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Post by General Mahad on Nov 24, 2016 2:18:19 GMT
Wait what? When does this happen? In ME3 when you first talk to Thane at the window in the lobby of the Huerta Memorial Hospital. At 0:49 in the above video... They did try to cut the scene a bit from what FemShep does, but you'd still have to be pretty stupid not to recognize it as a kiss on the cheek. I think your reading too much into the cut, there's an animation where a character puts their hand on the other persons shoulder to try to console them or give them a morale boost.
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Post by midnightwolf on Nov 24, 2016 2:21:29 GMT
Hello all. I'm new to the forum and the ME world, since I only started playing the games in October. But I have to say, I'd rather we didn't have a designated best friend -human or otherwise- in ME:A. It should be up to the player to choose. As for Liara......I really don't like her and how MY Shepard is forced to like and interact with her so much. It completely takes the role play aspect away. If interested, you can post your playthrough in this thread. Thanks....I'll take a look.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 24, 2016 15:57:24 GMT
In ME3 when you first talk to Thane at the window in the lobby of the Huerta Memorial Hospital. At 0:49 in the above video... They did try to cut the scene a bit from what FemShep does, but you'd still have to be pretty stupid not to recognize it as a kiss on the cheek. I think your reading too much into the cut, there's an animation where a character puts their hand on the other persons shoulder to try to console them or give them a morale boost. Well, I think people are reading too much into Liara's hug. It's really not worth flipping out over. Both scenes result from Bioware wanting to use the same motions to cover a cut scene between Shepard and a character they may be in a romance with. The same is also true with Garrus on earth where that "shoulder pat" motion is the start of a kiss if Garrus is Shepard's LI. What they cut from the Thane scene was the actual kiss that a romanced FemShep gives Thane... while leaving in the motion of leaning in for that kiss. What they cut from the Liara hug on Ilium was Shepard trying to actually kiss Liara and Liara pushing Shepard away. It's all about conserving computing resources... nothing more. Can they do better?... I've said three times that they certainly can and that's a fair criticism. Flipping out over Bioware "forcing" Liara as a BFF on the players is not a reasonable criticism, IMHO. To compensate a bit if they have an issue with it, the player can 1) opt to skip many conversations with her; 2) be rude to her in several conversations; 3) recruit her so late in ME1 that a relationship is not possible in that game; 5) forfeit recruiting Thane and Samara and skip meeting Liara on Illium altogether; 5) skip the ME3 cabin conversation and the conversation on the Citadel; and 6) for further good measure, skip talking to her on Earth as well. As I've also said, combined with talking frequently with whoever I want to make seem like my BFF, I can manipulate the situation sufficiently to make it clear that person is my BFF or LI and not Liara. I just can't make her hate Shepard... and that's not really a big deal for me since some people do inexplicably dote on people who don't like them IRL... just like some people can't stand people around them not being as upset about their complaints as they are. I really shouldn't have to repeat myself so much... I have already leveled a fair criticism on this matter.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 24, 2016 16:05:17 GMT
I don't think we will have a "forced" best friend in MEA anymore than we did in DAI. Forced companions maybe for plot reasons, but not forced BFFs.
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Post by midnightwolf on Nov 24, 2016 18:36:22 GMT
I don'the think we will have a "forced" best friend in MEA anymore than we did in DAI. Forced companions maybe for plot reasons, but not forced BFFs. Which is still wrong from a role-play aspect, if the player is constantly forced to interact with a certain charactor.
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Atemporal Vanguardian-Debugger
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At sunrise there is the sunset.
To find the secrets of the universe: Think in terms of energy, frequency & VIBRATION -Nikola Tesla
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
Origin: NO. NEVER. AGAIN.
