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Post by stealthfox94 on Jan 31, 2017 16:20:46 GMT
The negativity over Cora 's hair I see almost everywhere is just way much of an overreaction. It's funny how brain works ,if u guys think about it it's all about the hair. If someone hates a haircut or associates a certain haircut with things the don't like,then the person with the haircut becomes aitomatically ugly. I bet if Cora had a blonde ponytail like Sarah, a bun like Ashley which implies she has long hair or the same side part but longer than the shoulders then NO ONE would complain. They'd say she is one of the hottest squadmates ever. And they keep saying it is boyish...When was the last time anyone stepped out the house and actually saw a guy sporting that haircut? I have seen some but they were mostly alternative looking (goth for example or ...a football player? ) but it is certainly not an average boyish haircut. On the other hand , I see plenty of women with similar haircuts everyday almost. It's way more common in women and than in men. Edit:Added comment. Where do you live... lesbian land or something? Clearly Cora isn't a lesbian.......
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Post by Elsariel on Jan 31, 2017 16:50:21 GMT
The negativity over Cora 's hair I see almost everywhere is just way much of an overreaction. It's funny how brain works ,if u guys think about it it's all about the hair. If someone hates a haircut or associates a certain haircut with things the don't like,then the person with the haircut becomes aitomatically ugly. I bet if Cora had a blonde ponytail like Sarah, a bun like Ashley which implies she has long hair or the same side part but longer than the shoulders then NO ONE would complain. They'd say she is one of the hottest squadmates ever. And they keep saying it is boyish...When was the last time anyone stepped out the house and actually saw a guy sporting that haircut? I have seen some but they were mostly alternative looking (goth for example or ...a football player? ) but it is certainly not an average boyish haircut. On the other hand , I see plenty of women with similar haircuts everyday almost. It's way more common in women and than in men. Edit:Added comment. Even though her hair is the thing that gets pointed out, I don't really think that's the reason people think she looks boyish. I think it has to do with her facial features being not traditionally feminine. There's something... off... about her face for me. I have a feeling once her face model is revealed, we'll see how off it is. I bet her face model is gorgeous and it's just not translating well in-game. I do agree that if Cora had a ponytail or bun that might change things. Aveline has masculine facial features but she has that long hair that softens her look and makes her look feminine. Cora, right now, is like Aveline but with nothing to soften her look. It doesn't bother me too much because I'm a straight female, but for men who are attracted to women who look feminine, I can see how that would be a problem. *shrug*
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Post by Panda on Jan 31, 2017 17:05:16 GMT
I actually found Cora's face quite "conventionally pretty" or what was the term people used. I don't see how people see her as masculine at all (though I think her side-profile looks bit wonky in some shots, but everyone's face has looked weird in some shots in trailers). So I'm surprised there is complains beyond her hair, since that was just obvious. Woman with short hair? That's like red flag to some folks.
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Post by stealthfox94 on Jan 31, 2017 17:29:27 GMT
I actually found Cora's face quite "conventionally pretty" or what was the term people used. I don't see how people see her as masculine at all (though I think her side-profile looks bit wonky in some shots, but everyone's face has looked weird in some shots in trailers). So I'm surprised there is complains beyond her hair, since that was just obvious. Woman with short hair? That's like red flag to some folks. Agreed she doesn't look masculine at all, if her hair was longer no one would say she looks boyish.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 31, 2017 17:38:57 GMT
I definitely don't think that Cora has a masculine face. In my opinion, this all stems from her hair. She originally had a ponytail (from some of the beta footage). If she still did, I'm confident that the narrative would be something along the lines of "Finally, Bioware stops pandering to snowflake SJW Tumblrinas and gives us pretty blonde companion...." Or, you know, something like that.
