ahglock
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Post by ahglock on Apr 8, 2021 13:53:23 GMT
No, its a game that should be made but made how they have been making it For a lot of people and studios, this isn't working out very well, anymore. No, a lot of people make okay games with a shit ton of bugs. The elder scrolls games have been consistently bad ass for their niche.
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eternalambiguity
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Post by eternalambiguity on Apr 8, 2021 15:49:37 GMT
Yeah, "open-world immersive sim lite" is solely Bethesda's domain.
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helios969
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Post by helios969 on Apr 9, 2021 10:10:47 GMT
I've yet to meet a Bethesda game I didn't find meh.
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dmc1001
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Post by dmc1001 on Apr 9, 2021 15:03:56 GMT
For a lot of people and studios, this isn't working out very well, anymore. No, a lot of people make okay games with a shit ton of bugs. The elder scrolls games have been consistently bad ass for their niche. It actually ends up being a strong reason to build kick-ass mods. And, as others have said, Bethesda provides the tools to do the modding, versus other studios with the same bugs and no modding tools.
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ahglock
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Post by ahglock on Apr 10, 2021 1:26:23 GMT
I've yet to meet a Bethesda game I didn't find meh. Not every game style fits everyone. Skyrim sold 10 million copies, and got both high customer and pro reviews. Bioware basically shifted to open world with DAI to try and ape them for a reason. So I suspect most people disagree.
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Post by helios969 on Apr 10, 2021 7:18:06 GMT
I've yet to meet a Bethesda game I didn't find meh. Not every game style fits everyone. Skyrim sold 10 million copies, and got both high customer and pro reviews. Bioware basically shifted to open world with DAI to try and ape them for a reason. So I suspect most people disagree. Most people are dumb.
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Post by KaiserShep on Apr 10, 2021 8:58:35 GMT
I've yet to meet a Bethesda game I didn't find meh. Not every game style fits everyone. Skyrim sold 10 million copies, and got both high customer and pro reviews. Bioware basically shifted to open world with DAI to try and ape them for a reason. So I suspect most people disagree. The problem some devs have when they try to ape this method is that they try to couple this with a tighter story focus, usually to its detriment. Something like Skyrim is mainly just a big sandbox to fuck around with for hours on end without necessarily needing a critical objective. That, and this game’s been living on the enthusiasm of the modding community to pick up the slack. BioWare took the wrong lessons from this, and executed their “open world” in a way that essentially still funnels you into the same main mission structure, only now you have to stumble about longer to get there.
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eternalambiguity
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Post by eternalambiguity on Apr 10, 2021 13:36:46 GMT
I personally don't mind games that have traditional mission design inside an open world. Mafia 2 did it years and years ago and it was fine. LA Noire did it years ago and it was fine. Final Fantasy games have been doing it since the beginning (if one disagrees with this one I'd like a more detailed explanation of what the difference is).
There are some specific things they did strangely, like the balance of story/quest content in each of the zones, as well as the "Radiant" Power fetch quests. I'm kind of split on the shards - I think the Ocularum are way too tedious.
But things like Dragons being in an actual environment are great.
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Post by sjsharp2010 on Apr 10, 2021 13:48:40 GMT
I personally don't mind games that have traditional mission design inside an open world. Mafia 2 did it years and years ago and it was fine. LA Noire did it years ago and it was fine. Final Fantasy games have been doing it since the beginning (if one disagrees with this one I'd like a more detailed explanation of what the difference is). There are some specific things they did strangely, like the balance of story/quest content in each of the zones, as well as the "Radiant" Power fetch quests. I'm kind of split on the shards - I think the Ocularum are way too tedious. But things like Dragons being in an actual environment are great. Yea hgenerally I don' tmind open world games either . I thinkDAI went a little too open bu tI think Biowaer did at least learn from that as I felt that despite the things that may or may not have gone wrong for MEA the open world section for me was not one of them as I fel tthey managed it much better. I think what needs to happen though is there needs tobe a better reason for each region to be in the game rathe rthan a simple there's a couple of shards here pick them up. But yeah the dragon fights in DAI are a lot of fun and probably on eof my favourite parts in the game.
