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Post by Element Zero on Feb 23, 2017 4:27:07 GMT
Heresy! I can see how someone with no attachment to the characters could have a hard time getting or staying invested in the game. I loved it, but I already loved Geralt and the crew before playing it. It was the final chapter, for me. Not all games are for all people. I admire the Grand Theft Auto games as quality gaming achievements; but I think they're idiotic. I have no desire to play them. I often feel as if I'm the only person who doesn't play the series. Quality doesn't guarantee appeal for all. I wouldn't say that Witcher exactly hits that "quality" mark in a lot of departments. Story and characters are actually two of its strong points, and I quite enjoyed them, despite the fact that I had no previous attachment to either of those things, since I only played Witcher III. That being said, the gameplay is a complete mess. It's basically an overly complicated version of Fable II's combat system. At least it plays relatively the same way. There are also a lot of nuances to Witcher, specifically, but from what I've played they just seem shallow and unnecessary. The only spell you'll ever need is Quen, and that's only if you're terrible at dodging, which I am not. I've been playing on the second hardest difficulty, and am about 35-40 hours in, and I have yet to brew a single tonic or potion, nor have I had any real reason to do so. I've been following every question mark on the minimap, and I almost never find gear better than what I'm already wearing. The world is much too big, and I've discussed this in the MEA Skepticism thread. All-in-all, Witcher III is a game with a lot of work put into it, and a lot of that work seems completely wasted. It's pretty, and it's massive, but it doesn't need to be the latter, and the former means nothing to me when the major mechanics of the game are either useless clutter or too shallow to feel rewarding or interesting. I've heard Witcher has always had an issue with its combat system, and I'm absolutely horrified of seeing what it was before, considering how terrible it is now. That's just me, though. I don't disagree with this assessment of the gameplay mechanics/balance. I still really enjoyed the game, but this is pretty accurate. You'd eventually need to brew some potions, but not like either the lore or gameplay mechanics would suggest. You can play as an alchemist and do quite well, but it's nearly entirely unnecessary. Same for most Signs. I loved the setting, the ambience, the characters and those varied quests. They were more than enough to offset any weaknesses, for me. The weaknesses are definitely present and easy to identify, though.
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I was called Ryder before it was cool... ...I'd love to, you know, be social and things.
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Post by BansheeOwnage on Feb 23, 2017 4:33:28 GMT
I would like to see it added, but I don't think it's a big enough issue to lose sleep over. It's the principle that gets me more than the specific instance itself. I find regression and the removal of good, optional features irksome no matter what, but it's even worse when a company does it in the game right after the one where they had to add it post-launch due to outcry for said feature. It just seems like an incredibly stupid thing to do that can only bite them later, to be honest. I mean, if enough people wanting it to warrant a free DLC (which costs Bioware) wasn't enough proof that it would be a good thing to be standard in your games, I don't know what would be. Oh god, no, why? They better have a super short intro then, because I am known for rerolling dozens of times to get the perfect face. The mirror in DA:I was a godsend; I spent hours running back and forth between that mirror and cutscenes to check if I'd finally fixed the face! Here's another probable problem: I'd bet, due to the silence on the topic, that there will not be any sort of facecode system. If this is true, you can't "save" your progress on a face by typing/writing that down and restarting from where you were if you decide to restart the game to tweak something, you have to restart the entire face. That's not only tedious, but can be very hard for those less adept at using the CC. Hopefully they have some way to save faces, but I'm trying to keep my expectations low. I... I don't disagree, but like.... This is the most overly dramatic reaction to the most mundane thing. I mean, you apparently had faith in the company as a whole "shattered" due to this? Really? Far be it from me to tell you what to care about, but it doesn't sound like you had much faith to begin with, if that's the case. Which is fine, don't get me wrong, but my God. That's just the thing; BansheeOwnage 's faith is a bit strained, at this point; and it wasn't just the one feature that did it. Her posts always have this epic presentation, positive or disappointed. Don't let the carefully chosen pics and artful fonts fool you; this isn't an all out rant. It just looks that way to the uninitiated. I added Blue Font for highlighting purposes. EDIT: To be clear, my own disappointment is more mild, as I've previously posted. This is exactly what I expected. Hey, thanks Element Zero. "Epic presentation"? I'm okay with this To add and echo, I anticipated that the latter half of my post might get met with this sort of reaction, and I know it looks a bit more dramatic than I actually meant. As I said above, it's the fact that Bioware isn't listening to some of the most vocal and agreed-upon feedback from their last game that I find the most disappointing, not that they won't have a "Black Emporium" (though that is frustrating on its own). My "How can I possibly believe Bioware when they say they listened to feedback about DA:I?" wasn't meant as a "Literally unplayable, pre-order cancelled!" type of thing, but just an honest question going through my mind. And having my faith "shattered" may have been unintentionally overdramatic, so I'll rephrase for clarity: I try not to have high expectations, but my expectations are based mostly on previous Bioware games. I'd consider "normal" expectations to be that Bioware includes and hopefully improves upon basic features that were present in previous games in their new games, and "low" expectations to be less than that. Because I don't think it's hoping for too much to assume that they'll keep a good feature, especially when they know how much fans enjoyed that feature. So what I was saying was that even when I have "normal" expectations, those are apparently still aiming too high. I will have to try to take absolutely nothing for granted, now And finally, as Element Zero pointed out, this one thing alone isn't responsible for my strained faith. There has been a string of similar things which has contributed to it. Hopefully that and what EZ (ha, "EZ" ) said above might explain why my reaction may have seemed disproportionate to you. If not, the first half of that post was the most important part anyway
