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Post by Ieldra on Apr 14, 2017 14:47:58 GMT
....not that she hasn't got a few stupid lines of autodialogue here and there, particularly in the prologue ("Milky Way rules"), but I observe that I'm always fine with the options I get when a decision is required, that a decision always makes sense in the context of the situation rather than being shoehorned into a two-dimensional morality, and that the lines Ryder gets to explain it make sense as well. I've even had an unexpectedly perceptive line once.
I haven't tried all possible options of course, and maybe things fall apart if you use emotional responses more often, but I do have the option of playing Ryder as a person who thinks things through when she should, with a smattering of cockiness and banter, and that actually comes across most of the time, and always when I consider it important. I just wish she'd be more curious here and there, when I think she should ponder an obvious question but doesn't because - so it appears to me - the writers couldn't think of a good answer.
Anyway, I'm pleased with my protagonist, more than I ever was with Shepard, and that after 1.8 playthroughs. I do wish for more roleplaying options and less autodialogue here and there, but most of the time what I get is fine. Note that I don't listen to what people say in combat. I'm too occupied to listen at those times. Maybe there's something stupid there, but if so, it's easy to ignore.
What do people think of Ryder and their character expression options? I've heard it said that the different options tend to be too similar, but I find this hard to evaluate since obviously, you can't use more than one option at the same time, and since I've always been satisfied so far, I never reloaded to try something else. With Shepard I did that so often that I lost count.
No thanks to the paraphrases, though. They're more often completely useless than in the MET, and in some cases so bad I'd be embarrassed to even think that. I recommend not switching the tone indicators off. They're often the saving grace of the dialogue wheel.
Also: Paragon/Renegade: good riddance!
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Garo
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition, Dragon Age The Veilguard
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Post by Garo on Apr 14, 2017 14:58:29 GMT
Shepard was shaped by my decisions, Ryder has one personality and I just choose with what emotion he/she will answer. Role playing wise it's weak. As a character Ryder is fine, but it's not what an RPG is about.
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Pyrceval78
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Burninating the thatched roof cottages.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
PSN: Pyrceval78
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Post by Pyrceval78 on Apr 14, 2017 14:58:33 GMT
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Post by vonuber on Apr 14, 2017 15:13:46 GMT
Ryder is definitely less stupid that Shepard.
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Post by Revan Reborn on Apr 14, 2017 15:17:48 GMT
It's less about the intelligence of Ryder and more about his personality. I just love his witty, impulsive behavior with the constant quips. Shepard was just stale more often than not. He had the occasional funny moment (mostly in the Citadel DLC), but Ryder is just more laid back and really enjoys what he's doing. I can just relate to Ryder more, so he's a more fleshed out character in my eyes.
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Post by wereleopard58 on Apr 14, 2017 15:26:55 GMT
The Citadel DLC is still the best thing ever lol. I do love making my Ryder more of a sarcastic, yet caring little shit. I rarely use the professional replies g.
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Post by aglomeracja on Apr 14, 2017 15:30:52 GMT
Ryder is also more badass than Shepard given that he\she didn't give 2 shits about his father dying and goes straight to cracking jokes while fighting very bad Kett.
No nervous system whatsoever, real space-psycho!
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Exile Isan
N3
You must gather your party before venturing forth.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
XBL Gamertag: ExileIsan
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Post by Exile Isan on Apr 14, 2017 15:31:17 GMT
I'm just going to point out that if you select the emotional dialog instead of the logical one (We're the aliens here?) then Ryder will not say the stupid Milky Way Rules dialog.
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Post by Ieldra on Apr 14, 2017 15:36:51 GMT
I'm just going to point out that if you select the emotional dialog instead of the logical one (We're the aliens here?) then Ryder will not say the stupid Milky Way Rules dialog. Thanks for the info. Not that I have any idea what ties this stupid stuff to your conversation choice, in-world. I wonder, though: do your choices often influence autodialogue? Like in DA2?
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Post by Fredward on Apr 14, 2017 15:38:08 GMT
Intelligence and wit is for sissymen with low T OP. /s
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cypherj
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by cypherj on Apr 14, 2017 15:38:34 GMT
Ryder's personality never changed, and the dialogue was pretty much four different ways to say the same thing.
You were forced to accept a large degree of disrespect in this game without a means to for example tell Tann or Addison STFU, I've proven myself, show me some respect.
