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Post by reyzaburrel on May 28, 2017 17:01:58 GMT
I’ll admit this right up front – listening to those early reviews was a HUGE mistake! As a massive fan of the original series, I, like many, was pretty jaded with the ending of ME:3 and so I refused to trust another BioWare game until I saw endless glowing reviews about how amazing Andromeda was. Even when friends told me the reviews were way off and the game was actually very fun and entertaining to play, I simply ignored them. After all, if someone makes a YouTube video about a game, it must be true – right? Long story short, I went ahead and bought the game a few days ago and to my surprise, it felt just like what I’ve always come to expect from a Mass Effect game – engaging. It’s like that amazing book you’ve read where you find yourself being unable to put it down because you “must know what happens next!” Granted, the early parts of the game are a bit slow and some of the open world quests can be boring or add little to nothing to the overall story. And yes, some of the animations are fairly dismal compared to what you would expect in 2017 but overall, they don’t jump out at you as terrible like most reviewers have claimed. That thought brings me to all the endless and mind-numbingly drool of complaints about how vanilla the characters are, how the voice acting is pathetically bad or how there isn’t any emotion to character interaction. Really? They must not be playing the same game that I’m play because those accusations couldn’t be further from reality. From what I’ve seen so far, the characters have distinct, memorable personalities, the VA is top notch (with some great one-liners) and interaction between the characters (especially squad mates) is a breath of fresh air. When considering the history of BioWare games and character development, ME:A stands right up on the top rungs of the ladder. As for the rest of the game, the combat is amazing, the new skill combination system is exactly what most of player base was asking for and the music is very fitting for “most” of the scenes. Overall, it’s very much a Mass Effect game and well worth the history of the franchise. All those terrible reviews I saw, read, listened to – well, I sure feel dumb believing them. I think that some of the review were a little harsh, but don't get it fucked up this is still a piss poor Mass Effect game. The customization was poor. If there is one thing out of the entire game I expected them to get right was the character customization, and they failed at that. The facial animations, even some of the animations in general were immersion breaking to the point where you don't even want to play the game. The majority characters in this game lack character. Yet they have "distinct, memorable personalities" according to you. Ha, thats funny. Well, I guess the Archon was a great antagonist according to you, even know he is complete shiit. They took out the power wheel and squad commands, the crafting system is lacking, I mean there are so many things to say about this game and they aren't positive. Also, you can have the best VA actors in the world, but they won't make up for the poorly written story and characters.
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Post by abaris on May 28, 2017 17:07:05 GMT
Well, I guess the Archon was a great antagonist according to you, even know he is complete shiit. To be fair, the antagonist never rose up to memorable levels in any Bioware game. A deranged Turian spectre in ME1, noone really in ME2 and starchild in ME3, if you didn't choose to install Mehem, which takes care of that. In the DA series it was a dragon in DAO, which might be the most memorable, haven't played DAII, so I can't comment on it, and that sick looking dude going down pretty easily in DAI.
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Post by reyzaburrel on May 28, 2017 17:27:40 GMT
Well, I guess the Archon was a great antagonist according to you, even know he is complete shiit. To be fair, the antagonist never rose up to memorable levels in any Bioware game. A deranged Turian spectre in ME1, noone really in ME2 and starchild in ME3, if you didn't choose to install Mehem, which takes care of that. In the DA series it was a dragon in DAO, which might be the most memorable, haven't played DAII, so I can't comment on it, and that sick looking dude going down pretty easily in DAI. So Saren wasn't memorable? The illusive man wasn't memorable? Harbinger and the collectors weren't memorable? The reapers weren't memorable? Starchild was an antagonist? What are you even talking about my dude? Do you even know the games that you claim to play? There were alot of memorable antagonist in the original trilogy. Also, Starchild wasn't an antagonist lol. smh
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Post by colfoley on May 28, 2017 17:39:29 GMT
The only thing the Archon was missing was a cool villain theme.