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Post by stealthfox94 on Jan 31, 2017 17:43:24 GMT
I definitely don't think that Cora has a masculine face. In my opinion, this all stems from her hair. She originally had a ponytail (from some of the beta footage). If she still did, I'm confident that the narrative would be something along the lines of "Finally, Bioware stops pandering to snowflake SJW Tumblrinas and gives us pretty blonde companion...." Or, you know, something like that. IDK people seem obsessed with this idea that Bioware panders to SJW's. ME3 had a lot of "good looking" people. I think some people have it in their minds that Bioware is an SJW company and nothing the do will change that.
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Post by Cyonan on Jan 31, 2017 17:47:51 GMT
I actually found Cora's face quite "conventionally pretty" or what was the term people used. I don't see how people see her as masculine at all (though I think her side-profile looks bit wonky in some shots, but everyone's face has looked weird in some shots in trailers). So I'm surprised there is complains beyond her hair, since that was just obvious. Woman with short hair? That's like red flag to some folks. The only thing that I can see other than her hair is that her jawline seems to be a bit more square than you'd find in most previous Mass Effect female squadmates, which a square jawline is typically a more masculine trait. It's pretty much the same argument thrown at Cassandra in DA:I if I remember right. Personally I don't find her too bad, though the hair doesn't do anything for me even as somebody who doesn't mind shorter hair.
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Post by Elsariel on Jan 31, 2017 17:58:06 GMT
I actually found Cora's face quite "conventionally pretty" or what was the term people used. I don't see how people see her as masculine at all (though I think her side-profile looks bit wonky in some shots, but everyone's face has looked weird in some shots in trailers). So I'm surprised there is complains beyond her hair, since that was just obvious. Woman with short hair? That's like red flag to some folks. The only thing that I can see other than her hair is that her jawline seems to be a bit more square than you'd find in most previous Mass Effect female squadmates, which a square jawline is typically a more masculine trait. It's pretty much the same argument thrown at Cassandra in DA:I if I remember right. Personally I don't find her too bad, though the hair doesn't do anything for me even as somebody who doesn't mind shorter hair. Yes. This shot in particular from the Andromeda Initiative video really highlights the jaw thing. Versus the cinematic trailer where she looks much more feminine:
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Post by fialka on Jan 31, 2017 18:03:36 GMT
I definitely don't think that Cora has a masculine face. In my opinion, this all stems from her hair. She originally had a ponytail (from some of the beta footage). If she still did, I'm confident that the narrative would be something along the lines of "Finally, Bioware stops pandering to snowflake SJW Tumblrinas and gives us pretty blonde companion...." Or, you know, something like that. IDK people seem obsessed with this idea that Bioware panders to SJW's. ME3 had a lot of "good looking" people. I think some people have it in their minds that Bioware is an SJW company and nothing the do will change that. At this point 'SJW' has become this blanket term for anything semi-progressive. Add a black character, or a gay one, or a female character with short hair (how edgy! if only those SJW flapper girls hadn't started chopping their hair off in the 1920s we'd be so much better off!), and you're 'pandering.' I'm beginning to think the only way to make a game that doesn't get accused of SJW-ness is to make one about a straight white dude, where all the other major characters are more straight white dudes, and there's a whole bunch of beautiful women with big boobs and long flowing hair who want to sleep with the protagonist. I'll pass on that one, thanks!
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Post by fialka on Jan 31, 2017 18:13:32 GMT
The only thing that I can see other than her hair is that her jawline seems to be a bit more square than you'd find in most previous Mass Effect female squadmates, which a square jawline is typically a more masculine trait. It's pretty much the same argument thrown at Cassandra in DA:I if I remember right. Personally I don't find her too bad, though the hair doesn't do anything for me even as somebody who doesn't mind shorter hair. Yes. This shot in particular from the Andromeda Initiative video really highlights the jaw thing. Versus the cinematic trailer where she looks much more feminine: Yeah, I can see that. Of course that first image is the one they're focusing on, like all the 'PeeBee is ugly' people who keep posting that one old unflattering image of her as 'proof.' Everyone's going to look a little weird at certain angles, in certain light. Take stills from any movie, and the most beautiful actor or actress is going to look funny somewhere. That's doubly so in games since these are animated meshes, not actual skin and bone, yet we're comparing their overall attractiveness to that of actual human beings. I actually have a rather strong jawline for a woman too, and there's some photos of me where I'm like 'oh god, I look really awful there!' but, going by how often I get hit on, I'm considered reasonably attractive to men in real life. The length of my hair never seemed to factor into that. Plenty of female models and actresses have more square face shapes too (and short hair!), and they're considered beautiful. I think men just tend to judge women in video games by a different standard for some reason. And those standards get harsher as game characters become more lifelike, versus the simpler, more cartoon-like designs of past games.
