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Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2017 9:05:36 GMT
Well I really liked his romance because of how much his character grows through the course of the game. Which of course he does regardless if he´s involved with Ryder or not; but if romanced it´s really something else to see how she helps him regain his confidence and self worth. It's the kind of character development that really makes a lasting impact, or at least it did for me. I mean I loved the fact that they grew together from friends to lovers, but also that they evolved as individuals as well. To me it seems like they helped each other become something more, and to battle with their own inner demons knowing the other one would still be there. Which in Jaal case is particularly important considering he got burned in the past. Jaal in many aspects felt young but as the story evolves so does he; so much so that the sense of inexperience and uncertainty disappears. He is emotionally open and for me that made him come across as a very honest individual. In the beginning he seemed to have low confidence and a general uncertainty about his place in the world. He genuinely thought that he was unworthy or not as talented as his siblings; she helped him see things differently. Which is very endearing. And yes, before you ask; I'm a hopeless romantic.
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Post by Amirit on Apr 29, 2017 10:05:02 GMT
Interesting. So far the only "Solas" comparison I saw on forums was about Reyes (though, in that case similarity even less striking if it exists at all).
One more thing about Jaal's romance - it makes sense story-wise. Like, you do can romance Zevran or Fenris, but Alitair and Anders are more plot relevant and their romances feel more "default".
There are strange people out there (me included) who at least ones like to follow ... how to call it... original idea? main plot line? the story developers meant to tell? Something, that feels "very right and intended". To continue analogy with DAO - the story was written for a Human Noble (with all family tragedy involved). It's not my favorite PT, it's not how I usually play the game, but no matter how great other origins are (and they ARE great) HN remains to be THE story and everything else - a very nice addition, written after the real one was finished.
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Post by evermind on Apr 29, 2017 11:28:56 GMT
I'm Alistair and Cullen fangirl, but not Jaal. This time he's not for me. Maybe because of the voice. It sounds too old enough to be my dad, even an old man Evfra sounds hotter and younger than him. His slow talk pattern quite annoys me too. And 'too much sweetness' in his romance somehow can't make me swoon.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2017 14:02:22 GMT
Interesting. So far the only "Solas" comparison I saw on forums was about Reyes (though, in that case similarity even less striking if it exists at all). One more thing about Jaal's romance - it makes sense story-wise. Like, you do can romance Zevran or Fenris, but Alitair and Anders are more plot relevant and their romances feel more "default". There are strange people out there (me included) who at least ones like to follow ... how to call it... original idea? main plot line? the story developers meant to tell? Something, that feels "very right and intended". To continue analogy with DAO - the story was written for a Human Noble (with all family tragedy involved). It's not my favorite PT, it's not how I usually play the game, but no matter how great other origins are (and they ARE great) HN remains to be THE story and everything else - a very nice addition, written after the real one was finished. The Solas compassion was before we knew who Jaal really was, and boy do I agree about Reyes though!
