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Post by azarhal on Aug 30, 2024 11:57:42 GMT
- DAVe limit of 2 companions, but the reason for it was based on players feedbacks. DAV has 2 companions based on player feedback? Who were these players that said they rather have two? Have these players played any of the previous DA games? A lots of them probably did, since part of the "feedbacks" is telemetry from DAI. And the reduction to 2 companions is not " I don't like having 3 companions", it was " I want the camera to focus on my player character not the companions" and after some tests they reduced to two companions and the playtesters agreed with the change.
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Post by Frost on Aug 30, 2024 12:01:13 GMT
Yeah, but Kala and Ghil'dirthalen and the Council (sure they're great and all but) do not speak for me. Nor can they speak for all the other players and fans who will be purchasing DAV with their own money - not Kala's, not Ghil's or whoever else. This. Companions can’t be controlled during combat, so what would they object to with having more? Technical issues make more sense as a reason. The council having no issues and all loving the combat after Bioware made many controversial combat changes makes me think the council doesn’t have much variety of different types of players on it.
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Post by Gileadan on Aug 30, 2024 12:10:34 GMT
Yeah, I don't get this "camera focus on the player character" explanation for the party reduction. You could bring six companions and still place the camera in the same way. Companions don't take up more screen space than your enemies. How many moments are there in any video released so far where a companion blocks your view in some way?
But each additional companion would require that many more skill/combo icons on the pause menu. More companions means you have more combo options. More companions cause more damage (and apparently they really can't be killed in combat) without you having to do anything except staying alive.
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Post by luketrevelyan on Aug 30, 2024 12:17:26 GMT
I'm guessing the reduced companions is due to the UI where you would select their abilities. It is already too busy for my tastes and with 3 companions it would be worse unless they redesigned it. So I think once they decided to drop companion control, the party of 3 followed from that. I hate both decisions, but I can sort of see how it might happen.
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Post by themikefest on Aug 30, 2024 12:30:43 GMT
DAV has 2 companions based on player feedback? Who were these players that said they rather have two? Have these players played any of the previous DA games? A lots of them probably did, since part of the "feedbacks" is telemetry from DAI. And the reduction to 2 companions is not " I don't like having 3 companions", it was " I want the camera to focus on my player character not the companions" and after some tests they reduced to two companions and the playtesters agreed with the change. I would be curious what these playtesters saw differently from having 3 companions vs having 2 companions. When I control a character, regardless if there's one companion or many companions, the camera is always focused on the character I control.
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Post by azarhal on Aug 30, 2024 12:38:55 GMT
Yeah, I don't get this "camera focus on the player character" explanation for the party reduction. You could bring six companions and still place the camera in the same way. Companions don't take up more screen space than your enemies. How many moments are there in any video released so far where a companion blocks your view in some way? But each additional companion would require that many more skill/combo icons on the pause menu. More companions means you have more combo options. More companions cause more damage (and apparently they really can't be killed in combat) without you having to do anything except staying alive. It's not about blocking the view, it's about the focus of the action. Who's doing what, where and when. With more companions, you want a wider camera view so you can see more of the battlefield because you have more people to manage and more things are happening away from the MC. Fewer companions = less people to manage = more focus on the MC And lets not talk about the wheel, it's already full with just 2 companions and the MC. edit: and this thread is already filled with people complainings about all the colors and special FX. It would just be worst with more companions. You really think 6 companions fit into this camera view without hidding the MC in the middle? And this is what is looks like when 3 characters are attacking the same enemy while using skills:
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Post by jadedragon on Aug 30, 2024 12:50:47 GMT
I would look for the different way to play a rogue with different specializations. I would like to see Saboteur or Veil Ranger, because we don't know how traps and co works. When has BioWare released video(s) of all the specializations and every possible builds? We might see a few seconds of archer rogue since they barely showed that, but I think people are expecting way too much here. For Inquisition Bioware released 3 videos each 2 min long. Each video showcased 2 companions who they were and how they played. For example.Cassandra and Viv have their own trailer displaying such. It was simple and effect. Would it have been so much for me to expect the same level of quailty and treatment this go around during companions week instead of having to go to their website and read about it? I don't think fans are expecting to much as really it's the marketing team that's either doing too much or too little for wide scale fan interest. Companion concept art is cool and all but end of the day it's a video game we gotta see your product. And nobody was even asking for this detailed combat trailer with the heavy spoilers. I think the same about of time they took in this trailer had it been a video with different Rooks showing different combat styles it would've been just as if not more effective. And they could've not put in the spoiler text. Also on the 2 or 3 companions front. I will like it's the UI issue more so then the camera. But I don't think there is any good reason as to why we have 2 over 3. And I especially feel this way because we are going to have guest companions like Varric or possibly Morrigan. If we have multiple quest with guest companions that would really make the we can't handle 3 companions a hard sell for me. Because you still gave me a 3rd only difference is I can't control them so it's a worse 3rd option
