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Post by duskwanderer on Sept 4, 2021 17:10:33 GMT
Leliana has very different morals from Justinia. As does Vivienne, for that matter. Plus, we saw differences come about at the very end of the game. We really don't know the full ramifications: Things like that aren't instant. Rome wasn't built in a day, yada yada. Reading between the lines in the epilogue to Trespasser, it is clear that the most powerful mage faction is Vivienne and her loyalists, whether she is Divine or not, and the reforms under Leliana are very much dependent on her being in office to maintain them. Even if assassination attempts were unsuccessful, she'd can't live forever. So, whilst I would like to be proven wrong, even if they keep the distinction next game in the Codices, I think long term it will be back to the old system of Circles policed by the Templars. One of the conversations Vivienne has with Blackwall states that it's incredibly naive to believe you're changing everything forever as just one person. And that's very true. Countries don't remake themselves easily, save total destruction. Solas says a similar thing to an elven Inquisitor who accuses him of not doing enough for the elves. Even the Inquisitor hasn't the power to upend the entire social order and return the Dales to the elves. Briala might end up with lands and a title but that is about as far as it can go. In fact I fully expect her to lose even that once she no longer has the backing of the Inquisition. So, whatever we think we are accomplishing next game as a side effect or reward of dealing with the threat from Solas, I fully expect that it will only be short-lived. You're stating that like Vivienne's power will outstrip her lifespan. The problem with Leliana's College of Enchanters isn't that it lacks oversight or is the weaker of two factions. The problem is that the mages who are drawn to it are the kind who dislike restraint and careful practice of magic. You can maintain power without the Inqusition or another group if you can make that power your own and make it indispensable. Unfortunately for Briala, she doesn't have that capability. I fully expect she would lose the power that position entails too, but I think it's not for the same reason you believe.
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights
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Post by gervaise21 on Sept 4, 2021 17:10:54 GMT
Supporting my point that we need a real revolution. Destroy the magisterium, push off the Qunari, and establish a new order/political and economic system in Tevinter. I would love this to happen but I doubt it will be a reality. The best we can hope for is achieving the reform that Dorian wanted with his Lucerni. Unless it is a case of letting the Antaam destroy the Magesterium and then we destroy the Antaam. More likely it will be along the lines of getting them to work together for the greater good of saving the world.
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Post by duskwanderer on Sept 4, 2021 17:12:15 GMT
Supporting my point that we need a real revolution. Destroy the magisterium, push off the Qunari, and establish a new order/political and economic system in Tevinter. Destroy Tevinter Culture, raze it, remake it anew. Give 3+ real endings that won't be immediately cancelled out with writing. Assume it's the last game, like they assumed Origins would be the last game. If there is a DA5, again change to location so drastically it doesn't make us have to water down DA4 outcomes. I would expect this sort of system to completely collapse once the winter starts. Or a famine or other sort of natural disaster. History isn't kind to people who do that. Just ask the followers of the Aten.
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights
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Post by gervaise21 on Sept 4, 2021 17:20:11 GMT
You're stating that like Vivienne's power will outstrip her lifespan. No, I'm saying that Vivienne has the backing of the non-mage nobility and they ultimately control the direction the Chantry will take with regard to the mages. The reason the Circles lasted so long is that they had the backing of the secular rulers. Whilst the nobles might have to pay the price of losing the odd mage child to the Circles, normally there is always an "heir and a spare" and the offspring of nobility are treated very differently to those of commoners. They can keep in contact with their families, they are far more likely to be allowed out from time to time and in some cases it was even possible to arrange for hand picked Templars to be their overseers, thus ensuring they never had to suffer abuse. I've long suspected the reason the secular rulers did back having Circles is that they didn't want to have powerful mages out in the community who could help their own people defend against exploitation by those of higher rank. Leliana's ideas were a threat to the status quo, Vivienne's were not.
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ღ I am a golem. Obviously.