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Post by SecondLight on Apr 29, 2017 16:37:23 GMT
It sounds too old enough to be my dad, even an old man Evfra sounds hotter and younger than him. His slow talk pattern quite annoys me too. And 'too much sweetness' in his romance somehow can't make me swoon. Bless this thread for bringing out all the sensible people I mean, people who share my opinion
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Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2017 18:13:34 GMT
Well I really liked his romance because of how much his character grows through the course of the game. Which of course he does regardless if he´s involved with Ryder or not; but if romanced it´s really something else to see how she helps him regain his confidence and self worth. It's the kind of character development that really makes a lasting impact, or at least it did for me. I mean I loved the fact that they grew together from friends to lovers, but also that they evolved as individuals as well. To me it seems like they helped each other become something more, and to battle with their own inner demons knowing the other one would still be there. Which in Jaal case is particularly important considering he got burned in the past. Jaal in many aspects felt young but as the story evolves so does he; so much so that the sense of inexperience and uncertainty disappears. He is emotionally open and for me that made him come across as a very honest individual. In the beginning he seemed to have low confidence and a general uncertainty about his place in the world. He genuinely thought that he was unworthy or not as talented as his siblings; she helped him see things differently. Which is very endearing. And yes, before you ask; I'm a hopeless romantic. Summed it up perfectly! Cathleen said Jaal grows with the Pathfinder, so a romanced Jaal feels even more bonded to you, and you actually see them grow in their romantic relationship too. They go from shy and awkward teens in the first blush of love to a man and woman who want something deeper, and even how they act with each other matures when they commit.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2017 21:18:15 GMT
Well I really liked his romance because of how much his character grows through the course of the game. Which of course he does regardless if he´s involved with Ryder or not; but if romanced it´s really something else to see how she helps him regain his confidence and self worth. It's the kind of character development that really makes a lasting impact, or at least it did for me. I mean I loved the fact that they grew together from friends to lovers, but also that they evolved as individuals as well. To me it seems like they helped each other become something more, and to battle with their own inner demons knowing the other one would still be there. Which in Jaal case is particularly important considering he got burned in the past. Jaal in many aspects felt young but as the story evolves so does he; so much so that the sense of inexperience and uncertainty disappears. He is emotionally open and for me that made him come across as a very honest individual. In the beginning he seemed to have low confidence and a general uncertainty about his place in the world. He genuinely thought that he was unworthy or not as talented as his siblings; she helped him see things differently. Which is very endearing. And yes, before you ask; I'm a hopeless romantic. Summed it up perfectly! Cathleen said Jaal grows with the Pathfinder, so a romanced Jaal feels even more bonded to you, and you actually see them grow in their romantic relationship too. They go from shy and awkward teens in the first blush of love to a man and woman who want something deeper, and even how they act with each other matures when they commit. So Jaal was meant to be bi all along. How else can two people grow together if not erections. Cathleen wrote Kaidan so she knows man love. It all makes sense.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2017 21:55:10 GMT
It's really cute and up my alley. Too bad he isn't bi.
He basically hits the marks in what I'll want a romance to be. Guess I'm just not into bad boys or angsty romances.
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Post by LogicGunn on May 21, 2017 20:49:01 GMT
Because feels. He's surprisingly romantic, and the sex is hawt.
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Post by Mihura on May 21, 2017 22:56:29 GMT
That is the real reason.
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2017 12:22:56 GMT
Because feels. He's surprisingly romantic, and the sex is hawt. Well, we all have our ideas of romantic. For me Jaal is as prosaic as it gets, with no wanting you to shoot Akksul, his mega family, his mother (mega-groan), his concerns about him being compared against his many relatives and the nookie in a garden by the lake. For me, romantic is always unpredictable, dangerous, on the edge, dare, adventurous, and outdoorsy wilderness. I think I am pretty much settled on Reyes as the only LI that provides my brand of romantic.
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Post by LogicGunn on May 22, 2017 12:30:59 GMT
Because feels. He's surprisingly romantic, and the sex is hawt. Well, we all have our ideas of romantic. For me Jaal is as prosaic as it gets, with no wanting you to shoot Akksul, his mega family, his mother (mega-groan), his concerns about him being compared against his many relatives and the nookie in a garden by the lake. For me, romantic is always unpredictable, dangerous, on the edge, dare, adventurous, and outdoorsy wilderness. I think I am pretty much settled on Reyes as the only LI that provides my brand of romantic. I find Reyes false, whiny and a bit of a creep. I do like variety when it comes to LIs. I'd love a tussle with the Iron Bull. Rawr! And my god how I wish Jack had been available for femShep!