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Post by stealthfox94 on Jan 31, 2017 18:14:05 GMT
IDK people seem obsessed with this idea that Bioware panders to SJW's. ME3 had a lot of "good looking" people. I think some people have it in their minds that Bioware is an SJW company and nothing the do will change that. At this point 'SJW' has become this blanket term for anything semi-progressive. Add a black character, or a gay one, or a female character with short hair (how edgy! if only those SJW flapper girls hadn't started chopping their hair off in the 1920s we'd be so much better off!), and you're 'pandering.' I'm beginning to think the only way to make a game that doesn't get accused of SJW-ness is to make one about a straight white dude, where all the other major characters are more straight white dudes, and there's a whole bunch of beautiful women with big boobs and long flowing hair who want to sleep with the protagonist. I'll pass on that one, thanks! I agree I think people who cry about everything being SJW pandering are becoming more annoying than actual SJW's, problem is if someone made a game like the one you describe then actual SJW's would complain about it. Can't win...... Of course I would rather play any Bioware game than one like the one you described, because well it's different.
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Post by Cyonan on Jan 31, 2017 18:15:13 GMT
IDK people seem obsessed with this idea that Bioware panders to SJW's. ME3 had a lot of "good looking" people. I think some people have it in their minds that Bioware is an SJW company and nothing the do will change that. At this point 'SJW' has become this blanket term for anything semi-progressive. Add a black character, or a gay one, or a female character with short hair (how edgy! if only those SJW flapper girls hadn't started chopping their hair off in the 1920s we'd be so much better off!), and you're 'pandering.' I'm beginning to think the only way to make a game that doesn't get accused of SJW-ness is to make one about a straight white dude, where all the other major characters are more straight white dudes, and there's a whole bunch of beautiful women with big boobs and long flowing hair who want to sleep with the protagonist. I'll pass on that one, thanks! I'm pretty sure that's just a Duke Nukem game, though admittedly that's a series that used to be aware of how ridiculous it was and was poking fun at the whole "80s action hero" trope. I think the short hair gets a bad reputation these days because so much of your stereotypical Tumblr posting SJW has that hairstyle now. I also think that BioWare has is worse because the fanbase has put romances at the forefront of their games, whether they like it or not. That means the extreme "anti-SJW" crowd views anything as "shoving it down our throats"(insert Archer phrasing meme here). Of course they also attacked Blizzard for having a female character get kissed by her girlfriend in a single panel of a comic that wasn't even in the game, so I don't know.
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Post by rapscallioness on Jan 31, 2017 18:22:04 GMT
OP, tbh, I think BW devs - in general - feel a bit uncomfortable about discussing romances. Like they think it makes them a meowmeow, or something. Seriously, I noticed this with the DA devs, too, when pushed to talk about romance. They stammer about; they get embarrassed. ME devs do this, too, and have tried to downplay it.
Fwiw, I think this whole "banging" dialogue is actually a defense mechanism because the idea of romance makes them feel squishy. It's okay to talk about "banging" because that's seen as "manly", but feelings and romance? No, because real men don't need no stinking romance/feelings..rawr!, and all that.
I mean, it's BS, but that's the messaging they've received, and dare I say been indoctrinated into in many societies.
Talking about banging is machismo. Talking about feelings makes you weak. Maybe it's marketing as well, but I think at the root is this goofy idea that manly man does not talk about things like that.