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26,120
phoray
Gotta be kiddin me
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August 2016
phoray
Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Dragon Age The Veilguard
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Post by phoray on Sept 4, 2021 18:27:05 GMT
I would expect this sort of system to completely collapse once the winter starts. Or a famine or other sort of natural disaster. History isn't kind to people who do that. Just ask the followers of the Aten. I didn't ask for historical accuracy. I asked for an ending of my choosing that felt like it mattered. Then fuck off to some other location so whatever I did isn't unwritten.
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Dec 12, 2024 11:35:41 GMT
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Aug 17, 2016 10:19:37 GMT
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Post by colfoley on Sept 4, 2021 19:08:42 GMT
Supporting my point that we need a real revolution. Destroy the magisterium, push off the Qunari, and establish a new order/political and economic system in Tevinter. Destroy Tevinter Culture, raze it, remake it anew. Give 3+ real endings that won't be immediately cancelled out with writing. Assume it's the last game, like they assumed Origins would be the last game. If there is a DA5, again change to location so drastically it doesn't make us have to water down DA4 outcomes. I think bioware has learned to avoid this. An ending should never have huge sweeping choices but be a culmination of choices. See Andromeda and ME 2.
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Post by duskwanderer on Sept 4, 2021 19:50:30 GMT
I would expect this sort of system to completely collapse once the winter starts. Or a famine or other sort of natural disaster. History isn't kind to people who do that. Just ask the followers of the Aten. I didn't ask for historical accuracy. I asked for an ending of my choosing that felt like it mattered. Then fuck off to some other location so whatever I did isn't unwritten. Then I advise fanfic.
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Post by duskwanderer on Sept 4, 2021 19:52:43 GMT
You're stating that like Vivienne's power will outstrip her lifespan. No, I'm saying that Vivienne has the backing of the non-mage nobility and they ultimately control the direction the Chantry will take with regard to the mages. The reason the Circles lasted so long is that they had the backing of the secular rulers. Whilst the nobles might have to pay the price of losing the odd mage child to the Circles, normally there is always an "heir and a spare" and the offspring of nobility are treated very differently to those of commoners. They can keep in contact with their families, they are far more likely to be allowed out from time to time and in some cases it was even possible to arrange for hand picked Templars to be their overseers, thus ensuring they never had to suffer abuse. I've long suspected the reason the secular rulers did back having Circles is that they didn't want to have powerful mages out in the community who could help their own people defend against exploitation by those of higher rank. Leliana's ideas were a threat to the status quo, Vivienne's were not. As we saw with Vivienne and Malcolm, the nobility is certainly okay with flaunting the Circle. Either that, or it's much more leinent than its critics give it credit for. Although, as we saw, Vivienne's family weren't nobility (neither was Malcolm) far as we can tell. Powerful mages would be more likely to seize power for themselves rather than "help the people." It's a noble idea that exists in storybooks, but not reality. Look at Tevinter.
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Gileadan
N5
Agent 46
Clearance Level Ultra
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: ALoneGretchin
Posts: 2,919 Likes: 7,495
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Agent 46
177
0
Dec 12, 2024 15:19:13 GMT
7,495
Gileadan
Clearance Level Ultra
2,919
August 2016
gileadan
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Gileadan on Sept 4, 2021 20:25:12 GMT
How about we keep that revolution going for say 20 years, only to find out in the end that the Tevinter people never wanted a total culture change and handed the reins back to the Magisterium faster than we could haul ass back to Ferelden or the Free Marches?