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2017 12:59:02 GMT
Well, we all have our ideas of romantic. For me Jaal is as prosaic as it gets, with no wanting you to shoot Akksul, his mega family, his mother (mega-groan), his concerns about him being compared against his many relatives and the nookie in a garden by the lake. For me, romantic is always unpredictable, dangerous, on the edge, dare, adventurous, and outdoorsy wilderness. I think I am pretty much settled on Reyes as the only LI that provides my brand of romantic. I find Reyes false, whiny and a bit of a creep. I do like variety when it comes to LIs. I'd love a tussle with the Iron Bull. Rawr! And my god how I wish Jack had been available for femShep! I thought Jack's romance would be uber-cool, but ended up really trite and boring. That was my biggest disappointment in ME2/ME3, the game I overall liked very much. I actually found it more interesting/emotional-stirring that Jack turned into a phantom and Shepard killed her, than her romance. In this respect, Jaal and Jack are very much alike - I was totally crazy about their characters before I romanced them. Which is the inverse of what romance usually aims for. But, it is a bit unfair to Jaal, tbh, because I was crazy about his pre-release info, and just never really got to like him in the game. A lot of it is obviously put on the VA I dislike, but his dialogues/character is not my cup of tea. Again, my brand of romance would have been Akksul and Jaal also having a romantic undertone to their rivalry and the ability to pick Akksul after the confrontation. Akksul is what I thought Jaal would be like based on the pre-release. The only character I like in DA:I romantically is Dorian, despite the huge variety on offer, but Trespasser really killed that romance for me as a relationship (still love Dorian himself to bits). For a couple of games (DA2 and ME2/3), BioWARE and I were in sync for what we consider romantic and what constitutes dreamy males, but the bonanza ended with Inquisition. I do like Reyes, but they did better for me in SWTOR with similar out of party character romances.
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Post by LogicGunn on May 22, 2017 13:26:43 GMT
I find Reyes false, whiny and a bit of a creep. I do like variety when it comes to LIs. I'd love a tussle with the Iron Bull. Rawr! And my god how I wish Jack had been available for femShep! I thought Jack's romance would be uber-cool, but ended up really trite and boring. That was my biggest disappointment in ME2/ME3, the game I overall liked very much. I actually found it more interesting/emotional-stirring that Jack turned into a phantom and Shepard killed her, than her romance. In this respect, Jaal and Jack are very much alike - I was totally crazy about their characters before I romanced them. Which is the inverse of what romance usually aims for. But, it is a bit unfair to Jaal, tbh, because I was crazy about his pre-release info, and just never really got to like him in the game. A lot of it is obviously put on the VA I dislike, but his dialogues/character is not my cup of tea. Again, my brand of romance would have been Akksul and Jaal also having a romantic undertone to their rivalry and the ability to pick Akksul after the confrontation. The only character I like in DA:I romantically is Dorian, despite the huge variety on offer. For a couple of games (DA2 and ME2/3), BioWARE and I were in sync for what we consider romantic and what constitutes dreamy males, but the bonanza ended with Inquisition. I do like Reyes, but they did better for me in SWTOR with similar out of party character romances. Akksul would have been a very interesting romance arc, and definitely something new. It's something I hope for future games, an antagonist that becomes a LI. Or even just a friend. Dorian was a fun companion, but I didn't play as a malequisitor so I never romanced him. I enjoyed watching the romance on youtube though. I like how he tried to play it cool but was obviously more interested than he wanted to admit. He had a fantastic VA to pull that off. He was 2 parts tiger, one part kitten. I thought from the pre-release info that I was going to hate Jaal and Peebee but I actually like them a lot. People were swooning over the pictures of Jaal and I thought he looked a bit silly tbh. But he was nothing like I expected him to be and his emotional honesty was refreshing in a video game. Still don't want to romance Peebee, but I like her. As far as LI voices go, Thane will always me my favourite. Siha. Shiver me timbers. It's all in the delivery.
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Post by Amirit on May 22, 2017 13:45:13 GMT
I do like Reyes, but they did better for me in SWTOR with similar out of party character romances. Dims to me we are both a targeted audience of David Gayder with his characters, but may I ask what do you mean by "SWTOR's romances outside party character"? Aside from a couple flings for selected few classes I do not recall anything like that.