Or when your crew walks out on you during a meeting and you're sitting there looking all pitiful saying I didn't say the meeting was over. Where was the option to say get back here I was not done talking, I'm the Pathfinder, you're on my ship.
Then if your crew wanted to say respect is earned not given, or you didn't earn being Pathfinder, it was given to you. Fine, would have made a better game, because Ryder's carefree attitude seemed to rub off on the crew as well.
They needed more interrupts or conflicting responses (didn't have to be paragon/renegade), not just one response said four different ways. It's always black and white with Bioware. If something didn't work to a lot of players they get rid of it completely rather than trying to fix it.
Edit: And most of the time it wasn't even four options, it was two.
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kaind
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Post by kaind on Apr 14, 2017 15:39:53 GMT
Bruh, Ryder doesn't know what adenosine is..
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liquidsnake
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Post by liquidsnake on Apr 14, 2017 15:40:10 GMT
I like the new dialogue system. I liked the old system for those games, but I'm glad they changed it for the new character. I love this game. I think Ryder is a great protagonist that can have a variety of personality types depending on the situation. I don't ever feel like I'm going to be punished for going against my "typical" personality type of the character which is in line with real life as well. People who are typically sarcastic and don't take things seriously aren't like that at all times. People who like to joke can still be serious and act professionally. Obviously we all know the Renegade/Paragon system and how you could be punished for choosing back and forth by the game's end. I never feel that based on the situation I'm going to be hurt for choosing a particular option.
I'm not sure if autodialogue changes based on your preferred personality... I have read that it does but I can't confirm it. I usually go with casual/emotional because I like having a sarcastic and young protagonist in the vein of John Sheppard from Stargate Atlantis or Nathan Drake in Uncharted. Scott typically utilizes these same types of lines in autodialogue too that would sound very out of place for a professional and logical playthrough.
Also you can have your character express interest in science, which is great. Shepard was pretty much a soldier first and never really involved or interested in the sciences. Ryder can actively express that he is interested in science. I was on Voeld and an Angara female was speaking about me and a block of ice they had extracted from the ground and I was able to tell her that I was, in fact, interested in science and she was surprised and said something like "I hadn't heard that about you" which was a cool addition. Despite being a jokester, he does favor science and the first cryo pod I unlocked was for mining and the outposts on the worlds have a scientific edge. It's what the initiative is about in a large part, in my mind.
Overall I like the new dialogue options. I think it adds a fun new flavor that's different from what we've had before. Different is good. If we were playing as Shepard, I would want the old system back and I would be very disconcerted if this new system was in place for him. It would be.... weird and feel wrong for the character. This feels right for Ryder, in my opinion.
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ArabianIGoggles
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Origin: d8lock
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Post by ArabianIGoggles on Apr 14, 2017 15:45:30 GMT
Maybe so, but Shepard could have drastically different personalities. With Ryder, everybody is the same.
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lavigne
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by lavigne on Apr 14, 2017 15:54:53 GMT
I'm totally fine with Ryder.
I was also totally fine with Shepard.
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Post by decafhigh on Apr 14, 2017 15:58:54 GMT
Less stupid? Uh no. :noo:
But I like Ryder and I think Ryder has much more room to grow as a character over several games, assuming of course Ryder comes back.
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Post by wereleopard58 on Apr 14, 2017 16:07:15 GMT
I do also love Shepard. They are completely different types of character. Shepard is military through and through. He's seen so much and been through a hell a lot of crap before the first game (orphaned and in the streets, Akuze etc).
Ryder has seen a few things before the start, nothing compared to Shepard. He's a sarcastic little shit.
Shepard doesn't waste time with quips, he's there to get a job done (I do love the Citadel DLC where they took the mickey out of him).
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R1Outcast
N3
That's what she said...
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, KOTOR, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by R1Outcast on Apr 14, 2017 16:52:30 GMT
People who prefer Shepard/paragon/renegade are typically people who enjoy playing the anti-hero in games. They see Ryder as too much of a "good guy" and that turns them off. Either that, or they're used to Shepard and crew after three games + DLC and don't like change.
I don't think it has much to do with Ryder's/Shepard's intelligence.
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timebean
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It's just a game, folks...