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Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2017 4:34:29 GMT
I wouldn't say that Witcher exactly hits that "quality" mark in a lot of departments. Story and characters are actually two of its strong points, and I quite enjoyed them, despite the fact that I had no previous attachment to either of those things, since I only played Witcher III. That being said, the gameplay is a complete mess. It's basically an overly complicated version of Fable II's combat system. At least it plays relatively the same way. There are also a lot of nuances to Witcher, specifically, but from what I've played they just seem shallow and unnecessary. The only spell you'll ever need is Quen, and that's only if you're terrible at dodging, which I am not. I've been playing on the second hardest difficulty, and am about 35-40 hours in, and I have yet to brew a single tonic or potion, nor have I had any real reason to do so. I've been following every question mark on the minimap, and I almost never find gear better than what I'm already wearing. The world is much too big, and I've discussed this in the MEA Skepticism thread. All-in-all, Witcher III is a game with a lot of work put into it, and a lot of that work seems completely wasted. It's pretty, and it's massive, but it doesn't need to be the latter, and the former means nothing to me when the major mechanics of the game are either useless clutter or too shallow to feel rewarding or interesting. I've heard Witcher has always had an issue with its combat system, and I'm absolutely horrified of seeing what it was before, considering how terrible it is now. That's just me, though. I don't disagree with this assessment of the gameplay mechanics/balance. I still really enjoyed the game, but this is pretty accurate. You'd eventually need to brew some potions, but not like either the lore or gameplay mechanics would suggest. You can play as an alchemist and do quite well, but it's nearly entirely unnecessary. Same for most Signs. I loved the setting, the ambience, the characters and those varied quests. They were more than enough to offset any weaknesses, for me. The weaknesses are definitely present and easy to identify, though. That's really what most games come down to, tbh. Whether or not the weaknesses work for you. I don't really hate Witcher, but I find myself unable to really get into it because of those problems. Other games that I do enjoy probably have more problems, objectively speaking, but there's something here and there that hooks me, personally. Inquisition might even be a good example, considering how I really don't think I like the "game" part of the game all that much. But being able to have a diverse selection of personalities to choose from, as well as having an attractive character customization, feels really fulfilling for me. I don't by any stretch of the imagination love Inquisition (I wouldn't even count it among my favorites) but I do prefer it to Witcher for those reasons and others.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2017 4:38:41 GMT
I would like to see it added, but I don't think it's a big enough issue to lose sleep over. It's the principle that gets me more than the specific instance itself. I find regression and the removal of good, optional features irksome no matter what, but it's even worse when a company does it in the game right after the one where they had to add it post-launch due to outcry for said feature. It just seems like an incredibly stupid thing to do that can only bite them later, to be honest. I mean, if enough people wanting it to warrant a free DLC (which costs Bioware) wasn't enough proof that it would be a good thing to be standard in your games, I don't know what would be. Oh god, no, why? They better have a super short intro then, because I am known for rerolling dozens of times to get the perfect face. The mirror in DA:I was a godsend; I spent hours running back and forth between that mirror and cutscenes to check if I'd finally fixed the face! Here's another probable problem: I'd bet, due to the silence on the topic, that there will not be any sort of facecode system. If this is true, you can't "save" your progress on a face by typing/writing that down and restarting from where you were if you decide to restart the game to tweak something, you have to restart the entire face. That's not only tedious, but can be very hard for those less adept at using the CC. Hopefully they have some way to save faces, but I'm trying to keep my expectations low. That's just the thing; BansheeOwnage 's faith is a bit strained, at this point; and it wasn't just the one feature that did it. Her posts always have this epic presentation, positive or disappointed. Don't let the carefully chosen pics and artful fonts fool you; this isn't an all out rant. It just looks that way to the uninitiated. I added Blue Font for highlighting purposes. EDIT: To be clear, my own disappointment is more mild, as I've previously posted. This is exactly what I expected. Hey, thanks @element Zero. "Epic presentation"? I'm okay with this To add and echo, I anticipated that the latter half of my post might get met with this sort of reaction, and I know it looks a bit more dramatic than I actually meant. As I said above, it's the fact that Bioware isn't listening to some of the most vocal and agreed-upon feedback from their last game that I find the most disappointing, not that they won't have a "Black Emporium" (though that is frustrating on its own). My "How can I possibly believe Bioware when they say they listened to