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Post by jf8350143 on Apr 9, 2017 6:17:26 GMT
I really don't understand how anyone can look at the original ending of ME 3 and think "hey, it's good writing" when there was barely any writing in there. The star kid didn't even dump a shitload of information at you, he just says a few sentence before throw you into the "choose the color you like" situation.
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Post by Doctor Fumbles on Apr 9, 2017 6:19:21 GMT
I really don't understand how anyone can look at the original ending of ME 3 and think "hey, it's good writing" when there was barely any writing in there. The star kid didn't even dump a shitload of information at you, he just says a few sentence before throw you into the "choose the color you like" situation. That's why you shoot him in the end with the pistol.
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Post by colfoley on Apr 9, 2017 6:42:50 GMT
I guess the lesson from this thread is you can go from being a hero to a villain...and then the people will beg you to return. And as long as you are talking about pointless wish fulfilment give us Weekes back Right, and all of his faith bullshit. Right. Right next to his magic bullshit. Sure. That's just why he described his assignment to writing Mordin as a "problettunity". EDIT : Look, I know what Weekes' problem is. He's trying to rewrite Death Wing Chronicles only where Alfred wins. Except you can't. I mean, heh. Good god, man give it up. Nietzche said it 150 (ish) years ago. God is dead. Give it up man. EDIT x 2 : And by this, he's pandering to the lowest class of American society. The class that still goes to church and still believes that his pansexual lifestyle is an abomination. I dunno what his end goal here is, I suppose to make the right wing like him? I dunno. The right wing to accept him? well as a proud right winger myself...he succeeded?
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Post by dark8sage on Apr 9, 2017 6:44:29 GMT
No, thanks. Casey Hudson can stay retired with those atrocious ME3 endings on his own.
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Post by lyq3r on Apr 9, 2017 7:07:24 GMT
Here's an article that was originally made by Patrick Weeks on this subject (story with a beard) Read, if You dareCasey is in Microsoft, if I remember correctly atm. It's rather impossible he'd ever come back to BW. In his skin, I'd never work in a place I had been thrown away from in the first place.
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Post by therevanchist25 on Apr 9, 2017 7:51:08 GMT
Look, I get it, you think the game is a shit smear in the toilet infested with fly larva. You won't stop ranting about how terrible it is in every thread you can, using every hyperbolic phrase you can think of to describe it's awfulness . But Casey Hudson? don't make me laugh, I never want to see him associated with this franchise ever again. The fact you think blatantly lying to people about your product is acceptable frankly disgusts me. Also, real classy taking a shot at Weekes, who was objectively one of this franchises better writers, simply because you think he is a moron because he has different opinions about things than you.You frankly seem like a sad, pathetic hateful individual who demands everything be bent to your individual views and tastes, I'm sorry but that's not how the world works.You won't put up a poll because you know you won't like the result because it won't be an echo chamber of the opinion you hold so dearly, so instead you'll pretend anyone who remotely likes the game is a mindless simpleton with no higher brain function while you hold yourself up in the clouds with you're clearly "superior" intellect and you're belief in your own righteous indignation. Of course, you'll accuse me of being a "BioDrone" because I'm not just sitting around shitting all over a product 24 hours a day that you yourself could not possibly make any better, regardless of you're possible belief to the contrary.
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Post by lavigne on Apr 9, 2017 8:28:14 GMT
From memory, Mac was largely responsible for the ME3 ending. Carey's culpability was in letting Mac convince him that it was a great idea. He was probably blinded by his love for Deus Ex.
ME was at its best when Casey was in charge and Mac was a character writer....
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Post by Kroitz on Apr 9, 2017 9:19:54 GMT
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Post by rahavan on Apr 9, 2017 9:34:53 GMT
OP I think maybe you should just give up and leave. Obviously you aren't happy and you're just dragging yourself down. Things change in life sometimes for the better sometimes not, kicking and screaming about it won't change anything. That said I don't want that man anywhere near Mass effect again
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Post by Cassandra on Apr 9, 2017 9:37:56 GMT
You realize the disastrous ending to ME3 was written by Casey Hudson, yes? In fact, a fair portion of the more contentious story arcs were also handled and/or approved by him. While the original trilogy pulled off some amazing feats, let's not pretend it or its creator were perfect.
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Post by midasear on Apr 9, 2017 10:02:47 GMT
Look. I don't really think he fucked up the endings, to be honest. You mileage will vary. There's no may about it. He created an ending which kept people talking for FIVE YEARS. That is a sign of good writing. Not bad writing. Bad writing is like, hmmm? Wonder what Commando is doing now? WTF cares? Srsly? Why do they keep on making Alien movies? 'Cause the writing is THAT god damned good. I gotta roll my eyes at this. People still talk about Ed Woods films. But not because they were any good. The ME3 ending was pretty bad. Really dumb exposition presented in an almost comically pretentious fashion. A perfect fusion of bad storytelling, unskippable cutscenes and annoying gameplay mechanics. /shrug It was still better than what 99.9% of the people who complained about it would have come up with. It was one bad 20 minute segment in hundreds of hours of gameplay. If Casey Hudson wanted to do direct another Mass Effect game...or hell, ANY RPG-type game, I'd probably pre-order.