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ahglock
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Post by ahglock on Apr 10, 2021 17:18:07 GMT
Not every game style fits everyone. Skyrim sold 10 million copies, and got both high customer and pro reviews. Bioware basically shifted to open world with DAI to try and ape them for a reason. So I suspect most people disagree. Most people are dumb. And here I was trying to keep it polite.
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Post by vonuber on Apr 10, 2021 17:49:11 GMT
Bioware need to do something good, as they are not the only studio doing strong narratively driven games with good character writing in the AAA space.
I for one was more than surprised at how strong HZD was, for example, or even Control.
Hell even AC Odessy had some decent writing and characterisation.
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eternalambiguity
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Post by eternalambiguity on Apr 10, 2021 18:24:18 GMT
Bioware need to do something good, as they are not the only studio doing strong narratively driven games with good character writing in the AAA space. I for one was more than surprised at how strong HZD was, for example, or even Control. Hell even AC Odessy had some decent writing and characterisation. None of those are even remotely similar to a game where you have a home base, a party [you fight alongside, interact with significantly on a personal level (discussing or solving their personal issues), and can even romance], and can interact with the world lore on a role-playing and gameplay level.
Like, not even close. One isn't necessarily better than the other, they're just different games doing different things. "Narratively driven games with good character writing" doesn't capture what Bioware's doing.
Something like Spiders games (GreedFall, The Technomancer) is a better comparison but they're still not pushing those things as strongly as Bioware does.
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Post by dmc1001 on Apr 10, 2021 19:34:14 GMT
Not every game style fits everyone. Skyrim sold 10 million copies, and got both high customer and pro reviews. Bioware basically shifted to open world with DAI to try and ape them for a reason. So I suspect most people disagree. Most people are dumb. Thanks for calling me dumb. Anyway, Bethesda has more modding possibilities than any other games I know of. Which is a selling point for me and a huge reason why I have little interest in consoles.
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Post by KaiserShep on Apr 10, 2021 20:33:15 GMT
Bioware need to do something good, as they are not the only studio doing strong narratively driven games with good character writing in the AAA space. I for one was more than surprised at how strong HZD was, for example, or even Control. Hell even AC Odessy had some decent writing and characterisation. Yeah, there’s a good few examples of games that have character writing that give BioWare a heck of an uphill battle to compete with. This is probably the thing I’m concerned about most.
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helios969
N4
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Post by helios969 on Apr 11, 2021 9:17:42 GMT
Thanks for calling me dumb. Anyway, Bethesda has more modding possibilities than any other games I know of. Which is a selling point for me and a huge reason why I have little interest in consoles. Yeah, sorry about my rudeness...wasn't really directed at you and more about me feeling snarky. I do always find it interesting that Bethesda gets much love for releasing bug-machines yet Bioware gets crushed for having relatively few...probably where my comment was really directed.
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ahglock
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Post by ahglock on Apr 11, 2021 14:30:37 GMT
Thanks for calling me dumb. Anyway, Bethesda has more modding possibilities than any other games I know of. Which is a selling point for me and a huge reason why I have little interest in consoles. Yeah, sorry about my rudeness...wasn't really directed at you and more about me feeling snarky. I do always find it interesting that Bethesda gets much love for releasing bug-machines yet Bioware gets crushed for having relatively few...probably where my comment was really directed. It is because of the type of game. Even when open world MEA like say an assassin creed has very few break points in comparison. They really are just big maps, it could just as easily be a corridor shooter like ME3. Elder Scrolls makes everything intractable, freaking silverware, every person is there in full, walking around having lives. The first style you actually can and should be able to catch the majority of the bugs, the second it would be impossible. Near sandbox open world vs big map open world just are completely different animals.