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Post by ashkevronangel on May 22, 2017 14:03:01 GMT
Because feels. He's surprisingly romantic, and the sex is hawt. Well, we all have our ideas of romantic. For me Jaal is as prosaic as it gets, with no wanting you to shoot Akksul, his mega family, his mother (mega-groan), his concerns about him being compared against his many relatives and the nookie in a garden by the lake. For me, romantic is always unpredictable, dangerous, on the edge, dare, adventurous, and outdoorsy wilderness. I think I am pretty much settled on Reyes as the only LI that provides my brand of romantic. I would happily trade you Reyes for Jaal, because all of the things that turned you off of Jaal are things I'm starved for in gay romance options. I'm still waiting for an option as sweet-natured as Jaal's. Hell, still waiting for a KISA, period.
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2017 14:14:08 GMT
I do like Reyes, but they did better for me in SWTOR with similar out of party character romances. Dims to me we are both a targeted audience of David Gayder with his characters, but may I ask what do you mean by "SWTOR's romances outside party character"? Aside from a couple flings for selected few classes I do not recall anything like that. Gaider is love or hate for me. I hated Anomen and Morrigan, and Alistair disappointed in the end with my not being able to keep my character as a lover, but whatever. In SWTOR, I found that both Skavak's affair that goes throughout the whole Act I, and Numen Brock's romance on Balmorra were by far better and more interesting liasons than everything the in-party romances had to offer with their "let's go on a date, let's kiss, let's get married". About the only in-party relationship I liked were Vette and Ashara. Obviously, I loved Zenith to bits, but he was not a full romance. I thought Hunter was great as well in Act 3 of the IA, except that however did not record one (!) line of dialogue as to not spoil the entire experience for a female PCs in favor of males, and turn it from "WAY COOL!" into a "tee-hee, gotcha!" is not my favorite person. I am just not someone who looks for a sequence that goes through the RL motions. I like my romantic interactions happen during the quests and high risk situations in the game. So, out of party romances IF they go on through the game are a big deal for me. That's why DA2 overall is the best game imo for romances, with Anders' and Sebastain's offering the perfect blend of being both a joinable and action-related romance AND a clear rivalry of both the ideals and PCs favor. Throw in Fenris in the mix who is rivaling ANders more acutely, but is not plot-important, and it's my gamegasm. I am playing Reyes' one very differently than I normally would do a game by "clearing" the full planet. Instead, I do an encounter on Kadara dealing with Reyes, then my Vasco runs away to do anything not to think of Reyes before just being pulled back to Kadara. In this respect Andromeda is better than SWTOR because it allows you to proceed with other tasks before completing the planet.
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2017 14:19:45 GMT
Well, we all have our ideas of romantic. For me Jaal is as prosaic as it gets, with no wanting you to shoot Akksul, his mega family, his mother (mega-groan), his concerns about him being compared against his many relatives and the nookie in a garden by the lake. For me, romantic is always unpredictable, dangerous, on the edge, dare, adventurous, and outdoorsy wilderness. I think I am pretty much settled on Reyes as the only LI that provides my brand of romantic. I would happily trade you Reyes for Jaal, because all of the things that turned you off of Jaal are things I'm starved for in gay romance options. I'm still waiting for an option as sweet-natured as Jaal's. Hell, still waiting for a KISA, period. Well, maybe that is why I gravitated to MM romances lately because they are by some reason tend to be written for adventure and uncertainty that I find tiltilating, rather than normalcy and domestic bliss that I have in spades in RL (I've been married for longer than a lot of folks playing those same games been alive). I do prefer to play a white knight throwing a protective cloak around the NPCs' shoulders myself, tbh, too, as it is so hard to get right from an NPC towards a PC. Have not seen a single male character after Bao Dur that I've adored that was attempted to be knightly.