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights
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Post by gervaise21 on Sept 4, 2021 21:01:57 GMT
Although, as we saw, Vivienne's family weren't nobility (neither was Malcolm) far as we can tell. Vivienne caught the eye of a noble when allowed out to entertain the nobility and it was his influence that allowed her greater freedom outside the Circle. Then she got the backing of Celene and she was made. Ultimately, it did depend on the non-mage nobility. They are less happy with Vivienne as Divine but so long as she keeps the other mages under control, they will continue to back her. As the epilogue says, whilst mages appear to get greater freedom under her rule, she is always the one really in control. When she dies, it will just go back to regular Circles as before. As for Malcolm, the mages were allowed to attend the function in order to entertain the nobility and presumably he was recommended by the Templars as someone who could be trusted. They seemed rather more lenient back then in Kirkwall but it was really a similar situation to the one with Vivienne. The nobility want to be entertained with magic tricks and the Templars decide who can be trusted. If you do a good job and behave yourself, with any luck you will be invited again but it is the nobles who make the request, not the other way around. Powerful mages would be more likely to seize power for themselves rather than "help the people." It's a noble idea that exists in storybooks, but not reality. Look at Tevinter. This is true but whether for their own power or the sake of others, my point still stands; the non-mage nobility don't want to lose power to those beneath them. Having a "tame" mage in the family though is a different matter. So long as they don't push their luck too far, it can be useful having one around to intimidate your enemies. Look at what Vivienne did at her party. Apparently you can freeze your enemies provided you do it as part of the Game.
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Mar 12, 2017 22:45:38 GMT
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Post by duskwanderer on Sept 4, 2021 21:19:14 GMT
Although, as we saw, Vivienne's family weren't nobility (neither was Malcolm) far as we can tell. Vivienne caught the eye of a noble when allowed out to entertain the nobility and it was his influence that allowed her greater freedom outside the Circle. Then she got the backing of Celene and she was made. Ultimately, it did depend on the non-mage nobility. They are less happy with Vivienne as Divine but so long as she keeps the other mages under control, they will continue to back her. As the epilogue says, whilst mages appear to get greater freedom under her rule, she is always the one really in control. When she dies, it will just go back to regular Circles as before. As for Malcolm, the mages were allowed to attend the function in order to entertain the nobility and presumably he was recommended by the Templars as someone who could be trusted. They seemed rather more lenient back then in Kirkwall but it was really a similar situation to the one with Vivienne. The nobility want to be entertained with magic tricks and the Templars decide who can be trusted. If you do a good job and behave yourself, with any luck you will be invited again but it is the nobles who make the request, not the other way around. Powerful mages would be more likely to seize power for themselves rather than "help the people." It's a noble idea that exists in storybooks, but not reality. Look at Tevinter. This is true but whether for their own power or the sake of others, my point still stands; the non-mage nobility don't want to lose power to those beneath them. Having a "tame" mage in the family though is a different matter. So long as they don't push their luck too far, it can be useful having one around to intimidate your enemies. Look at what Vivienne did at her party. Apparently you can freeze your enemies provided you do it as part of the Game. It does, however, negate your point about the Circle. Nobility curries favors and that's been true for a long time. The elves, the dwarves, it's so common as to be silly. People like power, and they want to keep it. Then they're overthrown and the new people get the power and they keep it for themselves. Magic has nothing to do with it.
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August 2016
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights
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Post by gervaise21 on Sept 5, 2021 7:43:05 GMT
Magic has nothing to do with it. On the face of it, no, but shutting away all mages in Circles is protecting the status quo, particularly when the majority of those mages are not from the ruling class. I also forget to mention in my previous post that mages do not automatically assume power if left free in their community. The Avvar have free mages who would appear to act as spiritual leaders of their community, whilst non mages are the secular ones. They work together for the benefit of all. Likewise in Rivain, the Seers or Wise Women are the traditional leaders of the community but not in an overbearing way (unless you are a man I suppose). People go to them for advice and judgement on matters and seem happy to do so. Otherwise, the practice would have died out considering how the Chantry are in direct opposition to it. Yet the people away from the cities preferred to protect their Seers rather than report them to the Templars. The problem with Tevinter is that