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Post by bakgrind on Apr 9, 2017 10:27:30 GMT
Look. I don't really think he fucked up the endings, to be honest. You mileage will vary. There's no may about it. He created an ending which kept people talking for FIVE YEARS. That is a sign of good writing. Not bad writing. Bad writing is like, hmmm? Wonder what Commando is doing now? WTF cares? Srsly? Why do they keep on making Alien movies? 'Cause the writing is THAT god damned good. I gotta roll my eyes at this. People still talk about Ed Woods films. But not because they were any good. The ME3 ending was pretty bad. Really dumb exposition presented in an almost comically pretentious fashion. A perfect fusion of bad storytelling, unskippable cutscenes and annoying gameplay mechanics. /shrug It was still better than what 99.9% of the people who complained about it would have come up with. It was one bad 20 minute segment in hundreds of hours of gameplay. If Casey Hudson wanted to do direct another Mass Effect game...or hell, ANY RPG-type game, I'd probably pre-order. Speaking for myself it wasn't just the last 20 mins of the game. ME3 started to take a nose dive right after the Tuchanka story which had more to do with that dastardly ninja. The cheesiest villain that we've all grown to love... Kai Leng. Every scene with that guy was in is cringe worthy. I was ready to forgive the games short comings, but that ending wouldn't let me. A better approach to the ending would of been would of been with Shepard and Anderson best seats in the house scene that took accumulated EMS into account and would of gave you an ending based on your total war assets.
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Post by mmoblitz on Apr 9, 2017 10:30:47 GMT
I don't want him back either, but at the same time I don't want the Andromeda team anywhere near the next one, if there is another one.
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Post by ApocAlypsE on Apr 9, 2017 10:31:54 GMT
Is this that bad that you want the man responsible for the one of the most glorious fuckups in gaming history to be back in here?
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Post by shechinah on Apr 9, 2017 10:52:30 GMT
Look. I don't really think he fucked up the endings, to be honest. You mileage will vary. There's no may about it. He created an ending which kept people talking for FIVE YEARS. That is a sign of good writing. Not bad writing. Bad writing is like, hmmm? Wonder what Commando is doing now? WTF cares? Srsly? Why do they keep on making Alien movies? 'Cause the writing is THAT god damned good. No, it is not. Where on earth does this idea even come from? The idea that something being talked about for years is definite proof that it's good? The Room is not considered to be a film with good writing: it's considered to be a film with bad writing and that's why it's remembered and talked about even years after it's release. People still discuss Twilight and Fifty Shades of Grey not because they consider either to be a example of good writing but because they consider it an example of bad writing that can be used to educate would-be writers on what not to do when writing. Why do I have a feeling that you'd consider Mass Effect: Andromeda to be an exception to this claim of yours if it is still talked about years from?
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Post by blaw on Apr 9, 2017 11:08:12 GMT
I think Andromeda desperately needed someone like Casey Hudson. Someone with experience who knows how to make a coherent, somewhat consistent work of art/game. He would never be okay with that uninspired soundtrack and no music in the game. All the games he worked on had focus, whether you like the games or not, but I know what Kotor, ME1, ME2 and ME3 are about. I have no idea what Andromeda is suppose to be, what it wants to be, what it wants the player to do and feel. ME 2 had big missions to get the crew ready, ME3 had big missions to get your potential allies ready, Andromeda...? You can argue getting the habitats ready to support outposts, but the missions/quests are to short and without real effort (granted they come in huge quantity) to see a real focus there. The same goes for the main story which was obviously cut short for sequels. Those are pacing and focus issues that I don't think would be there if Casey Hudson was in charge. An experienced director would have said: Look we are trying to many things, we need to cut some things. Whether it is the many boring pointless buswork quests in favor for more substantial sidequests or the open world elements in favour of a longer mainstory.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2017 11:35:32 GMT
Is this that bad that you want the man responsible for the one of the most glorious fuckups in gaming history to be back in here? That's pretty desperate, isn't it?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2017 11:46:35 GMT
A few weeks ago you were in another thread telling us you were done with Bioware and Mass Effect, and now you are here whining like a little kid. It is ironic how most of you consider us Bioware fans to be precious snowflakes, yet we are the ones that have to tell you to get over it. So here i am saying - Get over it! Casey left a long time ago, for what reasons we'll probably never know and he is not coming back.
I don't hold any grudge towards Hudson or Walters over the ending. EA took Drew away to work on Swtor, and Mass Effect 3's development was shafted by EA aswell. 18 months for the biggest game in the franchise was not enough. So here we are with what we got. I see Andromeda as a spin off on the original trilogy, it doesn't hurt it by existing and it is something new for many people that wanted more, but different.