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To find the secrets of the universe: Think in terms of energy, frequency & VIBRATION -Nikola Tesla
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Post by Atemporal Vanguardian-Debugger on Nov 25, 2016 9:14:29 GMT
In all three games my best friend was the Normandy -WITHOUT NO STUPID AI! And it will be so again...but with new name.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2016 9:27:01 GMT
I don'the think we will have a "forced" best friend in MEA anymore than we did in DAI. Forced companions maybe for plot reasons, but not forced BFFs. Which is still wrong from a role-play aspect, if the player is constantly forced to interact with a certain charactor. I disagree... if a player is not required to interact at all with any of the characters in the story, then what's left is a sandbox game, not an RPG. They do need some "bare bones" interactions on which to construct the story arc/plot. If a player wants to interact with nobody, they should play Minecraft in single player mode and make up their own story in the head as they build up their own story setting, etc.
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Post by Kappa Neko on Nov 25, 2016 12:10:19 GMT
I disagree... if a player is not required to interact at all with any of the characters in the story, then what's left is a sandbox game, not an RPG. They do need some "bare bones" interactions on which to construct the story arc/plot. If a player wants to interact with nobody, they should play Minecraft in single player mode and make up their own story in the head as they build up their own story setting, etc. Thank you. So much THIS. All this crying about lack of player freedom makes me wonder why some people even bother with Bioware games. CLEARLY they are not Bethesda who let people do whatever they want, including completely ignoring the main story. And that's just as well because their narrative is not engaging at all. Bioware games are basically long interactive movies. Player freedom has never been a selling point of their games. I honestly don't understand why some people keep asking for total player freedom. The narrative and banter is what makes Bioware games special. Either you like that or you don't. Plenty other games out there that have more player freedom, but then the narrative suffers. Can't have it all.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2016 15:31:46 GMT
I don'the think we will have a "forced" best friend in MEA anymore than we did in DAI. Forced companions maybe for plot reasons, but not forced BFFs. Which is still wrong from a role-play aspect, if the player is constantly forced to interact with a certain charactor. It can be annoying, especially if you don't like the companion, but as long as they don't take up squaddie space while they fulfill their purpose then I don't really mind.
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Post by Jaal Ama Darav (Kierro) on Nov 25, 2016 15:47:19 GMT
Wait what? When does this happen? In ME3 when you first talk to Thane at the window in the lobby of the Huerta Memorial Hospital. At 0:49 in the above video... They did try to cut the scene a bit from what FemShep does, but you'd still have to be pretty stupid not to recognize it as a kiss on the cheek. Cheek kissing was (still is in places), considered a show of respect. Even among men of high stature.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2016 16:03:35 GMT
In ME3 when you first talk to Thane at the window in the lobby of the Huerta Memorial Hospital. At 0:49 in the above video... They did try to cut the scene a bit from what FemShep does, but you'd still have to be pretty stupid not to recognize it as a kiss on the cheek. Cheek kissing was (still is in places), considered a show of respect. Even among men of high stature. Agree that it can be... it can also be something objectionable... just like a "hug" greeting can be interpreted differently in different cultures and circles. As I said above though... ALL those scenes occur because of Bioware trying to make the same motion by the NPC or player "work" across different scenarios by only "cutting out" the part that actually shows a kiss or an attempted kiss. People here though are using Liara's hug scene to imply that Bioware forces her on the player as a BFF... which is, IMO, making too much out of that scene because it suits their purpose while ignoring (even denying) the other scenes in the game where the same sort of thing occurs.
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Post by themikefest on Nov 25, 2016 16:56:56 GMT
There's a difference between a hug and shaking someone's hand as well as a pat on the shoulder. Bioware saw the difference as well enough to have Shepard shake Ashley/Kaidan's hand on Horizon versus hugging them if romanced, but for some reason left the what-the-crap hug with the alien regardless if romanced or not.
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Post by midnightwolf on Nov 25, 2016 17:07:32 GMT
Which is still wrong from a role-play aspect, if the player is constantly forced to interact with a certain charactor. I disagree... if a player is not required to interact at all with any of the characters in the story, then what's left is a sandbox game, not an RPG. They do need some "bare bones" interactions on which to construct the story arc/plot. If a player wants to interact with nobody, they should play Minecraft in single player mode and make up their own story in the head as they build up their own story setting, etc. Having a charactor be part of the story is one thing, but when you can't continue the story without that charactor then the story becomes pointless, and the player ends up resenting the fact that they are forced to be involved with that charactor all of the time.