the entire ruling class are predominantly mages and they specifically breed for magical ability, thus perpetuating the disparity. Actually it has never been stated what status non mages have within Altus families but there does seem to be some evidence that they are either deliberately killed off, if there would otherwise be a risk of them inheriting, or exiled as an embarrassment. Felix was not actually a non-mage but a mage of negligible ability. His grandfather thought this brought shame on the family and, as an only child, there was a risk it would end up with a weak mage at its head, so he tried to have him assassinated, only to be murdered by Felix's mother. We know that Drakon's father was the son of a Magister who was a non mage, so left his homeland to seek his fortune elsewhere. Mind you, it was a way of spreading Tevinter's influence back down south, so it might well have been done with his father's blessing. The thing is, it cannot have always been this way. In the Chant of Light, Thalsian was not actually King of the Neromenians but one of the leader's Oracles, which I assume was their equivalent of Seer or Augur. Therefore, it may be assumed that the King was not a mage himself. So the Neromenians seemed to have the same arrangement as is found in the Avvar. When Darinius was a baby, his uncle, Tarsian, led a successful coup against his mother, yet he was a non mage. Even if he had the support of mages wishing to remove a political rival, if that was the case it is odd they didn't immediately overthrow someone who had no real defense against them. Darinius' mother was said to be the High Priestess of Razikale but also queen of the kingdom. May be this is what led Tarsian to challenged her rule, apart from personal ambition, because she had combined the role of secular and spiritual rulers, which went against tradition. This would explain how apparently he retained his position until Darinius grew up and was able to return and claim his birthright. After which Darinius set up the system of the Magisterium, which originally consisted of him as High Priest of Dumat and the other 6 High Priests of the Old Gods, who were all mages, presided over by him as Archon. The Archon continued to be both head of state and head of religion until the two offices were split to appease the southern Chantry. Hessarian, in order to stave off rebellion in the lower classes and remove his political rivals, tried to reverse the stranglehold that mages had on the political system by throwing open the Chantry priesthood to Soporati, thus giving them access to the Magisterium but of course it didn't last. The damage had been done right back at the beginning with Darinius and, as you say, once a group of people, in this case the mages, have acquired power, they are not going to relinquish it willingly. However, my point is that there was a system of governance among the ancient barbarians both north and south that did not automatically result in mages having absolute power over everyone else. It was Darinius changing the system of government that allowed this. Meanwhile, the non-mage nobility of Orlais justify their positions by the means of the state religion. Whilst the Emperor/Empress has never been both head of church and head of state, nevertheless the nobility are said to rule by "divine right", which gives a religious justification to the status quo as well as the having secular power. Really, in either case, the only way to bring about change in that status quo would be by violent revolution.
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Post by duskwanderer on Sept 5, 2021 12:22:52 GMT
Magic has nothing to do with it. On the face of it, no, but shutting away all mages in Circles is protecting the status quo, particularly when the majority of those mages are not from the ruling class. I also forget to mention in my previous post that mages do not automatically assume power if left free in their community. The Avvar have free mages who would appear to act as spiritual leaders of their community, whilst non mages are the secular ones. They work together for the benefit of all. Likewise in Rivain, the Seers or Wise Women are the traditional leaders of the community but not in an overbearing way (unless you are a man I suppose). People go to them for advice and judgement on matters and seem happy to do so. Otherwise, the practice would have died out considering how the Chantry are in direct opposition to it. Yet the people away from the cities preferred to protect their Seers rather than report them to the Templars. The problem with Tevinter is that the entire ruling class are predominantly mages and they specifically breed for magical ability, thus perpetuating the disparity. Actually it has never been stated what status non mages have within Altus families but there does seem to be some evidence that they are either deliberately killed off, if there would otherwise be a risk of them inheriting, or exiled as an embarrassment. Felix was not actually a non-mage but a mage of negligible ability. His grandfather thought this brought shame on the family and, as an only child, there was a risk it would end up with a weak mage at its head, so he tried to have him assassinated, only to be murdered by Felix's mother. We know that Drakon's father was the son of a Magister who was a non mage, so left his homeland to seek his fortune elsewhere. Mind you, it was a way of spreading Tevinter's influence back down south, so it might well have been done with his father's blessing. The thing is, it cannot have always