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Post by goishen on May 28, 2017 17:43:09 GMT
To be fair, the antagonist never rose up to memorable levels in any Bioware game. A deranged Turian spectre in ME1, noone really in ME2 and starchild in ME3, if you didn't choose to install Mehem, which takes care of that. In the DA series it was a dragon in DAO, which might be the most memorable, haven't played DAII, so I can't comment on it, and that sick looking dude going down pretty easily in DAI. So Saren wasn't memorable? The illusive man wasn't memorable? Harbinger and the collectors weren't memorable? The reapers weren't memorable? Starchild was an antagonist? What are you even talking about my dude? Do you even know the games that you claim to play? There were alot of memorable antagonist in the original trilogy. Also, Starchild wasn't an antagonist lol. smh I take it that he thinks that zombies were the antagonists in TTG's TWD, season 1.
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Post by KaiserShep on May 28, 2017 17:47:51 GMT
To be fair, the antagonist never rose up to memorable levels in any Bioware game. A deranged Turian spectre in ME1, noone really in ME2 and starchild in ME3, if you didn't choose to install Mehem, which takes care of that. In the DA series it was a dragon in DAO, which might be the most memorable, haven't played DAII, so I can't comment on it, and that sick looking dude going down pretty easily in DAI. So Saren wasn't memorable? The illusive man wasn't memorable? Harbinger and the collectors weren't memorable? The reapers weren't memorable? Starchild was an antagonist? What are you even talking about my dude? Do you even know the games that you claim to play? There were alot of memorable antagonist in the original trilogy. Also, Starchild wasn't an antagonist lol. smh I actually don't think that the Saren character, in and of himself, was anything particularly meaningful to remember. Part of the problem was that he barely had a presence throughout the game. After we saw him in the prologue sequence and the vidcomm at the Council chambers, he pretty much disappeared, and it was really just NPC's constantly reminding us that he was out there being a nefarious rogue that we have to stop, like Garrus and Wrex. We don't even see him again until his brief encounter on Virmire. Sovereign, on the other hand, was far more memorable despite that single interaction on Virmire, because his dialogue was basically a bomb dropped on our narrative. The Illusive Man was much better, but he also had more screen time, a lot more to say and generally had much better dialogue than Saren, even in the much-maligned ME3. I'd say that Saren is extremely overrated.
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Post by smilesja on May 28, 2017 18:48:51 GMT
So Saren wasn't memorable? The illusive man wasn't memorable? Harbinger and the collectors weren't memorable? The reapers weren't memorable? Starchild was an antagonist? What are you even talking about my dude? Do you even know the games that you claim to play? There were alot of memorable antagonist in the original trilogy. Also, Starchild wasn't an antagonist lol. smh I take it that he thinks that zombies were the antagonists in TTG's TWD, season 1. They are but they're not the only antagonists
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Post by abaris on May 28, 2017 19:01:57 GMT
The Illusive Man was much better, but he also had more screen time, a lot more to say and generally had much better dialogue than Saren, even in the much-maligned ME3. I'd say that Saren is extremely overrated. But where was TIM the antagonist? In 2 we work for him, willingly or unwillingly and have the option of giving him the boot at the end. In 3 he's the antagonist sidekick, obviously indoctrinated but not the real enemy to fight against.
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Post by KaiserShep on May 28, 2017 19:08:25 GMT
In 2 we work for him, but the game makes it clear that this alliance is doomed and he'll somehow be a problem to deal with later. I guess Harbinger is supposed to be the antagonist in ME3, but TIM is more so because he actually causes the most problems. Had he not been against us, the war would have ended a lot sooner.
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Post by abaris on May 28, 2017 19:11:03 GMT
Had he not been against us, the war would have ended a lot sooner. But that's not the same as him being the antagonist. He slows our progress, but that's about it. He's obviously not the boss. Certainly not on the same level as the Archon, who isn't a memorable boss, but a clear cut one.
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Post by colfoley on May 28, 2017 19:22:09 GMT
Had he not been against us, the war would have ended a lot sooner. But that's not the same as him being the antagonist. He slows our progress, but that's about it. He's obviously not the boss. Certainly not on the same level as the Archon, who isn't a memorable boss, but a clear cut one. antagonist does not mean villain. Antagonist, all it means, id someone who is against the protagonist. In fact the best antagonists are people who might be good guys.