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Post by midnightwolf on Nov 25, 2016 17:12:47 GMT
There's a difference between a hug and shaking someone's hand as well as a pat on the shoulder. Bioware saw the difference as well enough to have Shepard shake Ashley/Kaidan's hand on Horizon versus hugging them if romanced, but for some reason left the what-the-crap hug with the alien regardless if romanced or not. And regardless of friendship or not, with Liara's hug. Because even IF you never spoke to her outside of crew meetings, you still get hugged. The writers assumed that just because they've got a hard on for her, that the rest of us *must* like her too.....which I don't.
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Post by Jaal Ama Darav (Kierro) on Nov 25, 2016 17:19:46 GMT
Cheek kissing was (still is in places), considered a show of respect. Even among men of high stature. Agree that it can be... it can also be something objectionable... just like a "hug" greeting can be interpreted differently in different cultures and circles. As I said above though... ALL those scenes occur because of Bioware trying to make the same motion by the NPC or player "work" across different scenarios by only "cutting out" the part that actually shows a kiss or an attempted kiss. People here though are using Liara's hug scene to imply that Bioware forces her on the player as a BFF... which is, IMO, making too much out of that scene because it suits their purpose while ignoring (even denying) the other scenes in the game where the same sort of thing occurs. Apologies, I misunderstood your message.
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aoibhealfae
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The stars, the moon, they have all been blown out
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Post by aoibhealfae on Nov 25, 2016 17:30:08 GMT
Majority of the hugs in ME3 is just a lean over and a tap on the shoulder. I could boot up ME3 to that scene and upload another video using the flycam on every angle if you're not convinced.
Every other characters get a lot of set conditions or an interrupt button just to hug each other but for Liara in ME2? Nah, the game decide that EVERYONE want to rub their chest against her scaly blue boobs... why? because she have a comic where she team up with a Drell to save Shepard's mangled corpse from the Collectors for Cerberus and you should be grateful to her that your entire body is now owned by a terrorist organization. She don't even remember that I want to throw her back into the volcano.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2016 18:49:00 GMT
I disagree... if a player is not required to interact at all with any of the characters in the story, then what's left is a sandbox game, not an RPG. They do need some "bare bones" interactions on which to construct the story arc/plot. If a player wants to interact with nobody, they should play Minecraft in single player mode and make up their own story in the head as they build up their own story setting, etc. Having a charactor be part of the story is one thing, but when you can't continue the story without that charactor then the story becomes pointless, and the player ends up resenting the fact that they are forced to be involved with that charactor all of the time. You can't complete ME3 without the humans James, Joker or Samantha. On one thread here, we have a group complaining that Bioware writing ME:A with companions not integral to the plot as being a bad thing... and then on this thread saying that having some interactions with companions being necessary to the plot being a bad thing. It can't be both... so which it is is just a matter of opinion... and not worth flipping out over.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2016 18:51:55 GMT
There's a difference between a hug and shaking someone's hand as well as a pat on the shoulder. Bioware saw the difference as well enough to have Shepard shake Ashley/Kaidan's hand on Horizon versus hugging them if romanced, but for some reason left the what-the-crap hug with the alien regardless if romanced or not. Look, if you want to burn Shepard's armor over a hug from Liara that's your prerogative. I'm still gonna say you're the one reading too much into these scenes... not me. IRL, I've received spontaneious hugs from total strangers who I've happened to help in the smallest of ways... and while I didn't think their actions totally appropriate and wasn't completely comfortable with their exuberance... I did not lament not punching them out in public. I honestly can't understand getting worked up over a hug from a character that's known to idolize Shepard regardless... but, as I said, it's your prerogative.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2016 18:54:31 GMT
Majority of the hugs in ME3 is just a lean over and a tap on the shoulder. I could boot up ME3 to that scene and upload another video using the flycam on every angle if you're not convinced. Every other characters get a lot of set conditions or an interrupt button just to hug each other but for Liara in ME2? Nah, the game decide that EVERYONE want to rub their chest against her scaly blue boobs... why? because she have a comic where she team up with a Drell to save Shepard's mangled corpse from the Collectors for Cerberus and you should be grateful to her that your entire body is now owned by a terrorist organization. She don't even remember that I want to throw her back into the volcano. Ditto what I just said to themikefest.