The romances themselves, however, usually turn out better and sweeter than the schtick before hand. So I would not worry too much.
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Post by Catilina on Jan 31, 2017 18:27:17 GMT
(The hair need replace with blonde!)
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Post by Cyonan on Jan 31, 2017 19:01:52 GMT
OP, tbh, I think BW devs - in general - feel a bit uncomfortable about discussing romances. Like they think it makes them a meowmeow, or something. Seriously, I noticed this with the DA devs, too, when pushed to talk about romance. They stammer about; they get embarrassed. ME devs do this, too, and have tried to downplay it. Fwiw, I think this whole "banging" dialogue is actually a defense mechanism because the idea of romance makes them feel squishy. It's okay to talk about "banging" because that's seen as "manly", but feelings and romance? No, because real men don't need no stinking romance/feelings..rawr!, and all that. I mean, it's BS, but that's the messaging they've received, and dare I say been indoctrinated into in many societies. Talking about banging is machismo. Talking about feelings makes you weak. Maybe it's marketing as well, but I think at the root is this goofy idea that manly man does not talk about things like that. The romances themselves, however, usually turn out better and sweeter than the schtick before hand. So I would not worry too much. I find it a bit amusing myself. BioWare's marketing material has them wanting to show off exploration and character writing in the game while a pretty sizable portion of the fanbase goes "But who can I bang?". It's essentially become a thing that BioWare games "double as a dating sim" despite the actual romance content in any of their games being an extremely small percentage of the game's total content, just because of the way much of the fanbase acts towards it. Of course even as one of these self proclaimed real men that has no feelings when you meet a woman as fine as Kasumi, sometimes you just need to do a little romancing =P That is unless BioWare decides your virtual love was not to be.
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Post by KingDarious BBB on Jan 31, 2017 19:06:34 GMT
The only thing that I can see other than her hair is that her jawline seems to be a bit more square than you'd find in most previous Mass Effect female squadmates, which a square jawline is typically a more masculine trait. It's pretty much the same argument thrown at Cassandra in DA:I if I remember right. Personally I don't find her too bad, though the hair doesn't do anything for me even as somebody who doesn't mind shorter hair. Yes. This shot in particular from the Andromeda Initiative video really highlights the jaw thing. Versus the cinematic trailer where she looks much more feminine: I think she looks better in the initiative video.
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Post by rapscallioness on Jan 31, 2017 19:12:44 GMT
I find it a bit amusing myself. BioWare's marketing material has them wanting to show off exploration and character writing in the game while a pretty sizable portion of the fanbase goes "But who can I bang?". It's essentially become a thing that BioWare games "double as a dating sim" despite the actual romance content in any of their games being an extremely small percentage of the game's total content, just because of the way much of the fanbase acts towards it. Of course even as one of these self proclaimed real men that has no feelings when you meet a woman as fine as Kasumi, sometimes you just need to do a little romancing =P That is unless BioWare decides your virtual love was not to be. Yeah, the actual content of romances is so small vs the rest of the game, the dating sim is just..goofy. And another portion loves the romance addition to their adventure because we're hardwired as humans to pay attn to that. We love love and companionship. And you absolutely learn to romance someone as fine as Kasumi, but you know you're gonna get razzed by your friends for swooning. Guys absolutely do have these romantic feelings. They're human beings. It's just that the expression of those feelings is generally not well accepted; to be all...what do they call it?......meowmeow whipped? Tch.