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Post by goishen on May 28, 2017 19:46:11 GMT
lol. Watching people flounder over the definition of the word antagonist is funny. Oh, and by the way, no the zombies weren't antagonists. It was a natural act, so they are doing what nature tells them to do.
It's the same as in The Call Of The Wild. Only updated and with a suspension of disbelief tossed in.
lol. Zombies are antagonists. You people are funny.
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Post by Fen'Harel Faceman on May 28, 2017 19:48:57 GMT
lol. Watching people flounder over the definition of the word antagonist is funny. Oh, and by the way, no the zombies weren't antagonists. It was a natural act, so they are doing what nature tells them to do. It's the same as in The Call Of The Wild. Only updated and with a suspension of disbelief tossed in. lol. Zombies are antagonists. You people are funny. Nature can be an antagonist in a story. Non-corporeal
An antagonist may not always be a person or persons. In some cases, an antagonist may be a force, such as a tidal wave that destroys a city; a storm that causes havoc; or even a certain area's conditions that are the root cause of a problem. An antagonist also may or may not create obstacles for the protagonisten.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antagonist
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Post by goishen on May 28, 2017 19:51:57 GMT
lol. Watching people flounder over the definition of the word antagonist is funny. Oh, and by the way, no the zombies weren't antagonists. It was a natural act, so they are doing what nature tells them to do. It's the same as in The Call Of The Wild. Only updated and with a suspension of disbelief tossed in. lol. Zombies are antagonists. You people are funny. Nature can be an antagonist in a story. Non-corporeal[edit]
An antagonist may not always be a person or persons. In some cases, an antagonist may be a force, such as a tidal wave that destroys a city; a storm that causes havoc; or even a certain area's conditions that are the root cause of a problem. An antagonist also may or may not create obstacles for the protagonisten.wikipedia.org/wiki/AntagonistThat's extremely good! Good for you! Good boy. lol Flounder some more for my amusement over the word antagonist.
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Post by colfoley on May 28, 2017 19:53:25 GMT
lol. Watching people flounder over the definition of the word antagonist is funny. Oh, and by the way, no the zombies weren't antagonists. It was a natural act, so they are doing what nature tells them to do. It's the same as in The Call Of The Wild. Only updated and with a suspension of disbelief tossed in. lol. Zombies are antagonists. You people are funny. i pretty much gave the actual dictionary definition of the word. As far as nature is concerned nature has been used as an antagonist before. Most notably in zombie movies and the Witcher series.
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Post by Fen'Harel Faceman on May 28, 2017 19:56:33 GMT
Nature can be an antagonist in a story. Non-corporeal[edit]
An antagonist may not always be a person or persons. In some cases, an antagonist may be a force, such as a tidal wave that destroys a city; a storm that causes havoc; or even a certain area's conditions that are the root cause of a problem. An antagonist also may or may not create obstacles for the protagonisten.wikipedia.org/wiki/AntagonistThat's extremely good! Good for you! Good boy. lol Flounder some more for my amusement over the word antagonist.
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Post by linksocarina on May 28, 2017 21:14:29 GMT
To be fair, the antagonist never rose up to memorable levels in any Bioware game. A deranged Turian spectre in ME1, noone really in ME2 and starchild in ME3, if you didn't choose to install Mehem, which takes care of that. In the DA series it was a dragon in DAO, which might be the most memorable, haven't played DAII, so I can't comment on it, and that sick looking dude going down pretty easily in DAI. So Saren wasn't memorable? The illusive man wasn't memorable? Harbinger and the collectors weren't memorable? The reapers weren't memorable? Starchild was an antagonist? What are you even talking about my dude? Do you even know the games that you claim to play? There were alot of memorable antagonist in the original trilogy. Also, Starchild wasn't an antagonist lol. smh Saren is very absentee as a villain honestly. A lot of people point to Jon Irenicus as the pinnacle of BioWare villains, but he is basically the vengeful, elven version of Saren in the end. The only good villain BioWare has done, id argue, is Loghain. Solas has potential to be even better...and the Archon...kind of weak, but the Kett themselves (especially with the Primus) might be more interesting in the long run.