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR
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Post by timebean on Apr 14, 2017 17:01:59 GMT
My Ryder was scientist, my Shepard was an N7. I am a scientist, my brother is a marine. Me/Ryder can analyze and pontificate, Shep/my bro can whoop ass. There is no way in hell I would dare call my brother or Shep stupid, when they can get shit done. I am a little biased, obviously. I do think Ryder has some clever lines and some interesting moments. I just had more fun playing Shep because...well..because I play scientist all friggen day long (and that includes using diplomacy with a bunch of strong personalities to get anything done). In a game, I just want to pretend to be a gutsy badass for once.
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Sah291
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Post by Sah291 on Apr 14, 2017 17:23:37 GMT
I haven't tried all possible options of course, and maybe things fall apart if you use emotional responses more often, but I do have the option of playing Ryder as a person who thinks things through when she should, with a smattering of cockiness and banter, and that actually comes across most of the time, and always when I consider it important. I wouldn't say so, I played an emotional/logical mix and many of the emotional lines come off as more hopeful, rather than outright emotional. Ryder sounds more optimistic and idealistic, like she really believes in the Initiative and that they will prevail in finding a home, or that it is worth not giving up hope on finding survivors, etc. One thing I appreciated was that your dialogue choices were sometimes questioned. For example when Jaal... ..Learns about the Kett and how he is really fighting his own people. Jaal is hopeful they can be saved somehow, and emotional Ryder can encourage him not to give up hope. But then Lexi will scold you afterwards for giving him false hope, since the changes are permanent.
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thelonelypoet
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Post by thelonelypoet on Apr 14, 2017 17:25:18 GMT
My only problem with Ryder was the lack of conversation choices. I so many times wanted to hear more. In the style of ME 1. As a person, Ryder was quite loveable.
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OneWomanArmy
N5
Queen of BSN
I’m a brilliant brunette with lots of blonde moments 😜
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
XBL Gamertag: Theonewomanarmy
PSN: HypnoticEyes
Prime Posts: A great deal, I'm an old timer
Prime Likes: A LOT....
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I’m a brilliant brunette with lots of blonde moments 😜
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Post by OneWomanArmy on Apr 14, 2017 17:27:34 GMT
Ryder is a teenager... Shepard was a grownup....
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Post by Ieldra on Apr 14, 2017 17:31:50 GMT
My Ryder was scientist, my Shepard was an N7. I am a scientist, my brother is a marine. Me/Ryder can analyze and pontificate, Shep/my bro can whoop ass. There is no way in hell I would dare call my brother or Shep stupid, when they can get shit done. I am a little biased, obviously. I do think Ryder has some clever lines and some interesting moments. I just had more fun playing Shep because...well..because I play scientist all friggen day long (and that includes using diplomacy with a bunch of strong personalities to get anything done). In a game, I just want to pretend to be a gutsy badass for once. Nothing wrong with whooping ass. Not the style I prefer, but that alone doesn't make you stupid. I wouldn't have called Shepard stupid if it hadn't come at a cost in simple, everyday intelligence in scenes where I couldn't avoid it showing, and even where Shepard should know better, namely in military matters. Shepard was a soldier, but an N7 special ops commander, not a stupid grunt. He shouldn't have acted like a stupid grunt, and even less without my approval. Ryder's scenes mostly don't have that high tension that was more or less standard in ME2 and ME3, even in talks with team members, and I can see why people might miss that. It should be possible to have the best of both worlds, but if I must choose, I'd rather have someone like Ryder.
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cypherj
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by cypherj on Apr 14, 2017 17:36:22 GMT
People who prefer Shepard/paragon/renegade are typically people who enjoy playing the anti-hero in games. They see Ryder as too much of a "good guy" and that turns them off. Either that, or they're used to Shepard and crew after three games + DLC and don't like change. I don't think it has much to do with Ryder's/Shepard's intelligence. Don't know if I agree with this. A lot of people probably played Paragade or Renegon, however you want to say playing a mixed game and like having the option of, I can be diplomatic in this instance or I can tell someone how I really feel in another. I also would like the option to play a Ryder that felt the need to grow up and mature quickly after having all of that thrust on them, or one that felt regardless of their age and experience they deserved respect or to be treated as an equal. You don't have these options in the game.
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Post by Ieldra on Apr 14, 2017 17:36:37 GMT
Ryder is a teenager... Shepard was a grownup.... ....which you wouldn't know from Shepard's lines. Shepard's prevalent tone suggests experience, but his lines often suggest an 80-IQ private. Meanwhile Ryder is inexperienced, and that shows in her prevalent tone and you can't opt out of it, but she's mentally more mature than her inexperience would suggest. Well, as long as you don't attempt to romance Suvi.
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