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Post by Amirit on May 22, 2017 16:54:10 GMT
Dims to me we are both a targeted audience of David Gayder with his characters, but may I ask what do you mean by "SWTOR's romances outside party character"? Aside from a couple flings for selected few classes I do not recall anything like that. Gaider is love or hate for me. I hated Anomen and Morrigan, and Alistair disappointed in the end with my not being able to keep my character as a lover, but whatever. In SWTOR, I found that both Skavak's affair that goes throughout the whole Act I, and Numen Brock's romance on Balmorra were by far better and more interesting liasons than everything the in-party romances had to offer with their "let's go on a date, let's kiss, let's get married". About the only in-party relationship I liked were Vette and Ashara. Obviously, I loved Zenith to bits, but he was not a full romance. I thought Hunter was great as well in Act 3 of the IA, except that however did not record one (!) line of dialogue as to not spoil the entire experience for a female PCs in favor of males, and turn it from "WAY COOL!" into a "tee-hee, gotcha!" is not my favorite person. I am just not someone who looks for a sequence that goes through the RL motions. I like my romantic interactions happen during the quests and high risk situations in the game. So, out of party romances IF they go on through the game are a big deal for me. That's why DA2 overall is the best game imo for romances, with Anders' and Sebastain's offering the perfect blend of being both a joinable and action-related romance AND a clear rivalry of both the ideals and PCs favor. Throw in Fenris in the mix who is rivaling ANders more acutely, but is not plot-important, and it's my gamegasm. I am playing Reyes' one very differently than I normally would do a game by "clearing" the full planet. Instead, I do an encounter on Kadara dealing with Reyes, then my Vasco runs away to do anything not to think of Reyes before just being pulled back to Kadara. In this respect Andromeda is better than SWTOR because it allows you to proceed with other tasks before completing the planet. Ah, here it goes - I would not consider those things "romances". Though, you are flirting and get some "fade to black" screens. Still, flings, not romances. Agent on Voss ark would look more like a romance to me - at least some love talks, letters and even marriage involved. Guess, your definition of "romance" is very different to my, then. Zenith (oh, yes, I fully aware of that inhumane - in all meanings - tease on developers behalf) is not a romance at all (neither full nor partial). Not even friendship - just mutual respect of good allies. Hunter is an amazing character, and you know, I might even agree it can be called a romance in a very twisted sick ways. But Skavek... Sorry, no. It's not even a one-night-stand. How can you even count that? As of Gayder and his characters - I thought we were talking only about LI for women? Hence, did not count Morrigan or, say, Cassandra in DAI (though I happen to like both as characters). Anomen was an objective horror romance-wise (truly, I can not recall anything that dry and badly worded even in any fan-fiction) but (!) - and it's a big "but" - as a character he is well written and, most importantly, was a pre-alfa for Alistair (btw, it's not fair to blame character for game-mechanical complications, it's poorly done, agree, but all the options - from lover to marriage - are there and give additional flavor to that perfect romance). Ok, looks like assumed too much about targeted audience I take it back. (Though, about Reyes being the only true romance there we are both agree)
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2017 21:09:54 GMT
Oh, I stopped distinguishing LI for males or females a few years back, and just started making chars I like and romancing whatever romance appeals to me. Yep, I guess my definition of romance is more about being digitally in love with the character and experiencing that particular moment in a video game when you know that your protagonist is linked to this or that NPC and is in love, no matter what the game says. It sort of started at Bao Dur. Avellone (or whoever) managed to produce what to this day I consider the best love talk ever, and the only relationship that was phenomenally able to make a solid love story from the entire plot of the game. Anders comes extremely close, and, with some tinkering and putting a bit of a twist on the me3 plot, Thane. Skavak's relationship I adored because it was one of a kind full on rivalry with a subtext of potential fatal attraction there, with an infinitely statisfing finale of both of them trying to carry on the game, and PC getting the upper hand. I just knew my PC was not immune to his charm, and him telling Riggs to go stand quietly in the corner and Rigggs obeying sealed poor Riggs' fate, despite it being a game's convention and rather OoC for Riggs.
Yes, I agree, Anomen deserves the credit for being an alpha for Alistair, but Alistair getting it right and losing all the unsavoury stuff makes Anomen feel even worse than he was in hindsight. Dorian was brilliant, and if I was not told he was Gaider's I would not have believed it. But my Dorian-craze is less romantic, more to his views and sentiments he expresses, so the romance is secondary in terms of adoring the char.
Ah, well, overall, Reyes it is for Andromeda, though I am peculiarly tempted to play a Liam's girl at some point. He is the character that really just gets better with every pt for me by whatever reason. While Jaal moves more and more to the back burner.