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Post by smilesja on May 28, 2017 21:15:59 GMT
Nature can be an antagonist in a story. Non-corporeal[edit]
An antagonist may not always be a person or persons. In some cases, an antagonist may be a force, such as a tidal wave that destroys a city; a storm that causes havoc; or even a certain area's conditions that are the root cause of a problem. An antagonist also may or may not create obstacles for the protagonisten.wikipedia.org/wiki/AntagonistThat's extremely good! Good for you! Good boy. lol Flounder some more for my amusement over the word antagonist. Do you have any counterargument?
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Post by colfoley on May 28, 2017 21:18:32 GMT
So Saren wasn't memorable? The illusive man wasn't memorable? Harbinger and the collectors weren't memorable? The reapers weren't memorable? Starchild was an antagonist? What are you even talking about my dude? Do you even know the games that you claim to play? There were alot of memorable antagonist in the original trilogy. Also, Starchild wasn't an antagonist lol. smh Saren is very absentee as a villain honestly. A lot of people point to Jon Irenicus as the pinnacle of BioWare villains, but he is basically the vengeful, elven version of Saren in the end. The only good villain BioWare has done, id argue, is Loghain. Solas has potential to be even better...and the Archon...kind of weak, but the Kett themselves (especially with the Primus) might be more interesting in the long run. my favorite is the Arishock.
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Post by linksocarina on May 28, 2017 21:21:11 GMT
Saren is very absentee as a villain honestly. A lot of people point to Jon Irenicus as the pinnacle of BioWare villains, but he is basically the vengeful, elven version of Saren in the end. The only good villain BioWare has done, id argue, is Loghain. Solas has potential to be even better...and the Archon...kind of weak, but the Kett themselves (especially with the Primus) might be more interesting in the long run. my favorite is the Arishock. See I don't even count him as a villain. For me the villain of Dragon Age 2 was Anders, Orsino and Meredith. And all two out of three of those were pretty good too...for different reasons though.
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Post by abaris on May 28, 2017 21:21:32 GMT
The only good villain BioWare has done, id argue, is Loghain. Solas has potential to be even better...and the Archon...kind of weak, but the Kett themselves (especially with the Primus) might be more interesting in the long run. Loghain's good. I had shivers run down my spine when I first had that scene with him recalling his troops in DAO. He's not twodimensional either, since you can win him as an ally to reappear in DAI. Solas, stands to argue that he's not really a villain. The Archon, I for one get the feeling of him not being more or less generic than other villains we had before.
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Post by linksocarina on May 28, 2017 21:23:35 GMT
The only good villain BioWare has done, id argue, is Loghain. Solas has potential to be even better...and the Archon...kind of weak, but the Kett themselves (especially with the Primus) might be more interesting in the long run. Loghain's good. I had shivers run down my spine when I first had that scene with him recalling his troops in DAO. He's not twodimensional either, since you can win him as an ally to reappear in DAI. Solas, stands to argue that he's not really a villain. The Archon, I for one get the feeling of him not being more or less generic than other villains we had before. True, I think the Kett has potential though. In particular how the Primus went against the Archon... That small little scene, while it may mean nothing in Andromeda, makes the Kett somewhat more power-hungry and ambitious on their theocratic mandate. There is so much potential there...the hope is BioWare can get the chance to do something about it.
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Post by Deleted on May 28, 2017 22:17:29 GMT
The only good villain BioWare has done, id argue, is Loghain. *shakes head* You're forgetting Kai Lang.
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Post by colfoley on May 28, 2017 22:40:14 GMT
True, I think the Kett has potential though. In particular how the Primus went against the Archon... That small little scene, while it may mean nothing in Andromeda, makes the Kett somewhat more power-hungry and ambitious on their theocratic mandate. There is so much potential there...the hope is BioWare can get the chance to do something about it. Sure, there is some intrigue and backstabbing, but that's hardly enough to make up for the fact that the Kett have the word "generic" practically carved into their foreheads, or the fact that their genetic consumption of other species is a reboot of the Reaper thing - and I would argue an inferior reboot if only due to the fact that you just told this story not long ago, you don't get to regurgitate it again and expect everyone to applaud just because you want to call the new game a "soft reboot" or whatever.