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Post by dmc1001 on Apr 11, 2021 16:05:34 GMT
Thanks for calling me dumb. Anyway, Bethesda has more modding possibilities than any other games I know of. Which is a selling point for me and a huge reason why I have little interest in consoles. Yeah, sorry about my rudeness...wasn't really directed at you and more about me feeling snarky. I do always find it interesting that Bethesda gets much love for releasing bug-machines yet Bioware gets crushed for having relatively few...probably where my comment was really directed. I know. That's my snarkiness at work. You could tell from my comments afterward that I wasn't starting a flame war. I do get frustrated with some of the bugs in Bethesda games. However, as a PC gamer, I can actually use a console command to skip past a bug. So say you have to do A B C D E F G as part of a quest. C has a fatal bug and there's no way around it. It's only a side quest so NBD but still annoying. Get into the console, force it to consider C is done and then move onward. BioWare bugs can be game breaking. He's my current ME2 run: Multiple times trying to get past the Archangel mission but it would crash every time Garrus handed me the sniper rifle to look through the scope. This happened so often that I gave up on playing for like a year. A few times trying to get through Kasumi's loyalty mission because it crashed just as I was about to go outside and face Hock, as well as when Kasumi was about to disable Hock's gunship shields. Then, the last one before I gave up last night, was just after Grunt agreed to join me and I was going to show him I had a gun pointed at him. These are major issues. If we had similar console access in BioWare games it would be fine. We don't. That said, the MET is my favorite game series ever.
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Post by helios969 on Apr 11, 2021 20:49:09 GMT
BioWare bugs can be game breaking. He's my current ME2 run: Multiple times trying to get past the Archangel mission but it would crash every time Garrus handed me the sniper rifle to look through the scope. This happened so often that I gave up on playing for like a year. A few times trying to get through Kasumi's loyalty mission because it crashed just as I was about to go outside and face Hock, as well as when Kasumi was about to disable Hock's gunship shields. Then, the last one before I gave up last night, was just after Grunt agreed to join me and I was going to show him I had a gun pointed at him. These are major issues. If we had similar console access in BioWare games it would be fine. We don't. That said, the MET is my favorite game series ever. Weird. The only bugs I've encountered that are "game breaking" would be ME1 Noveria black boxed figures and the Kasumi crash at the end...and it does irk me that EA/Bioware cannot be bothered to fix such glaring issues. I've encountered the Noveria one on at least 7 different computers (there's an easy albeit unsatisfying fix with the console enabled)...the Kasumi crash I have to add something along the lines of no movie startup but I forget where. Maybe I've just been lucky. I remember people just screaming about MEA and the only thing I ever really encountered were long loading times on Voeld when I died...yet I could load from a manual save point with no issue (never really understood that one). I definitely think Bioware/EA haven't done themselves any favor with their stance on modding...even though it eventually happens anyways.
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sentinel87
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Post by sentinel87 on Apr 11, 2021 22:24:26 GMT
I don’t know what to vote for here honestly.
Perfect world for me is a complete hard reboot of the series set in the Milky Way and a continuation of ME:A. Basically pull a Star Trek with their Prime and Kelvin timelines. Though I can see how this would confuse a lot of casual gamers causing Bioware/EA to shy away from this idea.
Overall I prefer the Milky Way setting vastly over Andromeda, but the ME3 endings still loom over any possible sequel there. I’m not sure how they can pick up the disparate endings to ME3 in a way that is satisfying to whatever ending players picked. Hence the whole reason the series moved to another galaxy in the first place.
I would enjoy a sequel to ME:A though. There are so many little story bits I’m interested in. Who is the Benefactor, Ryder’s mother and Meridian all have my interest.
The teaser back in December sort of hints that they intend to have stories ongoing in both galaxies. I’m not sure how they could merge those two story lines in a good way so I think they should be kept separate.
ME is in such a weird place and it all comes back to the endings. I think a hard reboot would get rid of the thing they have to keep writing around.
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Post by dmc1001 on Apr 11, 2021 23:15:37 GMT
BioWare bugs can be game breaking. He's my current ME2 run: Multiple times trying to get past the Archangel mission but it would crash every time Garrus handed me the sniper rifle to look through the scope. This happened so often that I gave up on playing for like a year. A few times trying to get through Kasumi's loyalty mission because it crashed just as I was about to go outside and face Hock, as well as when Kasumi was about to disable Hock's gunship shields. Then, the last one before I gave up last night, was just after Grunt agreed to join me and I was going to show him I had a gun pointed at him. These are major issues. If we had similar console access in BioWare games it would be fine. We don't. That said, the MET is my favorite game series ever. Weird. The only bugs I've encountered that are "game breaking" would be ME1 Noveria black boxed figures and the Kasumi crash at the end...and it does irk me that EA/Bioware cannot be bothered to fix such glaring issues. I've encountered the Noveria one on at least 7 different computers (there's an easy albeit unsatisfying fix with the console enabled)...the Kasumi crash I have to add something along the lines of no movie startup but I forget where. Maybe I've just been lucky. I remember people just screaming about MEA and the only thing I ever really encountered were long loading times on Voeld when I died...yet I could load from a manual save point with no issue (never really understood that one). I definitely think Bioware/EA haven't done themselves any favor with their stance on modding...even though it eventually happens anyways. Noveria wasn't game breaking but it was annoying. There was a mod that got around it but it looked terrible. By the time a better mod came around I got a new PC with Intel and vowed to never again go with AMC (which was the problem). Guarantee it's fixed for the LE. It's possible the Origin overlay is the problem, but it didn't used to be. Same with a mod for change of uniform, but that used to not be an issue. I have one non-negotiable nod (see my avatar for more info) but it hasn't shown any impact.