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Post by ashkevronangel on May 22, 2017 23:00:07 GMT
I would happily trade you Reyes for Jaal, because all of the things that turned you off of Jaal are things I'm starved for in gay romance options. I'm still waiting for an option as sweet-natured as Jaal's. Hell, still waiting for a KISA, period. Well, maybe that is why I gravitated to MM romances lately because they are by some reason tend to be written for adventure and uncertainty that I find tiltilating, rather than normalcy and domestic bliss that I have in spades in RL (I've been married for longer than a lot of folks playing those same games been alive). I do prefer to play a white knight throwing a protective cloak around the NPCs' shoulders myself, tbh, too, as it is so hard to get right from an NPC towards a PC. Have not seen a single male character after Bao Dur that I've adored that was attempted to be knightly. I can get the appeal of playing the white knight to a troubled LI, Fenris is probably still my favorite Bioware LI partly because of that. But stuff like open and honest affection and being accepted by a LI's whole family? That would be amazing.
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Post by Deleted on May 23, 2017 3:44:51 GMT
Well, maybe that is why I gravitated to MM romances lately because they are by some reason tend to be written for adventure and uncertainty that I find tiltilating, rather than normalcy and domestic bliss that I have in spades in RL (I've been married for longer than a lot of folks playing those same games been alive). I do prefer to play a white knight throwing a protective cloak around the NPCs' shoulders myself, tbh, too, as it is so hard to get right from an NPC towards a PC. Have not seen a single male character after Bao Dur that I've adored that was attempted to be knightly. I can get the appeal of playing the white knight to a troubled LI, Fenris is probably still my favorite Bioware LI partly because of that. But stuff like open and honest affection and being accepted by a LI's whole family? That would be amazing. If you are into that sort of things. I felt really freaked out with the whole angara conversations about only 14 siblings and such, and when you get to Jaal's house, and it's like a huge communal hall, and everyone is looking at you and barely short of giving hoots or whatever while passing by in droves, then you sneak into his tiny room like you are 16 or something, and you just know the walls are too thin, and there is like twenty people listening in without even trying. And then his mother starts measuring you up for whatever number of offsprings she can tease out of non-angara ovaries. It's awful.
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Post by melbella on May 23, 2017 4:56:30 GMT
If you are into that sort of things. I felt really freaked out with the whole angara conversations about only 14 siblings and such, and when you get to Jaal's house, and it's like a huge communal hall, and everyone is looking at you and barely short of giving hoots or whatever while passing by in droves, then you sneak into his tiny room like you are 16 or something, and you just know the walls are too thin, and there is like twenty people listening in without even trying. And then his mother starts measuring you up for whatever number of offsprings she can tease out of non-angara ovaries. It's awful. I'm with you on the creepy mother-in-law thing. The first email was fine but they just got progressively more uncomfortable and awkward. I prefer my private business to stay private, so a nosey in-law is the last thing I want around. I get it's their culture to be like that, but that doesn't make it Sara's (or mine).
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Post by Melcara on May 23, 2017 10:09:27 GMT
I completely forgot about this thread before it was brought back from the dead, lol. Thank you all for the answers and perspectives. Jaal's still not my thing, but I guess I can kinda see it now One thing I still don't get, though: How would angaran x human reproduction work? I know that Mass Effect is not exactly one of the most scientifically accurate franchises, but still. Seems like a bit of a stretch.
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Post by Deleted on May 23, 2017 11:00:05 GMT
I completely forgot about this thread before it was brought back from the dead, lol. Thank you all for the answers and perspectives. Jaal's still not my thing, but I guess I can kinda see it now One thing I still don't get, though: How would angaran x human reproduction work? I know that Mass Effect is not exactly one of the most scientifically accurate franchises, but still. Seems like a bit of a stretch. I am sure your mother-in-law would be delighted to tell you all about the Angaran bees and Human birds. And if that fails, your ship engineer has the closest thing to a fertility goddess ME verse has to offer on a speed dial. She'd boost that batter for you.
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