 980Titan however had 6GBVram and while that will probably struggle in 2 years (when it is 4 years old) at 2k resolutions (though it might not) it will definitely get a long long life span in sli at 1080p. All the current cards coming out this year at 8GBVram are the last of their generation. The next generation from AMD and Nvidia due in 2018/2019 will have 12-16GB. Now as these aren't standard cards that isn't a concern, but once they've been out 2-3 years and the second wave of that generation comes out that can lead developers to push graphics up for those who want to max their settings (what we are seeing with most AAA games in 2017 now they starting to leave the 4GB cards behind at max settings at 1080p). Here i do believe the 11GB Ti is a safer bet for 2k resolutions but that's only if your wanting to sli up in 3-4 years time meaning you wouldn't have to spend much on a gcard in 3 years time (more money for other upgrades/holiday/car/whatever), if not your better going the 1080strix and then replacing it with its equivalent later on but this will cost more in the long run. You're on target! So, I'm feeling real good about the direction we're heading. I'm also hearing the same thing about waiting a few more weeks because of new lines coming out. $1200 for the card/CPU might change to $890 or so. That's significant to me and it allows me to add something more. Oh... I cannot wait. Thank you for the advice. Good stuff.
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scouserant23
N2
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: ScouserAnt23
XBL Gamertag: ScouserAnt23
Posts: 148 Likes: 119
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by scouserant23 on Apr 28, 2017 22:41:55 GMT
You're on target! So, I'm feeling real good about the direction we're heading. I'm also hearing the same thing about waiting a few more weeks because of new lines coming out. $1200 for the card/CPU might change to $890 or so. That's significant to me and it allows me to add something more. Oh... I cannot wait. Thank you for the advice. Good stuff. Make sure you don't just get a 250GB SSD for windows and general files. It is extremely worth getting a 500-1TB SSD and having your big AAA games on that SSD it will speed up everything from starting the game to all the loading times. Especially when your paying for a solid CPU you don't want it bottlenecked because your games are running from a HDD. I don't believe it well help in real time during games but those loading screens speeding up makes a big difference.
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Cyan_Griffonclaw
N5
Uncle Cyan
Dang it.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: griffonclaw39
Posts: 2,516 Likes: 2,607
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Uncle Cyan
5620
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Nov 17, 2024 18:04:04 GMT
2,607
Cyan_Griffonclaw
Dang it.
2,516
March 2017
griffonclaw39
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Cyan_Griffonclaw on Apr 29, 2017 1:15:22 GMT
You're on target! So, I'm feeling real good about the direction we're heading. I'm also hearing the same thing about waiting a few more weeks because of new lines coming out. $1200 for the card/CPU might change to $890 or so. That's significant to me and it allows me to add something more. Oh... I cannot wait. Thank you for the advice. Good stuff. Make sure you don't just get a 250GB SSD for windows and general files. It is extremely worth getting a 500-1TB SSD and having your big AAA games on that SSD it will speed up everything from starting the game to all the loading times. Especially when your paying for a solid CPU you don't want it bottlenecked because your games are running from a HDD. I don't believe it well help in real time during games but those loading screens speeding up makes a big difference. Thank you Scouserant23. Yes, I want to load all my "high-traffic" games like Dragon Age and Mass Effect on the 2nd SSD.
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