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Post by Gileadan on Aug 30, 2024 13:39:25 GMT
Yeah, I don't get this "camera focus on the player character" explanation for the party reduction. You could bring six companions and still place the camera in the same way. Companions don't take up more screen space than your enemies. How many moments are there in any video released so far where a companion blocks your view in some way? But each additional companion would require that many more skill/combo icons on the pause menu. More companions means you have more combo options. More companions cause more damage (and apparently they really can't be killed in combat) without you having to do anything except staying alive. It's not about blocking the view, it's about the focus of the action. Who's doing what, where and when. With more companions, you want a wider camera view so you can see more of the battlefield because you have more people to manage and more things are happening away from the MC. Fewer companions = less people to manage = more focus on the MC And lets not talk about the wheel, it's already full with just 2 companions and the MC. edit: and this thread is already filled with people complainings about all the colors and special FX. It would just be worst with more companions. You really think 6 companions fit into this camera view without hidding the MC in the middle? And this is what is looks like when 3 characters are attacking the same enemy while using skills: ... (removed images) The first shot is just the companions walking next to you before all hell breaks loose. In actual combat they are generally further away and sometimes not even on camera. But yeah, if this is how the party looks when traversing a map outside of combat, it might get crowded if you want all companions in view all or most of the time. The second shot is just a particle blob of red and black and purple. It's a VFX overload, not a crowd of too many companions. How do you tell how many characters are on it anyway except Rook? Is "who's doing what" really important? Your companions run around and act as an invulnerable window dressing with a damage over time effect unless ordered to do a combo as far as I can see. I doubt you'd be interrupting them from anything important when you want them to do a combo. I'm pretty sure it's all about the wheel.
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Post by sjsharp2010 on Aug 30, 2024 13:48:37 GMT
Yeah, I keep hearing that, yet I haven't met or know of such a player, I mean really. So it's like gnomes, if I've never seen one, do they truly exist? Because I wanna slap'em (not the gnomes, the players. Supposed players). But "oh, honey it creates a more intimate experience blah blah..." - shut the hell up, Shelby. You want intimate, bone a companion, doesn't get more intimate than that. Plus, literally hours worth of one-on-one conversations with each of them. Do you even play DA??? Fackin' Shelby from QA... 😡 That bish better sleep with one eye open. Kala and Ghil'dirthalen related their experiences from the Community Council that BioWare put together and they both said that one of the few things that the Council seemed to universally like was the combat mechanics. So I am sure that is at least some of the feedback they were talking about. I als oheard tha tKala has a disability as well she plays games using her feet s oi fshe can play Veilguard well enough it kind o fgives m ehope too that I'll be abl t oadapt. I don' tpla ygames wit hm yfeet but only having one hand on the controls can stil lbe problematic a ttimes. I fshe can maste rth ecomba tthen I'm hopeful I can too.
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Post by jennica on Aug 30, 2024 13:55:35 GMT
Your companions run around and act as an invulnerable window dressing with a damage over time effect unless ordered to do a combo as far as I can see. It's not clear if companions can't die. They can definitely be targeted and get hit by the enemies, but maybe, as you said, they're invulnerable to damage. It's hard to say, because at some point we can see Rook's health dropping to zero and she didn't die, which means that Bioware had "no death" option turned on.
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Post by sjsharp2010 on Aug 30, 2024 14:07:53 GMT
DAV has 2 companions based on player feedback? Who were these players that said they rather have two? Have these players played any of the previous DA games? A lots of them probably did, since part of the "feedbacks" is telemetry from DAI. And the reduction to 2 companions is not " I don't like having 3 companions", it was " I want the camera to focus on my player character not the companions" and after some tests they reduced to two companions and the playtesters agreed with the change. I thin ks oas on ethin gthat still annoys m eis how companions keep bumping int oeac hothre and stuff like tha toutside o fcombat an dgettin gin each others way. The reductoin in squad size the yprobabl yfel twas the bes twa yt ohandle that.