The idea that the Kett have different factions within them isn't half as dramatic as you are making it sound, certainly not enough to make them seem less like "generic hostile aliens number 37".
To me, the Kett look like an unholy mix of elements taken from existing designs of aliens from different franchises, the Turians, the Protheans, the Collectors, and some resemblance to certain enemies from Halo, Destiny, and the "Grineer" faction from Warframe.
They could have made even that more interesting if they went with a similar route to how Stargate handled the Goa'uld Vs. Tok'ra conflict. The idea that some Kett could be against these practices, perhaps those that retained much of what they were before the "exaltation".
It's just one example, but the way they were handled was extremely disappointing. We went all the way to another galaxy just to meet an adversary that didn't have anything original or even "Alien" about him. It's as if the more things change, the more they stay the same.
The Kett (and the Angara) needed their own version of space magic, that just happens to work almost exactly like Biotics, but contrary to biotics which were invented as a whole including the pseudo-scientific explanation for why they work, the new "aliens" just happen to control "bio-electricity" and "electromagnetic-fields" are using it in a way which most certainly makes no sense.
The difference is that with Biotics, assuming Eezo exists, one could suspend their disbelief into accepting these fantastic applications. But this? This is lazy as fuck.
but the thing is the Tok'ra...or different philosophies in the Wrath Empire were introduced in season 2 and i believe season 3 respectively. Andromeda is roughly season 1 of a long term story. And the Goa'uld were about as interesting as the kett in season 1. Besides its not like Bioware hasn't done this before. Introduce us to a pathetically one dimensional villain factions only to flesh them out later.
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Post by smilesja on May 28, 2017 22:44:38 GMT
Sure, there is some intrigue and backstabbing, but that's hardly enough to make up for the fact that the Kett have the word "generic" practically carved into their foreheads, or the fact that their genetic consumption of other species is a reboot of the Reaper thing - and I would argue an inferior reboot if only due to the fact that you just told this story not long ago, you don't get to regurgitate it again and expect everyone to applaud just because you want to call the new game a "soft reboot" or whatever.
The idea that the Kett have different factions within them isn't half as dramatic as you are making it sound, certainly not enough to make them seem less like "generic hostile aliens number 37".
To me, the Kett look like an unholy mix of elements taken from existing designs of aliens from different franchises, the Turians, the Protheans, the Collectors, and some resemblance to certain enemies from Halo, Destiny, and the "Grineer" faction from Warframe.
They could have made even that more interesting if they went with a similar route to how Stargate handled the Goa'uld Vs. Tok'ra conflict. The idea that some Kett could be against these practices, perhaps those that retained much of what they were before the "exaltation".
It's just one example, but the way they were handled was extremely disappointing. We went all the way to another galaxy just to meet an adversary that didn't have anything original or even "Alien" about him. It's as if the more things change, the more they stay the same.
The Kett (and the Angara) needed their own version of space magic, that just happens to work almost exactly like Biotics, but contrary to biotics which were invented as a whole including the pseudo-scientific explanation for why they work, the new "aliens" just happen to control "bio-electricity" and "electromagnetic-fields" are using it in a way which most certainly makes no sense.
The difference is that with Biotics, assuming Eezo exists, one could suspend their disbelief into accepting these fantastic applications. But this? This is lazy as fuck.
but the thing is the Tok'ra...or different philosophies in the Wrath Empire were introduced in season 2 and i believe season 3 respectively. Andromeda is roughly season 1 of a long term story. And the Goa'uld were about as interesting as the kett in season 1. Besides its not like Bioware hasn't done this before. Introduce us to a pathetically one dimensional villain factions only to flesh them out later. The Reapers were pretty generic in Mass Effect 1 as well. So were the Darkspawn in Origins.
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