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Post by Elsariel on Jan 31, 2017 19:16:41 GMT
Yes. This shot in particular from the Andromeda Initiative video really highlights the jaw thing. Versus the cinematic trailer where she looks much more feminine: Yeah, I can see that. Of course that first image is the one they're focusing on, like all the 'PeeBee is ugly' people who keep posting that one old unflattering image of her as 'proof.' Everyone's going to look a little weird at certain angles, in certain light. Take stills from any movie, and the most beautiful actor or actress is going to look funny somewhere. That's doubly so in games since these are animated meshes, not actual skin and bone, yet we're comparing their overall attractiveness to that of actual human beings. I actually have a rather strong jawline for a woman too, and there's some photos of me where I'm like 'oh god, I look really awful there!' but, going by how often I get hit on, I'm considered reasonably attractive to men in real life. The length of my hair never seemed to factor into that. Plenty of female models and actresses have more square face shapes too (and short hair!), and they're considered beautiful. I think men just tend to judge women in video games by a different standard for some reason. And those standards get harsher as game characters become more lifelike, versus the simpler, more cartoon-like designs of past games.Yeah, it's a little bit like the Uncanny Valley situation where the more lifelike we try to be, the harder it gets to try to make it look realistic. It takes really good design skills to lift artificial humans (whether it's animated or robotic) out of the uncanny valley and into actual realism. To me, Cora seems to still be a little bit in the valley. At least, in the AI video she is. It's not even just one still. It's the entire video she looks off. In the cinematic trailer, though, she looks beautiful. I wonder if the AI video was taken at an earlier time and they've since changed her in-game model to look more like the cinematic trailer style. The trailer says everything is captured in-game so we're not looking at CG there. I know they've been working on other character models too so maybe this is the case with Cora.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 31, 2017 19:17:33 GMT
Oh, if only they would put a few character models to chose from for each companion, like they did in SWTOR. Everyone can have their favorite hair color and length. If it was okay in a MMO, it is even more okay in an SP title, because really, who cares what your companions look like in the safety of your own hard drive? The first mod, mark my words, will be Ashley's hair, followed by Miranda's hair for Cora (or vice versa). Like here, they have tons of Mako's appearances, same character, but all sorts of different takes on her face and coloring. So simple, so ingenious, why not?
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Post by midnightwolf on Jan 31, 2017 20:10:19 GMT
I do have some concern over romancing, (more questions than concern) But my one main concern is that Bioware is taking too much of a frat boy, dude bro approach to romancing. That one dev saying "the banging is pretty good" making that the main focus of romancing just seems immature. The Salarian pilot also seemed to make a pretty big deal about using the captains quarters for sex. I just hope they understand that their main audience isn't 18 year old jocks. I also wonder just how many romance options their will be, I think I heard one dev say their will be romance options outside of your own crew (not sure about that). I just hope the writing is good and they don't take an immature approach to romancing. I don't think there's any need to worry as they've said there's romances of different types. Some characters may just jump on you like say Jack and then there'll be more in depth ones like Liara/Garrus and Tali it just depends on what your Ryders will be looking for in your playthroughs some will be part of your team others will be separate. Kallo's just letting us know that he knows what's going on in there. Jack didn't *just* jump on Shepard. She was testing him to see if he was only interested in Sex. Which given her history in that Prison and with Cerberus, is perfectly understandable. To the OP. I expect to see nothing but arse shot's of female squad mates backsides, and the Asari's breasts to get larger with each installement, thus ensuring wet dreams for Male gamers.....since that's what happened in the trilogy!