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Post by themikefest on Aug 30, 2024 14:20:16 GMT
A lots of them probably did, since part of the "feedbacks" is telemetry from DAI. And the reduction to 2 companions is not " I don't like having 3 companions", it was " I want the camera to focus on my player character not the companions" and after some tests they reduced to two companions and the playtesters agreed with the change. I thin ks oas on ethin gthat still annoys m eis how companions keep bumping int oeac hothre and stuff like tha toutside o fcombat an dgettin gin each others way. The reductoin in squad size the yprobabl yfel twas the bes twa yt ohandle that. It took them 3 games to figure that out? It was an option to take 3 unless the game forced 3. There have been many times where I used 2 or even one companion for a quest and/or a full playthrough.
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Post by sjsharp2010 on Aug 30, 2024 14:32:32 GMT
I thin ks oas on ethin gthat still annoys m eis how companions keep bumping int oeac hothre and stuff like tha toutside o fcombat an dgettin gin each others way. The reductoin in squad size the yprobabl yfel twas the bes twa yt ohandle that. It took them 3 games to figure that out? It was an option to take 3 unless the game forced 3. There have been many times where I used 2 or even one companion for a quest and/or a full playthrough. Well the yweren' tknocking eac hothre around in Origin and 2 onl yin DAI s otha tmigh tb ewhy the ychanged that for Veilguard in order t ostop that.
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Post by Grog Muffins on Aug 30, 2024 14:38:51 GMT
DAV has 2 companions based on player feedback? Who were these players that said they rather have two? Have these players played any of the previous DA games? A lots of them probably did, since part of the "feedbacks" is telemetry from DAI. And the reduction to 2 companions is not " I don't like having 3 companions", it was " I want the camera to focus on my player character not the companions" and after some tests they reduced to two companions and the playtesters agreed with the change. Come to play a party based game. Proceed to complain the party based game has party control. /meme DAV is far enough removed from the rest of the series IRL time wise it may as well be a soft reboot and, honestly, it may have been better if that's how they marketed it. For clarity, if nothing else. I don't think the impact on the player base would have been any more divisive than it is now. Putting a decision like removing the party based aspect that was in every game in the series, even the obscure Flash games, on focus groups or even on the glorified QA testing that the community council did is a bit much, I think. Ghil said she was part of the council thing for a bit over a year when she announced it. The decision for the gameplay loop to be what it is now was made well before the council was formed, they just did QA and gave their feedback on how it felt and how to make it feel better within the confines of it being like this, but Bioware had already decided it would be like this.
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Post by fairdragon on Aug 30, 2024 15:39:44 GMT
- DAVe limit of 2 companions, but the reason for it was based on players feedbacks. DAV has 2 companions based on player feedback? Who were these players that said they rather have two? Have these players played any of the previous DA games? They only said the hours they playtest and if it is on consul or PC. But we don't know what the playtesters tast is. What they like or don't like? So i can only say the 3 consul member that speak up loved the gameplay. We know Kala is a ME fan and loved DAI the most. Ghil started with DAI, i am not sure what her favorite DA game is.
The council having no issues and all loving the combat after Bioware made many controversial combat changes makes me think the council doesn’t have much variety of different types of players on it. Sadly we know only 3 member.
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Post by azarhal on Aug 30, 2024 15:45:49 GMT
A lots of them probably did, since part of the "feedbacks" is telemetry from DAI. And the reduction to 2 companions is not " I don't like having 3 companions", it was " I want the camera to focus on my player character not the companions" and after some tests they reduced to two companions and the playtesters agreed with the change. Come to play a party based game. Proceed to complain the party based game has party control. /meme DAV is far enough removed from the rest of the series IRL time wise it may as well be a soft reboot and, honestly, it may have been better if that's how they marketed it. For clarity, if nothing else. I don't think the impact on the player base would have been any more divisive than it is now. Putting a decision like removing the party based aspect that was in every game in the series, even the obscure Flash games, on focus groups or even on the glorified QA testing that the community council did is a bit much, I think. Ghil said she was part of the council thing for a bit over a year when she announced it. The decision for the gameplay loop to be what it is now was made well before the council was formed, they just did QA and gave their feedback on how it felt and how to make it feel better within the confines of it being like this, but Bioware had already decided it would be like this. A lot of the feedbacks was from DAI post release survey/online comments and the game (DAI) telemetry. And you don't code a combat system and then ask people to playtest it a year before release. That's an iterative process, usually started in pre-production, with internal playtesting. I find it amusing that people are arguing that's not what happened, when I followed enough games (especially MMOs) to accept what the devs said about it because I've seen the exact same arguments used to do the exact same thing at other developer in other game series.