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Post by dmc1001 on Apr 11, 2021 23:34:45 GMT
ME is in such a weird place and it all comes back to the endings. I think a hard reboot would get rid of the thing they have to keep writing around. Vote Red, obviously. Lol Anyway, I can't see what a hard reboot would offer. Do I want to see Commander Shepard take on a lesser threat? I do not. Do I want to see Shepard take on the Reapers again? Nope. Do I want to see Shepard take on a Reaper-level threat? No. I almost hate to say it, but the kett proper (rather than a rogue faction) might be the balance. It would require scrapping the MET and MEA. Not sure it would fly with most people.
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Post by Phantom on Apr 11, 2021 23:44:06 GMT
ME is in such a weird place and it all comes back to the endings. I think a hard reboot would get rid of the thing they have to keep writing around. Vote Red, obviously. Lol Anyway, I can't see what a hard reboot would offer. Do I want to see Commander Shepard take on a lesser threat? I do not. Do I want to see Shepard take on the Reapers again? Nope. Do I want to see Shepard take on a Reaper-level threat? No. I almost hate to say it, but the kett proper (rather than a rogue faction) might be the balance. It would require scrapping the MET and MEA. Not sure it would fly with most people. Well If we had a soft/hard reboot of Mass Effect, I would replace Shepard with a New Player character for the Milk Way. I am a fan of Shepard.
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Post by themikefest on Apr 12, 2021 13:48:26 GMT
Vote Red, obviously. Lol Anyway, I can't see what a hard reboot would offer. Do I want to see Commander Shepard take on a lesser threat? I do not. Do I want to see Shepard take on the Reapers again? Nope. Do I want to see Shepard take on a Reaper-level threat? No. I almost hate to say it, but the kett proper (rather than a rogue faction) might be the balance. It would require scrapping the MET and MEA. Not sure it would fly with most people. Well If we had a soft/hard reboot of Mass Effect, I would replace Shepard with a New Player character for the Milk Way. I am a fan of Shepard. I would replace Shepard with the Honorable Mr. Rupert Gardner, the greatest chef in the universe. The trilogy will be about him leading a squad into enemy territory to get the one ingredient he needs to make his new dish.
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Post by Phantom on Apr 12, 2021 17:50:51 GMT
Well If we had a soft/hard reboot of Mass Effect, I would replace Shepard with a New Player character for the Milk Way. I am a fan of Shepard. I would replace Shepard with the Honorable Mr. Rupert Gardner, the greatest chef in the universe. The trilogy will be about him leading a squad into enemy territory to get the one ingredient he needs to make his new dish. Being on more of a serious note, my Cerberus Phantom Commander is the type of man would become good friends with him and Kelly Chambers.
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dmc1001
N7
Biotic Booty
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: ferroboy
Prime Posts: 77
Posts: 9,941 Likes: 17,668
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by dmc1001 on Apr 12, 2021 18:33:34 GMT
Well If we had a soft/hard reboot of Mass Effect, I would replace Shepard with a New Player character for the Milk Way. I am a fan of Shepard. I would replace Shepard with the Honorable Mr. Rupert Gardner, the greatest chef in the universe. The trilogy will be about him leading a squad into enemy territory to get the one ingredient he needs to make his new dish. No doubt that's what he was doing during ME3. Dodging husk, Reapers and stupid mercs along the way.
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