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Post by therevanchist25 on Apr 9, 2017 11:47:45 GMT
I think Andromeda desperately needed someone like Casey Hudson. Someone with experience who knows how to make a coherent, somewhat consistent work of art/game. He would never be okay with that uninspired soundtrack and no music in the game. All the games he worked on had focus, whether you like the games or not, but I know what Kotor, ME1, ME2 and ME3 are about. I have no idea what Andromeda is suppose to be, what it wants to be, what it wants the player to do and feel. ME 2 had big missions to get the crew ready, ME3 had big missions to get your potential allies ready, Andromeda...? You can argue getting the habitats ready to support outposts, but the missions/quests are to short and without real effort (granted they come in huge quantity) to see a real focus there. The same goes for the main story which was obviously cut short for sequels. Those are pacing and focus issues that I don't think would be there if Casey Hudson was in charge. An experienced director would have said: Look we are trying to many things, we need to cut some things. Whether it is the many boring pointless buswork quests in favor for more substantial sidequests or the open world elements in favour of a longer mainstory. There is no question better direction was needed, but I'll disagree Casey Hudson is the guy for the job. My personal preference would be Josh Sawyer, but sadly that is an impossible dream.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2017 11:49:13 GMT
There is no question better direction was needed, but I'll disagree Casey Hudson is the guy for the job. My personal preference would be Josh Sawyer, but sadly that is an impossible dream. I think Ian Frazier the lead designer for Andromeda, could do a good job as project director. He seems to know Mass Effect, and is always very dedicated in his work. It would make sense to promote from in house anyway. I want Walters back as a character writer, he is pretty decent at that, no matter how much people hate on him.
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Post by therevanchist25 on Apr 9, 2017 11:54:33 GMT
There is no question better direction was needed, but I'll disagree Casey Hudson is the guy for the job. My personal preference would be Josh Sawyer, but sadly that is an impossible dream. I think Ian Frazier the lead designer for Andromeda, could do a good job as project director. He seems to know Mass Effect, and is always very dedicated in his work. It would make sense to promote from in house anyway. I want Walters back as a character writer, he is pretty decent at that, no matter how much people hate on him. As much as I've come to loath Mac since ME2 onward, He is a fairly nice character writer. He is much like George Lucas in many ways. He works best, in a group, with other people to filter his ideas. George is an awful "People" Director. What is George good at? well it's quite simple, this.
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Post by guanxi on Apr 9, 2017 12:03:00 GMT
It's alright we've got BIG MAC.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2017 12:21:04 GMT
There is no question better direction was needed, but I'll disagree Casey Hudson is the guy for the job. My personal preference would be Josh Sawyer, but sadly that is an impossible dream. I think Ian Frazier the lead designer for Andromeda, could do a good job as project director. He seems to know Mass Effect, and is always very dedicated in his work. It would make sense to promote from in house anyway. I want Walters back as a character writer, he is pretty decent at that, no matter how much people hate on him. I agree. Mac wrote some very good characters, I think Garrus and Wrex were his area in ME1. So he definitely helped create and shape them up. However, his take (or the Mass Effect team, in general) that characters are a lot more important than story is BS to me. You can't have one without the other. Should be treated equally well. Let him make his characters, but bring Karpyshyn back for the bigger picture. We can only dream, right? PS. I think creating Alec Ryder, the most interesting character in Andromeda for me yet, and killing him in the first hour was a great mistake. He should've stayed back in the Nexus giving advice for us through the game. I'd rather the Archon had captured him instead of our sibling. It would make a great character arc, imo. Garson was a wasted opportunity as well.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2017 12:30:25 GMT
Please come back to BioWare. Please. God, these morons are destroying your legacy. Please don't tell me that Mass Effect was a fuckup that placed it at eye level with Star Wars. Lore wise, storytelling wise, scientifically, just please god come back. Someone here wants more of *Artistic Fucktegrity*
While Casey Hudson has indeed added good stuff to the series, he is also the one who allowed such cockblocking ending for Mass Effect 3, that prevented Mass Effect 4 from happening. No wonder, they had to pull off contingency plan called Mass Effect: Andromeda to get the franchise out of stasis...
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Post by Sailears on Apr 9, 2017 12:30:29 GMT
And to think everyone used to blast him for the ending of ME3 and wished he was gone ... The guy is basically the brainchild of two of the greatest RPG's of all time (KOTOR and Mass Effect series), and with a single "mistake" (keep in mind not everyone hated the ending), people wanted him gone. People make mistakes, and obviously development of the games was a team effort, but as executive producer, it was Casey's vision which formed the basis for Mass Effect. I think we can all agree that vision lead to some extraordinary gaming, even with the flaws. I honestly wish he stayed, but what can you do? He chose a different path, and I can't blame him for it. I wish him the best of luck for his current work on Microsoft's Hololens, and I hope it innovates the industry in the same way he did for KOTOR and ME. Yeah, spot on.
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