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Post by fairdragon on Aug 30, 2024 15:45:51 GMT
Yeah, I don't get this "camera focus on the player character" explanation for the party reduction. You could bring six companions and still place the camera in the same way. Companions don't take up more screen space than your enemies. How many moments are there in any video released so far where a companion blocks your view in some way? But each additional companion would require that many more skill/combo icons on the pause menu. More companions means you have more combo options. More companions cause more damage (and apparently they really can't be killed in combat) without you having to do anything except staying alive. It's not about blocking the view, it's about the focus of the action. Who's doing what, where and when. With more companions, you want a wider camera view so you can see more of the battlefield because you have more people to manage and more things are happening away from the MC. Fewer companions = less people to manage = more focus on the MC And lets not talk about the wheel, it's already full with just 2 companions and the MC. edit: and this thread is already filled with people complainings about all the colors and special FX. It would just be worst with more companions. You really think 6 companions fit into this camera view without hidding the MC in the middle? And this is what is looks like when 3 characters are attacking the same enemy while using skills: Yes the problem is frostbite not the playtester or the dev. DAI tactic view doesn't work really good. I hope if we get a DA5 they can use a different engin.
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Post by fairdragon on Aug 30, 2024 15:54:10 GMT
A lots of them probably did, since part of the "feedbacks" is telemetry from DAI. And the reduction to 2 companions is not " I don't like having 3 companions", it was " I want the camera to focus on my player character not the companions" and after some tests they reduced to two companions and the playtesters agreed with the change. Come to play a party based game. Proceed to complain the party based game has party control. /meme DAV is far enough removed from the rest of the series IRL time wise it may as well be a soft reboot and, honestly, it may have been better if that's how they marketed it. For clarity, if nothing else. I don't think the impact on the player base would have been any more divisive than it is now. Putting a decision like removing the party based aspect that was in every game in the series, even the obscure Flash games, on focus groups or even on the glorified QA testing that the community council did is a bit much, I think. Ghil said she was part of the council thing for a bit over a year when she announced it. The decision for the gameplay loop to be what it is now was made well before the council was formed, they just did QA and gave their feedback on how it felt and how to make it feel better within the confines of it being like this, but Bioware had already decided it would be like this. But Kala and Ghil have also said on an video that bioware have take their feedback, but gameplay wise their was nothing they would liked to be changed.
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Post by themikefest on Aug 30, 2024 16:05:23 GMT
DAV has 2 companions based on player feedback? Who were these players that said they rather have two? Have these players played any of the previous DA games? They only said the hours they playtest and if it is on consul or PC. But we don't know what the playtesters tast is. What they like or don't like? So i can only say the 3 consul member that speak up loved the gameplay. We know Kala is a ME fan and loved DAI the most. Ghil started with DAI, i am not sure what her favorite DA game is. Council members? Kala? Ghil? Don't know who they are. I'm an ME fan as well as a DA fan. I like DAO the most
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Post by fairdragon on Aug 30, 2024 16:08:00 GMT
They only said the hours they playtest and if it is on consul or PC. But we don't know what the playtesters tast is. What they like or don't like? So i can only say the 3 consul member that speak up loved the gameplay. We know Kala is a ME fan and loved DAI the most. Ghil started with DAI, i am not sure what her favorite DA game is. Council members? Kala? Ghil? Don't know who they are. I'm an ME fan as well as a DA fan. I like DAO the most here you go. Look them up: Edit: on Kalas channel is a live where both talk with each other.
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Post by Ice-Quinn on Aug 30, 2024 18:15:29 GMT
I saw nothing super wrong about DAI’s combat relating to party size, FX and camera. It’s been that way for 3 games, and it’s a change that will take getting used to.
