Who is more annoying?

It seemed to me she knew almost nothing as was busy planting bugs in Shepard's room mostly and arcoss the whole ship.
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How the hell is the Liara the only one who knows about Allers in Shepard's bed?
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When she saw how reality looked like, like Thessia, renegade slap interraptions were really needed - what a bitch demanding others to help her home while those others were trying to survive and help to build the device.


To the point.
Not a fan of Kelly's character in general. Do not need her crew descriptions - no help at all. The only useful thing: she can notice if someone is interested in Shepard and she, as well as Kasumi, noticed Samara's change of behavior if there is Morinth onboard ("Samara refuses to talk to Kelly" - because it was Morinth already).
And, of course, fish. That is the most important.
Sam, on the other hand, is more interesting. Her behavior and manners are appealing. She is so alive, opened and shy at the same time. Sam actually helps gving side quests and tracking ninja.

Agreed. But it seems to work. Those are some of the most popular characters though. Players seem to love chatacters that fanboy over the main character, but the have issues with characters that can think on their own.

I am sure as well.
Meant potential LIs. Still can't think of any other explanation why only Liara talks about it - stalker, bugs, Shepard's quarters guard, secretary, etc. etc.



Wrote about it several times: my crew turned into idiots. At least Javik and Sam remained focused on the mission.

After my current run of Andromeda, I am going to do my third playthrough of LE, and am going to romance either Ashley or Miranda to see how creepy Liara can be. In both my playthroughs of LE I romanced Liara, and thought her infatuation with Shepard was part of the romance. I did not find it creepy when she had a piece of Shepard's armor on display in her apartment. I just thought "well she loves him." In ME3 after Mordin dies and Shepard has that dream with the boy when he wakes up to find Liara there. I just thought "well they're sleeping together."

Well that is one of the cornerstones of Indoctrination Theory....

It is...but that wasn't IT, it was just shit PTSD writting. 

What is the starting point of "zero f*cks about"? Was that VS?
BW did not write in anything about such thing as "explanation of Shepard ending up with Cerberus": Shepard just can do a thing, can say nothing to others, can't ask, can't explain, can't do anything at all - does it look like reality?

And from here the rest things just go down, including VS, about whom BW indeed just forgot.
Considering "reality" written in/forgotten" there are different assumptions, thoughts and ideas, including information from the previous game like ME1 for example where I yell at Liara, threaten her and recruit the last one. Including dialogues with the same Liara in ME1 where she is interested in Shepard. And other things.

Yes, it is the reality. You shit on a character for things that are Bioware's fault, because they suck at writing. Period.

Would not say it is Liara's fault in any case. If Tali or any other person can't tell what she feels, it is only her fault, Liara has nothing to do with that even if noticed (l'amour). Might make a hint, but does not have to at all (interested in Shepard or no).
Though assumption/proof about VS might be applied here since VS is LI in ME1, there could have been conflicts.



Some games are made not only for shooting bad guys. Such as MET or DAT make players think a lot: think about combat, think about events and characters. Liara is written as she is, bad writing on purpose or no, who knows.
I can say the same thing about Leliana watching how she is written in all three games and was it done on purpose or shitty writing? I know neither.

The game is done, charactrs are written and nothing can be changed. People play, discuss and and make conslusions.

All of the writing problems, are Bioware's fault. Every complaint I've seen about Liara, is Bioware's fault, and not the result of an action she's taken that is consistent with her character. If that was the case, something would be her fault. The problem is, she has no consistent character to judge anything she does. Her only consistent character trait, across the series, is her love of Shepard regardless. Hating a character is valid, if they do something that is actually despicable, or makes a choice that goes against their established principles or personal rules they live by. Finally if the character is simply defined by their immoral attitude or actions. Because then they are acting villainous. Hating a character because you can't ask questions, or because she has a piece of armor you don't want her to have, or any of the other things you've listed over the years, is not valid. Because she has no character to judge these actions against, because she was never given a character. Now, since her only trait was "I love Shepard", if she for example, during those two years moved on and got with someone else, then that is a valid reason to hate her. I would disagree with hating her in that situation because I think moving on from a dead loved one in two years is an okay thing to do. However, it would be acceptable to hate her for that, because that is a conscious choice she made, that flies in the face of her only character trait. If she consciously decided to r@pe Shepard at any point, that would be a valid reason to hate her, because she's choosing to do something despicable. But she hasn't, she's never done anything that is villainous, as well as having no character flaws to be critical of.



It is valid to hate Ashley for being Specist, because she is. However it's deeper than that, because the logic she uses to justify that stance, is provably correct. That is a character flaw, that was written into her story, and is thus a valid reason to hate her, but the argument persists because ultimately, she was right in ME3 about the aliens abandoning humanity like you were their dog.



Being critical of art is a very nuanced process sir, and it is absolutely critical that you break things down as far as you possibly can before deciding what the problem is, because your feedback can come from a flawed understanding of the problem, and thus the developer (if they care enough to address it) will apply a fix that does not work, because the feedback they got didn't go far enough in dissecting the core issue. It is Bioware's fault, for ignoring the other characters. Not telling A/K is literally the result of the writer's forgetting the VS even exists, so ofc they don't write anything for that. Hating a character, for the actions, or lack thereof of the writer, is ridiculous. Liara does nothing during the franchise to warrant this type of vitriol and behavior, she just doesn't. She is just as much a victim of Bioware's incompetence as everyone else, because she never got to be her own unique character, because she was written to be the original Rey Skywalker. You guys need to learn to compartmentalize properly, and put the vitriol and blame where it belongs.

Yea, you can hate how she is written. That does not mean you hate on her, and act as if she's a terrible person. 

She...she's not real, man. She is a fictional character written by a game developer. You can hate a character for how they are written because they only exist as writing. She doesn't choose anything because she doesn't have free will. 

I hate Ma-Rey Sue from Star Wars but have been told I am sexiest because I don't like her, even though I hate her because she is an objectively bad written character.