been this way. In the Chant of Light, Thalsian was not actually King of the Neromenians but one of the leader's Oracles, which I assume was their equivalent of Seer or Augur. Therefore, it may be assumed that the King was not a mage himself. So the Neromenians seemed to have the same arrangement as is found in the Avvar. When Darinius was a baby, his uncle, Tarsian, led a successful coup against his mother, yet he was a non mage. Even if he had the support of mages wishing to remove a political rival, if that was the case it is odd they didn't immediately overthrow someone who had no real defense against them. Darinius' mother was said to be the High Priestess of Razikale but also queen of the kingdom. May be this is what led Tarsian to challenged her rule, apart from personal ambition, because she had combined the role of secular and spiritual rulers, which went against tradition. This would explain how apparently he retained his position until Darinius grew up and was able to return and claim his birthright. After which Darinius set up the system of the Magisterium, which originally consisted of him as High Priest of Dumat and the other 6 High Priests of the Old Gods, who were all mages, presided over by him as Archon. The Archon continued to be both head of state and head of religion until the two offices were split to appease the southern Chantry. Hessarian, in order to stave off rebellion in the lower classes and remove his political rivals, tried to reverse the stranglehold that mages had on the political system by throwing open the Chantry priesthood to Soporati, thus giving them access to the Magisterium but of course it didn't last. The damage had been done right back at the beginning with Darinius and, as you say, once a group of people, in this case the mages, have acquired power, they are not going to relinquish it willingly. However, my point is that there was a system of governance among the ancient barbarians both north and south that did not automatically result in mages having absolute power over everyone else. It was Darinius changing the system of government that allowed this. Meanwhile, the non-mage nobility of Orlais justify their positions by the means of the state religion. Whilst the Emperor/Empress has never been both head of church and head of state, nevertheless the nobility are said to rule by "divine right", which gives a religious justification to the status quo as well as the having secular power. Really, in either case, the only way to bring about change in that status quo would be by violent revolution. How quickly you make assumptions for the benefit of mages and endorse violent revolution. And we have seen so very little of the cultures of ancient barbarians that to view only the Stone Bears and take them as common is silly. You've also made a lot of assumptions about the Seers, too, assuming they weren't overbearing. Traditions are hard to overcome, and that Circle got annulled anyway. There were pagan rituals as close as Serault performed, and the templars knew nothing about it.
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ღ I am a golem. Obviously.
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Gotta be kiddin me
13,303
August 2016
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Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Dragon Age The Veilguard
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Post by phoray on Sept 5, 2021 14:18:21 GMT
So, I guess I don't feel like I have to be a slave. I mostly want to be a rebel. And I do want to be from Tevinter, not another country. If a Dalish elf can ask stupid questions about their own religion to the white human mage that was made to join our group, then a Tevinter native can ask questions about how the land works. I mean, it's been a while since I played Skyrim, but the player character was from that country and had no issues asking a bunch of questions they should "have known" the answer to.
Lords of Fortune just isn't winning me over. They are just such a bland adventuring group of blandness.
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31,186
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August 2016
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights
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Post by gervaise21 on Sept 5, 2021 19:22:10 GMT
How quickly you make assumptions for the benefit of mages and endorse violent revolution. I wasn't favouring mages but trying to show that it depends on the way the government is set up. I seem to recall it was you who pointed out the people in power tend to want to hang on to it. When the religion also supports their right to be in the position of authority, there isn't much room for peaceful reform. I'd like to think there was but as you also said: "Countries don't remake themselves easily." It is clear from the various exchanges we have had on different threads that you are always determined to contradict me, even when I have actually supported your viewpoint on some matter, or put the worst possible interpretation on what I have been saying. I have supported my view with information taken from the texts we have been supplied with both in game and the source material. However, whilst I admit that is just my interpretation of that information, it is just as valid as your own, which often seem to ignore the evidence or interpret it to your own prejudiced viewpoint. So far as I am concerned, I find it tiresome and so I am no longer willing to debate with you. Let's just agree to disagree and leave it at that.