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Post by sjsharp2010 on Jan 31, 2017 20:13:38 GMT
I don't think there's any need to worry as they've said there's romances of different types. Some characters may just jump on you like say Jack and then there'll be more in depth ones like Liara/Garrus and Tali it just depends on what your Ryders will be looking for in your playthroughs some will be part of your team others will be separate. Kallo's just letting us know that he knows what's going on in there. Jack didn't *just* jump on Shepard. She was testing him to see if he was only interested in Sex. Which given her history in that Prison and with Cerberus, is perfectly understandable. To the OP. I expect to see nothing but arse shot's of female squad mates backsides, and the Asari's breasts to get large with each installement, thus ensuring wet dreams for Male gamers.....since that's what happened in the trilogy! I know the point I was rtying to make was there'll be romances of all different types because al lthe romances in these games are different.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 31, 2017 20:26:13 GMT
Oh, if only they would put a few character models to chose from for each companion, like they did in SWTOR. Everyone can have their favorite hair color and length. If it was okay in a MMO, it is even more okay in an SP title, because really, who cares what your companions look like in the safety of your own hard drive? The first mod, mark my words, will be Ashley's hair, followed by Miranda's hair for Cora (or vice versa). Like here, they have tons of Mako's appearances, same character, but all sorts of different takes on her face and coloring. So simple, so ingenious, why not? I'm not a big fan of this idea. I can see what you are saying by stating that it's no-harm, no-foul in a SP title. But I like having the characters have a set appearance. If someone isn't to my liking, I just deal with it. I didn't find either Anders or Fenris to be my "type" in DA2, but it's just a game and it wasn't the end of the world. I liked in SWTOR because it stopped there from being hundreds of the same image on screen at a time.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 31, 2017 20:35:43 GMT
Oh, if only they would put a few character models to chose from for each companion, like they did in SWTOR. Everyone can have their favorite hair color and length. If it was okay in a MMO, it is even more okay in an SP title, because really, who cares what your companions look like in the safety of your own hard drive? The first mod, mark my words, will be Ashley's hair, followed by Miranda's hair for Cora (or vice versa). Like here, they have tons of Mako's appearances, same character, but all sorts of different takes on her face and coloring. So simple, so ingenious, why not? I'm not a big fan of this idea. I can see what you are saying by stating that it's no-harm, no-foul in a SP title. But I like having the characters have a set appearance. If someone isn't to my liking, I just deal with it. I didn't find either Anders or Fenris to be my "type" in DA2, but it's just a game and it wasn't the end of the world. I liked in SWTOR because it stopped there from being hundreds of the same image on screen at a time. I loved it in SWTOR, and used a different customization for different playthrough of each class for each joinable. Some I kept as defaults. It was perfect. No, i don't understand the logic of "Cora doesn't have a braid, this game sucks" but if it makes for a better gaming experience and even some extra replayability at a fairily small investment, such as recolours and hairstyles on the same character model, more people can enjoy their game, with originals or customizations. I am not sharing the game with anyone, so if my Liam is oriental, or some guys' Cora in australia has a pony tail, we'll never know. One appearance is canon, just like Sara and Scott, the rest is user's choice. All happy, and we'll be rid of the Great Haircut Cataclism. Peeps gonna grab mods anyway, and if it comes from Bio, at least it won't ruin MP. We did it back in Baldur's Gate in 1997, replacing the portraits however we've liked, why not in 2017.... Plus, char customizations make cool rewards for doing stuff in the game.
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Mihura
N4
“Major Wulf Khan and the 903rd Catachan ‘Night Shrikes’…”
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: MihuraL
Posts: 1,303 Likes: 2,754
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Jun 10, 2024 22:52:29 GMT
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Mihura
“Major Wulf Khan and the 903rd Catachan ‘Night Shrikes’…”
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November 2016
mihura
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
MihuraL
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Post by Mihura on Jan 31, 2017 20:51:15 GMT
Where do you live... lesbian land or something? Clearly Cora isn't a lesbian....... It is sarcasm, I really do not get the hair discourse but than again I did something similar to my hair sometime ago, it could be that.
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✜ The Bunny Chaser
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Energizer Bunny 211
The world just opened up...l'm now hearing sounds that I haven't heard in quite some time!
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Jan 15, 2017 18:43:23 GMT
January 2017
energizerbunny211
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem
Rumbler1138
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Post by Energizer Bunny 211 on Jan 31, 2017 22:07:00 GMT
one thing is sure about options : a man and an ugly boyish woman for Scott Who's this "boyish woman" you're talking about? I know you can't mean Cora Harper, cuz she's 100% hottie! RE: 100% Hottie....I'm in (more than) 100% agreement with you there! I would like to explore the game and find out more about who all the romance options are for each of the Ryders-- but one thing is for certain: the first time I play as "Scott" Cora will be my "one and only"....and who knows? Maybe she'll be the only NPC I ever romance whenever I play Scott...because you said it she's so damn hot! (pardon the rhyming).
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