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Post by themikefest on Nov 25, 2016 18:58:35 GMT
There's a difference between a hug and shaking someone's hand as well as a pat on the shoulder. Bioware saw the difference as well enough to have Shepard shake Ashley/Kaidan's hand on Horizon versus hugging them if romanced, but for some reason left the what-the-crap hug with the alien regardless if romanced or not. Look, if you want to burn Shepard's armor over a hug from Liara that's your prerogative. I'm still gonna say you're the one reading too much into these scenes... not me. Look, if you want to slobber all over Liara by hugging her, that's your prerogative. I'm still saying there's a difference between hugging someone versus shaking hands or a pat on the arm, for which you don't believe there's no difference... not me.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2016 19:08:00 GMT
Look, if you want to burn Shepard's armor over a hug from Liara that's your prerogative. I'm still gonna say you're the one reading too much into these scenes... not me. Look, if you want to slobber all over Liara by hugging her, that's your prerogative. I'm still saying there's a difference between hugging someone versus shaking hands or a pat on the arm, for which you don't believe there's no difference... not me. ... and Shepard looks like he wants to slobber all over Thane... leaning in like that and pursing the lips... even though the kiss is cut out. It's an error on Bioware's part for both scenes not to have cut out more of the action for non-LI characters... it's just NOT critical proof, IMO, of some sort of alien BFF conspiracy... which is what you want to make of it.
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Post by Duke Cameron on Nov 26, 2016 11:31:02 GMT
Ashley is my Shepard's best friend because she's also his partner in the bedroom. I've always felt to have that kind of romantic relationship you need to be friends too. Same thing in my real life. My wife is also my best friend.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
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Post by helios969 on Nov 26, 2016 12:24:08 GMT
Having a charactor be part of the story is one thing, but when you can't continue the story without that charactor then the story becomes pointless, and the player ends up resenting the fact that they are forced to be involved with that charactor all of the time. You can't complete ME3 without the humans James, Joker or Samantha. On one thread here, we have a group complaining that Bioware writing ME:A with companions not integral to the plot as being a bad thing... and then on this thread saying that having some interactions with companions being necessary to the plot being a bad thing. It can't be both... so which it is is just a matter of opinion... and not worth flipping out over. Yep, and this is precisely how we end up with something lackluster like DAI, because you've got Bio trying to satisfy two competing philosophies that run counter to one another. Typically when you try to satisfy everyone, you end up satisfying no one. I'd wish they'd go one way or the other so I could either move on or stay in the fold. Mediocrity is a place I never expected Bioware to land. Just my opinion of course. Just for the record I enjoy companions (even if I don't like 'em) interwoven into the main story over just being there as filler.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 26, 2016 13:08:28 GMT
You can't complete ME3 without the humans James, Joker or Samantha. On one thread here, we have a group complaining that Bioware writing ME:A with companions not integral to the plot as being a bad thing... and then on this thread saying that having some interactions with companions being necessary to the plot being a bad thing. It can't be both... so which it is is just a matter of opinion... and not worth flipping out over. Yep, and this is precisely how we end up with something lackluster like DAI, because you've got Bio trying to satisfy two competing philosophies that run counter to one another. Typically when you try to satisfy everyone, you end up satisfying no one. I'd wish they'd go one way or the other so I could either move on or stay in the fold. Mediocrity is a place I never expected Bioware to land. Just my opinion of course. Just for the record I enjoy companions (even if I don't like 'em) interwoven into the main story over just being there as filler. I agree... my preference is to have some relationships in the game that can be somewhat "problematic" for the player. It's part of the challenge of the game to try to find ways around the issues with some of the characters. IMO, the ways around an NPCs "annoying" personality quirks shouldn't always be obvious or easy or without "sacrifice." In Liara's case, getting around that hug completely does mean not recruiting Thane and Samara... but it can be done if the player is that driven to avoid it.
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