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Post by duskwanderer on Sept 5, 2021 19:28:15 GMT
How quickly you make assumptions for the benefit of mages and endorse violent revolution. I wasn't favouring mages but trying to show that it depends on the way the government is set up. I seem to recall it was you who pointed out the people in power tend to want to hang on to it. When the religion also supports their right to be in the position of authority, there isn't much room for peaceful reform. I'd like to think there was but as you also said: "Countries don't remake themselves easily." It is clear from the various exchanges we have had on different threads that you are always determined to contradict me, even when I have actually supported your viewpoint on some matter, or put the worst possible interpretation on what I have been saying. I have supported my view with information taken from the texts we have been supplied with both in game and the source material. However, whilst I admit that is just my interpretation of that information, it is just as valid as your own, which often seem to ignore the evidence or interpret it to your own prejudiced viewpoint. So far as I am concerned, I find it tiresome and so I am no longer willing to debate with you. Let's just agree to disagree and leave it at that. If you'll notice, they don't actually contradict. Countries do not, in fact, remake easily, and violent revolutions often meet their ends at their own violent revolution. I simply do not give mages or anyone else the benefit of pretending that they are more valid. It is simply a personal failing on your part to acknowledge parts of our agreement. Lots of evidence is ignored by you, frequently for the benefit of your group. We were having an interesting discussion until you allowed your prejudices to get in the way.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 5, 2021 19:31:51 GMT
Historically speaking, nonviolent revolutions/reformations/rights movements/etc have a far higher success rate than violent ones.
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August 2016
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http://bsn.boards.net/threads/recent/143
https://i.imgur.com/1myVt9D.jpg
DragonKingReborn
Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition, Dragon Age The Veilguard
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Post by DragonKingReborn on Sept 5, 2021 22:07:45 GMT
So, I guess I don't feel like I have to be a slave. I mostly want to be a rebel. And I do want to be from Tevinter, not another country. If a Dalish elf can ask stupid questions about their own religion to the white human mage that was made to join our group, then a Tevinter native can ask questions about how the land works. I mean, it's been a while since I played Skyrim, but the player character was from that country and had no issues asking a bunch of questions they should "have known" the answer to. Lords of Fortune just isn't winning me over. They are just such a bland adventuring group of blandness. What about them feels bland to you? I don't consume any of the other media (for any game/game series) so all I know/have seen about them was in the discussion that took place several months back with the videos that were put out. If nothing else, being a diverse collective of mercenaries rather than an organisation of demon fighters or a pseudo-religious governing body gives our protagonist a reason to be out in the world doing things not 100%, directly related to the main plot.
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Apr 14, 2022 23:07:25 GMT
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion
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Post by gaycaravaggio on Sept 5, 2021 22:13:37 GMT
So, I guess I don't feel like I have to be a slave. I mostly want to be a rebel. And I do want to be from Tevinter, not another country. If a Dalish elf can ask stupid questions about their own religion to the white human mage that was made to join our group, then a Tevinter native can ask questions about how the land works. I mean, it's been a while since I played Skyrim, but the player character was from that country and had no issues asking a bunch of questions they should "have known" the answer to. Lords of Fortune just isn't winning me over. They are just such a bland adventuring group of blandness. I feel like you could make the Lords of Fortune interesting if you play with the idea a little. For instance, you could have someone who seemingly only cares about profit. Then, overtime, they actually grow to care about the people around them and reveal themselves to have a hidden heart of gold. Or maybe they could be pushed further into their money-grubbing ways and end up turning against you for money. And there's a lot of interesting ways you could use their backstory to explain their obsession with monetary goods.
But Your Mileage May Vary, and, as it is, that would function better as a companion than a character you shape the personality of.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 5, 2021 22:22:20 GMT
So, I guess I don't feel like I have to be a slave. I mostly want to be a rebel. And I do want to be from Tevinter, not another country. If a Dalish elf can ask stupid questions about their own religion to the white human mage that was made to join our group, then a Tevinter native can ask questions about how the land works. I mean, it's been a while since I played Skyrim, but the player character was from that country and had no issues asking a bunch of questions they should "have known" the answer to. Lords of Fortune just isn't winning me over. They are just such a bland adventuring group of blandness. I feel like you could make the Lords of Fortune interesting if you play with the idea a little. For instance, you could have someone who seemingly only cares about profit. Then, overtime, they actually grow to care about the people around them and reveal themselves to have a hidden heart of gold. Or maybe they could be pushed further into their money-grubbing ways and end up turning against you for money. And there's a lot of interesting ways you could use their backstory to explain their obsession with monetary goods.