feedback about DA:I?" wasn't meant as a "Literally unplayable, pre-order cancelled!" type of thing, but just an honest question going through my mind. And having my faith "shattered" may have been unintentionally overdramatic, so I'll rephrase for clarity: I try not to have high expectations, but my expectations are based mostly on previous Bioware games. I'd consider "normal" expectations to be that Bioware includes and hopefully improves upon basic features that were present in previous games in their new games, and "low" expectations to be less than that. Because I don't think it's hoping for too much to assume that they'll keep a good feature, especially when they know how much fans enjoyed that feature. So what I was saying was that even when I have "normal" expectations, those are apparently still aiming too high. I will have to try to take absolutely nothing for granted, now And finally, as Element Zero pointed out, this one thing alone isn't responsible for my strained faith. There has been a string of similar things which has contributed to it. Hopefully that and what EZ (ha, "EZ" ) said above might explain why my reaction may have seemed disproportionate to you. If not, the first half of that post was the most important part anyway That's fair. I was mostly overplaying my reaction to your post myself, for a laugh. Though, granted, it wasn't very funny. Mostly just gave myself a dry chuckle. Don't judge me. Although I suppose we can at least take solace in the fact that those improvements you mentioned were all made in Dragon Age. I know DA and ME are pretty closely connected, but ME has never had any of those features, so maybe they just weren't taking top priority, like they did in Dragon Age, where people were extremely vocal about it. Like I said though, I don't disagree with you. It is strange that they've ignored the feedback at all, even if it was for a different IP. Maybe they thought it was a DA specific problem. Who knows.
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Post by projectpatdc on Feb 23, 2017 5:13:41 GMT
Please for the love of all that is holy and great do not let that deter you from playing Red Dead Redemption 2. Red Dead had some quirky parts but my god is it great. Yeah, totally different setting. I intend to give it a look. If you have free time between now and March 21st. Try out Playstation Now's 7 day free trial on the PS4 and go play Red Dead Redemption for free to see if you like it.
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Post by projectpatdc on Feb 23, 2017 5:59:35 GMT
Please for the love of all that is holy and great do not let that deter you from playing Red Dead Redemption 2. Red Dead had some quirky parts but my god is it great. Yeah, totally different setting. I intend to give it a look. No, don't just like my post. DO IT!
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Ivory Samoan
N3
Raising Hell with the Flavor XX
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate
Origin: IvorySamoan
Posts: 565 Likes: 933
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Jun 15, 2021 12:22:31 GMT
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Ivory Samoan
Raising Hell with the Flavor XX
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August 2016
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate
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Post by Ivory Samoan on Feb 23, 2017 9:55:40 GMT
Heresy! I can see how someone with no attachment to the characters could have a hard time getting or staying invested in the game. I loved it, but I already loved Geralt and the crew before playing it. It was the final chapter, for me. Not all games are for all people. I admire the Grand Theft Auto games as quality gaming achievements; but I think they're idiotic. I have no desire to play them. I often feel as if I'm the only person who doesn't play the series. Quality doesn't guarantee appeal for all. I wouldn't say that Witcher exactly hits that "quality" mark in a lot of departments. Story and characters are actually two of its strong points, and I quite enjoyed them, despite the fact that I had no previous attachment to either of those things, since I only played Witcher III. That being said, the gameplay is a complete mess. It's basically an overly complicated version of Fable II's combat system. At least it plays relatively the same way. There are also a lot of nuances to Witcher, specifically, but from what I've played they just seem shallow and unnecessary. The only spell you'll ever need is Quen, and that's only if you're terrible at dodging, which I am not. I've been playing on the second hardest difficulty, and am about 35-40 hours in, and I have yet to brew a single tonic or potion, nor have I had any real reason to do so. I've been following every question mark on the minimap, and I almost never find gear better than what I'm already wearing. The world is much too big, and I've discussed this in the MEA Skepticism thread. All-in-all, Witcher III is a game with a lot of work put into it, and a lot of that work seems completely wasted. It's pretty, and it's massive, but it doesn't need to be the latter, and the former means nothing to me when the major mechanics of the game are either useless clutter or too shallow to feel rewarding or interesting. I've heard Witcher has always had an issue with its combat system, and I'm absolutely horrified of seeing what it was before, considering how terrible it is now. That's just me, though. See, there's where you went wrong, Death March is the only difficulty worthy of your attention if you are skilled at action games. Personally, I love the fluidity of TW3 combat, once you get the 'dance' of bombs, parries and signs: it's amazing fun - playing on a difficulty that's too low will rob you of the need for such tools, and therein is where the 'fun combat' lies IMO. On that note, I completely disagree with pretty much everything you said about the game...but hey, we all have different perceptions of quality and a good game Yeah, totally different setting. I intend to give it a look. No, don't just like my post. DO IT! This is a good bit of advice, RDR is one of the most profound gaming experiences in, ever, and has the best ending in any video game, ever. Makes me weep with joy thinking about my adventures in the lawless west, bring on RDR2!!!!