According to the Devs, after play testing they found that with 2 companions “it creates a more intimate experience” or whatever, allowing you to focus on the 2 companions and what they do and say during quests. Well, ok then.
I‘m going into it with an open mind, but I can only tell you if I agree and like the change once I play the game. Not before that, because someone on the Council said so. The Council is great marketing, it’s not even QA or play testing. No offense meant, their work is appreciated and all. But they do not represent me.
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Post by fairdragon on Aug 30, 2024 18:24:05 GMT
I saw nothing super wrong about DAI’s combat relating to party size, FX and camera. It’s been that way for 3 games, and it’s a change that will take getting used to. According to the Devs, after play testing they found that with 2 companions “it creates a more intimate experience” or whatever, allowing you to focus on the 2 companions and what they do and say during quests. Well, ok then. I‘m going into it with an open mind, but I can only tell you if I agree and like the change once I play the game. Not before that, because someone on the Council said so. The Council is great marketing, it’s not even QA or play testing. No offense meant, their work is appreciated and all. But they do not represent me. You are right. Everyone need to see and play it for themself to decied.
I think the problem started with DAI tactic system that they don't wanted to repeat, but also don't wanted to cut completly.
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Post by Grog Muffins on Aug 30, 2024 18:34:30 GMT
Come to play a party based game. Proceed to complain the party based game has party control. /meme DAV is far enough removed from the rest of the series IRL time wise it may as well be a soft reboot and, honestly, it may have been better if that's how they marketed it. For clarity, if nothing else. I don't think the impact on the player base would have been any more divisive than it is now. Putting a decision like removing the party based aspect that was in every game in the series, even the obscure Flash games, on focus groups or even on the glorified QA testing that the community council did is a bit much, I think. Ghil said she was part of the council thing for a bit over a year when she announced it. The decision for the gameplay loop to be what it is now was made well before the council was formed, they just did QA and gave their feedback on how it felt and how to make it feel better within the confines of it being like this, but Bioware had already decided it would be like this. But Kala and Ghil have also said on an video that bioware have take their feedback, but gameplay wise their was nothing they would liked to be changed. The thing about these types of groups is that they're a very small sample size and can't really speak for anyone but themselves and people with their particular preferences. Most of the time a fandom can't decide on anything itself, can a group of 10 to 20 people really be able to speak for an entire fandom? I don't know Kala, I watch Ghil's videos but can't say I know anything else about her and her preferences, and I don't know who else is on this council. Nor do I really care, honestly. I don't look at them as an authority on the game but more as a source of general fun facts. They could be perfectly honest or they could be trying to be diplomatic and try to do what they can to assuage people's worries. There's still stuff they can't talk about, they're under NDA likely until the game comes out. There could be things they won't be able to talk about even after the game comes out, depending on their NDA details. Best to just take what they say as opinions of individuals. If your preferences match with theirs, that's great, you're set. If you don't know what their preferences are, it's harder to get anything out of a statement like "there was nothing they would have liked to be changed". For me personally, Bioware showcasing their own games has never hit me positively. I never got a good reaction out of Bioware themselves showing off what their games can do. The DAI showcases, MEA showcases, I thought they were either boring (DAI) or a mess (MEA). Was too busy with exams to catch any of the ME3 ones and I found out about the other games before ME3 was released well after they were released. Unless I can find someone who can say the same about the DAI and MEA gameplay showcases, I don't think I can trust someone else's opinion before my own.
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Post by yarus on Sept 4, 2024 0:38:20 GMT
The IGN video annoyed me.
They specifically acknowledged that players kept asking about healing spells and then sidestepped the answer by mentioning that Neve has healing specializations.
We can't play as Neve, or any companion thanks to the Devs' choices, and it feels weird for them to not clarify whether or not the player character and main as a spirit healer.
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Post by colfoley on Sept 4, 2024 1:50:52 GMT
The IGN video annoyed me. They specifically acknowledged that players kept asking about healing spells and then sidestepped the answer by mentioning that Neve has healing specializations. We can't play as Neve, or any companion thanks to the Devs' choices, and it feels weird for them to not clarify whether or not the player character and main as a spirit healer. Same thing from Inquisition. Inquisition had healing spells for companions and the Inquisitor, Veilguard has healing spells for the companions and Rook. This is not really that much of a surprise.
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