But Your Mileage May Vary, and, as it is, that would function better as a companion than a character you shape the personality of. Ugh, that sounds awful.
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inherit
ღ I am a golem. Obviously.
440
0
26,120
phoray
Gotta be kiddin me
13,303
August 2016
phoray
Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Dragon Age The Veilguard
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Post by phoray on Sept 5, 2021 22:24:05 GMT
because they're a group of "anything you want to be, all races and classes welcome" with no binding goal. We already got to play a merc with no real goals in the form of the Dwarf/Qunari background in DAI
Edit Add: and look how much they did with that, practically nothing.
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inherit
Scribbles
185
0
31,578
Hanako Ikezawa
22,991
August 2016
hanakoikezawa
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 5, 2021 22:24:08 GMT
I mean, it's been a while since I played Skyrim, but the player character was from that country and had no issues asking a bunch of questions they should "have known" the answer to. The background of your character is up to you. It is never established your character is from Skyrim. Most assume you aren't, like for example if you choose Dunmer they assume you're a refugee from Morrowind.
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inherit
1587
0
1,772
Walter Black
1,290
Sept 15, 2016 15:02:16 GMT
September 2016
walterblack
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Post by Walter Black on Sept 5, 2021 22:26:07 GMT
Given some writer and dev comments, I'm sure our DA4 protagonist will be railroaded into bringing down Tevinter (and maybe the Qun as well) by any means necessary, no matter what. However, those of us who like multiple runs with characters who could be cautious and/or pragmatic, patriotic, ruthlessly ambitious, just plain evil and/or insane or anything in between, it looks like are SOL.
I really hope I'm wrong, but the current Bioware doesn't strike me as having enough honesty, artistic integrity, respect for their customers, or sheer balls to allow players that kind of role playing freedom anymore.
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inherit
1587
0
1,772
Walter Black
1,290
Sept 15, 2016 15:02:16 GMT
September 2016
walterblack
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Post by Walter Black on Sept 5, 2021 22:38:31 GMT
I feel like you could make the Lords of Fortune interesting if you play with the idea a little. For instance, you could have someone who seemingly only cares about profit. Then, overtime, they actually grow to care about the people around them and reveal themselves to have a hidden heart of gold. Or maybe they could be pushed further into their money-grubbing ways and end up turning against you for money. And there's a lot of interesting ways you could use their backstory to explain their obsession with monetary goods.
But Your Mileage May Vary, and, as it is, that would function better as a companion than a character you shape the personality of. Ugh, that sounds awful. Or your character could have became a Lord of Fortune to help worthy goals like family, jobs for the poor, medicine, education and the like. It's not Thedas has fundraising telethons...
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inherit
11247
0
1,639
Buckeldemon
Now stealin' more kidz.
1,200
July 2019
buckeldemon
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Buckeldemon on Sept 5, 2021 22:40:07 GMT
I mean, it's been a while since I played Skyrim, but the player character was from that country and had no issues asking a bunch of questions they should "have known" the answer to. The background of your character is up to you. It is never established your character is from Skyrim. Most assume you aren't, like for example if you choose Dunmer they assume you're a refugee from Morrowind. Hah, I've once seen someone arguing that the LDB must be from Cyrodiil as there's a Cyrod NPC somewhere who asks something like "how was it down home?", which I took as that NPCs home (because Imperial Cyrod), not the LDB's. And I have no idea how it would work in case of Argonians, given their lore. Weirdly, Ulfric's lieutenant calls Nord LDBs foreigners regardless.
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