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Element Zero
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elementzero
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Element Zero on Feb 23, 2017 13:57:53 GMT
Yeah, totally different setting. I intend to give it a look. No, don't just like my post. DO IT! Haha! That's awesome! It is a good idea. I wasn't even aware of the 7-day trial, or I'd have already wasted it, most likely.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2017 22:47:42 GMT
I wouldn't say that Witcher exactly hits that "quality" mark in a lot of departments. Story and characters are actually two of its strong points, and I quite enjoyed them, despite the fact that I had no previous attachment to either of those things, since I only played Witcher III. That being said, the gameplay is a complete mess. It's basically an overly complicated version of Fable II's combat system. At least it plays relatively the same way. There are also a lot of nuances to Witcher, specifically, but from what I've played they just seem shallow and unnecessary. The only spell you'll ever need is Quen, and that's only if you're terrible at dodging, which I am not. I've been playing on the second hardest difficulty, and am about 35-40 hours in, and I have yet to brew a single tonic or potion, nor have I had any real reason to do so. I've been following every question mark on the minimap, and I almost never find gear better than what I'm already wearing. The world is much too big, and I've discussed this in the MEA Skepticism thread. All-in-all, Witcher III is a game with a lot of work put into it, and a lot of that work seems completely wasted. It's pretty, and it's massive, but it doesn't need to be the latter, and the former means nothing to me when the major mechanics of the game are either useless clutter or too shallow to feel rewarding or interesting. I've heard Witcher has always had an issue with its combat system, and I'm absolutely horrified of seeing what it was before, considering how terrible it is now. That's just me, though. See, there's where you went wrong, Death March is the only difficulty worthy of your attention if you are skilled at action games. Personally, I love the fluidity of TW3 combat, once you get the 'dance' of bombs, parries and signs: it's amazing fun - playing on a difficulty that's too low will rob you of the need for such tools, and therein is where the 'fun combat' lies IMO. On that note, I completely disagree with pretty much everything you said about the game...but hey, we all have different perceptions of quality and a good game. Then the game is at fault for including a myriad of arbitrary difficulty options that do nothing to enhance the experience. Dark Souls doesn't have difficulty settings. It's not impossible to make a profitable game that is also hard. Not only that, but the tonics and potions are not a particularly engaging mechanic even if they are required. If you breakdown what you do to create a tonic, you; wander around until you find specific ingredients, open a menu, select the proper tonic, and press X, or A, or whatever it is you press to confirm an input. If you find the open world engaging, that's fine. But the other two steps to this process are literally done through static menus. And then to use the tonic, you just press the corresponding button and get some damage buffs. Hooray? I arbitrarily raised my numbers for a limited time. Really engaging gameplay. "Fluidity". I completely disagree with this statement. It's choppy and shallow. You can clear most any fight in the game with light attacks and dodge. Heavy attacks do nothing but leave you completely open to a counterattack, and rolling is just a dodge with a longer animation. I'd almost wager there was next-to-no thought put into the combat system at all. Just a bunch of "cool" ideas the devs had. And I'm not even alone in this sentiment. People who legitimately love the series have always said that the combat system is garbage. That's entirely fine, but if you try to talk to me about why you think it's good, I'm going to explain why I don't agree with your reason.
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